Dear Arizona Game & Fish,

[oz31p]

Back off the wagon I guess

[Flatlander]

20 hours ago, naturebob said:

Flatlander ,That is a Imature statement, By far, I know You wanna be somebody in the hunting world,be my guest. Put Your Kid on TV and in magazines . Why should a Kid get an advantage over a Person who has led the way for these kids? All I am asking for is a level playing field. And if I wasn't sick 2 years ago on my hunt I would of killed a much bigger Buck. But I wouldn't have been in magazines or Videos . heck I killed a Great Buck in 1 day at 62 years old sick as a dog. When I was your age I would have made You look like a turtle. And I had 2 Sons  Who didn't want to hunt and I didn't force them. They are Successful  Bussiness men today , and Great Human beings.  Thats all care about. I never put My Wife or Mom or Dad in for the draw either. Thats where I think it is BS. I know You don't like Me Junior and thats good. By the way I never had Pneumonia I ended my hunt Quick so I didn't get it.  Get your FACTS straight before you talk kid. Keep beating me up if You want , It will just show your immaturity, I won't respond as I am just giving My opinion. Talk all the crap You want..Really no need for Your post as this is an open Forum and I am Merely giving My opinion . You already gave Yours and I responded...............Happy Hunting .....................BOB 

Ok, ok relax I was just rattling your chain Bob. I would be through the roof excited if we killed a buck like yours.

No TV stars or trophy hunters in this house. Just a bunch of average, meat hunting, shmucks. Heck everyone knows I killed a dink on my 3C archery hunt. 

[Outdoor Writer]

20 hours ago, Flatlander said:

In 1965 how many bp’s did it take to draw a Kaibab tag?

Something else I failed to mention in my other reply: hunter could tag a buck or a doe, and if I recall there was only one season for the 2000 permits.

And it was ironic you picked 1965; that was the year I killed this one just a short ways off the Eastside Game Trail above the flats. 

[Flatlander]

4 minutes ago, Outdoor Writer said:

And it was ironic you picked 1965; that was the year I killed this one just a short ways off the Eastside Game Trail above the flats. 

Nice buck Tony. The year was sort of random... 1965 was the year my dad turned 17, so the last year he would have been eligible for youth permits (had they existed and had he lived in AZ). It was basically just a way to distinguish between opportunity available to his generation and that available to our current youth.

Its eye opening when you realize how much opportunity has declined in such a short period of time. 

[Hoss50]

1. Muzzleloader should be more traditional. I personally would like it to be a no optic/magnification allowed. Hunt with black powder or black powder substitute only for propellant. 

2. Leave the BP system alone. Nothing is better. The old guys waiting 20 years for tags is a choice. They know the game, and chose to play it. Having a shot at drawing any tag at any time with the current system is what makes it fun. Nobody would play the lottery if only the people playing it the longest won. 

3. Fix point guard.

4. More officers and better enforcement.

5. Serial poachers should never be able to hunt again. 3 strikes and you are out. 

6. More in person hunters safety classes, and make hunters safety or some kind of conservation class a requirement to hunt big game. The class should include info about staying on open roads, firearm safety, common courtesy, ethics, etc.

7. I am sure there are more. 

[Outdoor Writer]

22 minutes ago, Flatlander said:

Nice buck Tony. The year was sort of random... 1965 was the year my dad turned 17, so the last year he would have been eligible for youth permits (had they existed and had he lived in AZ). It was basically just a way to distinguish between opportunity available to his generation and that available to our current youth.

I was 24 when I killed that buck. My oldest son shot the doe when he was 10.

22 minutes ago, Flatlander said:

Its eye opening when you realize how much opportunity has declined in such a short period of time. 

Hmmm, I think it's more of mixed bag, so to speak. There are way more elk tags now than back then. Same for sheep, including the addition of the RM variety. Pronghorns are a tossup. As for deer, the permit numbers are down somewhat if compared to the average years during the later 19##s but leaving out the years when we had a windfall because of the heavy rains. And of course, the youth permits of today have greatly increased from 0 back then. 

That said, I feel the "decline" is more related to the increased demand, i.e. more people applying, especially non-residents.

[knothead]

18 hours ago, idgaf said:

I'd like a primitive muzzleloader season.  

 

Squaring points imo is the hunting equalivant to inflation. 

Not trying to be argumentative but why a separate season for primitive muzzy hunt?  You can hunt any style you want on our current muzzy hunts and our rifle hunts.  As it is right now the critters get almost no time to relax and live like normal animals from end of August to end of January.  There is practically a hunt of some sort going on every weekend in the fall.

[knothead]

Just now, Outdoor Writer said:

I was 24 when I killed that buck. My oldest son shot the doe when he was 10.

Hmmm, I think it's more of mixed bag, so to speak. There are way more elk tags now than back then. Same for sheep, including the addition of the RM variety. Pronghorns are a tossup. As for deer, the permit numbers are down somewhat if compared to the average years during the later 19##s but leaving out the years when we had a windfall because of the heavy rains. And of course, the youth permits of today have greatly increased from 0 back then. 

That said, I feel the "decline" is more related to the increased demand, i.e. more people applying, especially non-residents.

I agree.  A lot of people fail to take into consideration numbers of people we have today compared to decades ago.  In 1965 AZ population was 1.6 million and today just shy of 7.3 million.   We are supposed to grow by another million by 2030.  With the advent of social media and lots of online resources NR's are definitely venturing out of their home states.

 

[Hoss50]

14 minutes ago, knothead said:

Not trying to be argumentative but why a separate season for primitive muzzy hunt?  You can hunt any style you want on our current muzzy hunts and our rifle hunts.  As it is right now the critters get almost no time to relax and live like normal animals from end of August to end of January.  There is practically a hunt of some sort going on every weekend in the fall.

I personally don't want a separate primitive season, I think all the muzzy hunts should be more traditional. No optics or magnification, and black powder or substitute only. 

They are making muzzle loaders now that shoot smokeless powder and have effective accurate range of 300-400+ yards. That was not the intention of the hunts. If you are shooting one of those high end muzzle loaders you are basically shooting a brassless Ruger #1. 

[LifeFeedsOnLife]

On 7/24/2020 at 12:56 PM, ThomC said:

You have the perfect right to write to the G&F with your brilliant ideas.  The web site is AZGFD.COM.  Every year after the draw people who did not get drawn will come up with changes to improve THEIR chances to get drawn.  LOL😷

In the commission meetings I've watched I rarely see hunters there advocating for anything. 

[ThomC]

When Kali implodes, the pop. of AZ will double or triple the leftists, and we will be screwed.  😷

[oz31p]

Just now, ThomC said:

When Kali implodes, the pop. of AZ will double or triple the leftists, and we will be screwed.  😷

Once the California govt collapse and all the people move, I’ll be moving to California. 

[muledeerarea33?]

3 minutes ago, Hoss50 said:

I personally don't want a separate primitive season, I think all the muzzy hunts should be more traditional. No optics or magnification, and black powder or substitute only. 

They are making muzzle loaders now that shoot smokeless powder and have effective accurate range of 300-400+ yards. That was not the intention of the hunts. If you are shooting one of those high end muzzle loaders you are basically shooting a brassless Ruger #1. 

Slipper slope on that issue. Should archery be long bow only since modern bows will kill at 100+ yards? Or rifle seasons be capped to 300 yard shots and under? If that’s your opinion then that’s fine but restricting one thing can lead to other restrictions.

[knothead]

10 minutes ago, Hoss50 said:

1. Muzzleloader should be more traditional. I personally would like it to be a no optic/magnification allowed. Hunt with black powder or black powder substitute only for propellant. 

2. Leave the BP system alone. Nothing is better. The old guys waiting 20 years for tags is a choice. They know the game, and chose to play it. Having a shot at drawing any tag at any time with the current system is what makes it fun. Nobody would play the lottery if only the people playing it the longest won. 

3. Fix point guard.

4. More officers and better enforcement.

5. Serial poachers should never be able to hunt again. 3 strikes and you are out. 

6. More in person hunters safety classes, and make hunters safety or some kind of conservation class a requirement to hunt big game. The class should include info about staying on open roads, firearm safety, common courtesy, ethics, etc.

7. I am sure there are more. 

1. Kind of like putting toothpaste back in the tube.  It is out now and they ain't going back in.  Looking back, I believe this is a mistake G&F made.  It is hardly a primitive weapon anymore.  This is why game and fish needs to be proactive with regard to crossbows or crossguns.  They should never be allowed during an archery hunt.  Muzzy or rifle season yes but not during archery season.  Arrow needs to be held back by human power 100% of the time and not allowed to be in a locked position.  Too many people are already abusing this rule already.

2.  Ding Ding Ding We have a winner.  I could not agree more.

3. some tweaking but not a complete overhaul could help reduce point creep.

4. Always can use more law enforcement.

5. Definitely room for improvement here.  Serial or multiple animal poachers need much harsher consequences such and lifetime bans.  In the very least fines should be multiplied by a factor of 10.

6.  Education is always a good thing.

 

[ThomC]

Just now, muledeerarea33? said:

Slipper slope on that issue. Should archery be long bow only since modern bows will wound at 100+ yards? Or rifle seasons be capped to 300 yard shots and under? If that’s your opinion then that’s fine but restricting one thing can lead to other restrictions.

I fixed it for you.