Anyone know the family washed away in Tonto Basin?

[firstcoueswas80]

23 minutes ago, Flatlander said:

They post those stupid “barricades” every time there is water in that wash, knowing full dang well that people have to cross there. heck the barricade is nothing more than a portable sign they put on the road. The water was calf deep on Saturday but it was supposedly closed and all 60 homeowners who live over there were supposed to drive clear to the Young road and back to get in and out of their homes. Because of calf deep water. So pretending that they had all this warning and should have known better because of a dang sign is dumb. He should have known better cause he is a native Arizonan and has spent a lot of time in Tonto Basin. But Gila County pretending that they were protecting anybody with their fake barricades is ridiculous. To say you are going to put someone away for decades because of that is crap.

So, if this family would have followed the instructions implied by the barricades, would 3 children have died?

No?

That's called protection. 

[Flatlander]

5 minutes ago, firstcoueswas80 said:

So, if this family would have followed the instructions implied by the barricades, would 3 children have died?

No?

That's called protection. 

Sure. How about if every county in America just decides social distancing is great and they tell everyone they are only allowed to go to work and the grocery store for the rest of forever. That would be great protection, right? Wouldn’t that prevent a lot of traffic deaths? And reduce annual flu deaths? So let’s just post a sign that says if you leave your house you are endangering your family, and if you leave, if anything happens we will charge you with manslaughter.

[Ohthatguy]

27 minutes ago, Flatlander said:

 To say you are going to put someone away for decades because of that is crap.

Agree 100%!   That will never happen.

If the prosecutor wants him/them to do that much time, and the facts are anything close to what I believe them to be, I will personally put up 5K to help with atty fees. 

[AZBIG10]

This topic is tough.

I always have the thought when I take my kids into rattlesnake country if they get bit it ismy decision to subject them and my risk assessment I own that. Would they go if they knew the risk?

 

with this event I feel the county shares the responsibility for the loss. If I go to a public recreation area and report unsafe or IDLH to the facility. They have an obligation to mitigate the situation. As it was reported and they were aware of the danger. The community had to adapt to the lack of response by the county and drive across to maintain and thrive. No different than when they post roads as not maintained enter at your own risk.

Lastly there is a stupid motorist law but should there be a malfeasance or nonfeasance county law?

[AZBIG10]

I recall waaaay before this event a guy being washed away in his tractor. I believe in 1998 circa 

[wildwoody]

Backhoe, 3 people very sad

[NoBull350]

42 minutes ago, Flatlander said:

They post those stupid “barricades” every time there is water in that wash, knowing full dang well that people have to cross there. heck the barricade is nothing more than a portable sign they put on the road. The water was calf deep on Saturday but it was supposedly closed and all 60 homeowners who live over there were supposed to drive clear to the Young road and back to get in and out of their homes. Because of calf deep water. So pretending that they had all this warning and should have known better because of a dang sign is dumb. He should have known better cause he is a native Arizonan and has spent a lot of time in Tonto Basin. But Gila County pretending that they were protecting anybody with their fake barricades is ridiculous. To say you are going to put someone away for decades because of that is crap.

Super sad deal for sure and my heart aches for the family , But you know what they say ....Do the crime do the time . This all goes back to CWT ethics ! He made the choice to cross that creek ! Now he will have to deal with the consequences of his choice. 

[AZLance]

We are a nation of laws... you can't pick n choose what laws to enforce or who to enforce them on. In the end, he killed 3 children and now must face the consequences set out in the law.  Everyone has a sad story, we cant enforce laws on emotions.

There will be a civil suit at some time and that is where a jury will decide if the county is financially responsible for the death of these children. But right now we are talking about the criminal case against the parents.

I still feel sorry for those children who had their futures erased by no action of their own. The parents chose their own destiny. 

[Edge]

1 hour ago, AZLance said:

We are a nation of laws... you can't pick n choose what laws to enforce or who to enforce them on. In the end, he killed 3 children and now must face the consequences set out in the law.  Everyone has a sad story, we cant enforce laws on emotions.

There will be a civil suit at some time and that is where a jury will decide if the county is financially responsible for the death of these children. But right now we are talking about the criminal case against the parents.

I still feel sorry for those children who had their futures erased by no action of their own. The parents chose their own destiny. 

Don't tell Obama, couple years back he was the law.

 

[bojangles]

Pressing charges against the parents won’t bring those kids back, won’t bring closure to anyone, and won’t prevent it from happening again.  
 

it will, however, shift the blame from the county to the parents, so if there is a civil suit against the county, they won’t look so bad if they’ve already won a criminal case.  
 

if the county loses the criminal case, they will be in trouble in the civil suit.  

[Ohthatguy]

I'm curious how people feel about the non bridge issue. I don't know squat about the history of the town but when people/ranchers or whatever began to populate the area on the east side of the river, at what point does it become the responsibility of the local, state or federal government to build a bridge? I'm guessing that wash has been flooding after heavy rains long before anyone ever lived there. A news report stated the proposal to build the bridge has been around for years but the federal funding for the 20M bridge has never been approved. 

 

[AZBIG10]

3 hours ago, AZLance said:

We are a nation of laws... you can't pick n choose what laws to enforce or who to enforce them on. In the end, he killed 3 children and now must face the consequences set out in the law.  Everyone has a sad story, we cant enforce laws on emotions.

There will be a civil suit at some time and that is where a jury will decide if the county is financially responsible for the death of these children. But right now we are talking about the criminal case against the parents.

I still feel sorry for those children who had their futures erased by no action of their own. The parents chose their own destiny. 

I agree it’s no fault of the children. This is the part that is hard to stomach.

 

 

[bojangles]

7 hours ago, Ohthatguy said:

I'm curious how people feel about the non bridge issue. I don't know squat about the history of the town but when people/ranchers or whatever began to populate the area on the east side of the river, at what point does it become the responsibility of the local, state or federal government to build a bridge? I'm guessing that wash has been flooding after heavy rains long before anyone ever lived there. A news report stated the proposal to build the bridge has been around for years but the federal funding for the 20M bridge has never been approved. 

 

They’ve wanted a bridge for years.  People have been dying in that creek for years.  The government has been finding ways not to build the bridge for a long time.  People have been driving around the barricades for years, too.  It’s pretty common, to all you stone casters, pretty much a way of life for those who live over there.

[ThomC]

There are lots of places where people have to go through water when it rains to get to town.  And there are lots of people who drive thru water when they shouldnt.  That is why we have the stupid motorist law.  If you drive around barricades then you are a stupid motorist, if you kill someone then you are a criminal.  The county is not at fault.  There is no way that the government can build a bridge over every wash that a stupid motorists might try to drive thru when water is running.  By the way the government is you.  Yes it sounds cruel to charge someone with a crime when they killed their own children but they deserve it.  They cannot make someone else to blame or pay for their own stupidity.  

[wildwoody]

Well said..