Can a bullet go too fast to expand?

[MMACFIVE]

Just read in a post on a bullet failure that ...the bullet was going way to fast and went right through. He was describing bullet failure with a traditional cup and core bullet. This is something Ive read frequently in posts.

 

Ive always believed that velocity is what initiates expansion and that a bullet wont fail to expand because of too much velocity. It might over expand, but it will expand (if its an expanding bullet of course).

 

Is there any credible explanation too not expanding because of too much velocity?

[AZBull]

Ive shot a javelina in the heart with a 55gr vmax that did too much damage...out of a 223. Just saying. I dont know if there is a velocity factor but it was at 5 yards.

[STOMP442]

I think this problem occurs most when its a big heavy bullet on a broadside behind the shoulder hit. Say for example a 200 grain bullet from a 300 Win or Ultra Mag hitting a Coues deer behind the shoulder. Deer are relatively narrow and if you go in between the ribs there is really not a whole lot there to make that big heavy bullet start to expand and by the time it does start to expand (literal milliseconds) its already passed through 8-10" of deer and into the dirt behind it. Bullet design and construction plays a big part in this of course. Those with polymer tips tend to start expanding right away while others like the Bergers penetrate 3-6" before expansion starts. All we can do as hunters is strive to make the best shot possible so that if our bullet doesn't perform as expected we have at least poked a hole in something vital and the animal doesn't go far. Unfortunately, there is no bullet out there that will work 100% of the time every time. There are way too many variables to account for and animals are just plain tough sometimes.

[Hoss50]

I have had too heavy of bullet do a pass through shot before. I used a 275gr semi-Spitzer out of a 338 win mag pass right through a cow elk. The shot was at 40 yards. It was a .338 caliber entrance wound and not much if any bigger exit. I was young and learned that lesson fully that day. The elk was not lost thankfully, my dad had already hit her with a couple shots, but she was tough and didn't want to go down.

 

I don't use heavy bullets like that anymore on cow elk. They are big, but not that big. The last cow elk I had went down from 115gr Berger HVLDs. I gave her 2 shots, but found out afterwards that the first shot would have been just fine. You don't need big bullets, just the right bullets ahead good shots.

[MMACFIVE]

Th first example is where a bullet over expands or grenades because of too much velocity (on a very frangible bullet) and the next two examples are lack of expansion from low velocity.

 

I dont think its possible that a bullet will fail to expand because of too much velocity.

[MULEPACKHUNTER]

Help me with a deal we had, 270 win shooting 140 grn interlock at 100 yards went in small and came out small but big hole in offside ribs and a lot of mush between? How did it come out small and leave baseball hole in ribs? Also dang near zero blood trail

[MMACFIVE]

I would suspect that it is because of the hide stretching on the off side from the bullet impact. The hide is very elastic and tough. That is the reason you often find bullets against the hide.

 

There is video of the desert bighorn I shot of the hide stretching out a foot or more on the off side flank. We found the bullet against the hide. It actually knocked the hair off the hide where it stopped.

[firstcoueswas80]

Help me with a deal we had, 270 win shooting 140 grn interlock at 100 yards went in small and came out small but big hole in offside ribs and a lot of mush between? How did it come out small and leave baseball hole in ribs? Also dang near zero blood trail

Also very likely it was just a piece of the bullet, not the entire bullet.

[Red Sparky]

Help me with a deal we had, 270 win shooting 140 grn interlock at 100 yards went in small and came out small but big hole in offside ribs and a lot of mush between? How did it come out small and leave baseball hole in ribs? Also dang near zero blood trail

Hydrostatic shock and temporary wound cavity. What animal? if something small like a deer the forces from the temporary cavity can force a baseball hole out the other side but the bullet has hardly expanded. If you are talking an elk the temporary cavity starts shrinking before hitting the other side and you will get a 1-2" exit from the mushroomed bullet. Fascinating to watch shots into ballistic gelatin.

[Red Sparky]

Just read in a post on a bullet failure that ...the bullet was going way to fast and went right through. He was describing bullet failure with a traditional cup and core bullet. This is something Ive read frequently in posts.

 

Ive always believed that velocity is what initiates expansion and that a bullet wont fail to expand because of too much velocity. It might over expand, but it will expand (if its an expanding bullet of course).

 

Is there any credible explanation too not expanding because of too much velocity?

Not all traditional cup and core bullets are built the same. The thickness and annealing of the jacket have a lot to do with expansion. Also the jacket could be bonded to the core to keep the bullet together and retard expansion. Why is it I can get a traditional cup and core bullet for my .222 that will pretty much "blow up" in a coyote but I can get another traditional cup and core bullet that will penetrate a deer? The other thing that I have read about, mainly in handgun bullets, is a traditional cup and core hollow point bullet that plugs up the hollow point and doesn't expand.