AZGFD Ammunition Testing Event Today

[lancetkenyon]

I got a text from a fellow member alerting me to an event hosted by AZGFD in conjunction with the Peregrine Fund California Condor Restoration Project to test out various factory ammunition types in a research and informational effort to educate hunters in the use of non-lead bullets.

 

Allen Zufelt, the California Condor Coordinator w. AZGFD, and Chris Parish, the Condor Project Coordinator w. The Peregrine Fund were out there to represent and coordinate the shooting today. Both guys are avid hunters, conservationists, and sportsmen, and are truly passionate about wildlife. They did a great job of educating and putting on the event. Bringing water, donuts, and some amazing home made breakfast burritos, along with supplying targets, and all ammunition to be tested in a variety of rifles in 7mm Rem Mag and .223. Both traditional lead cup and core types, and a couple different non-lead cartridges.

 

There was a total of 12 shooters who participated today, I think 3 of us with 7 Rem Mags, and the rest with .223s, I think all of which were AR platforms, which is a fantastic sporting platform for varmints and small to medium thin-skinned large game animals.

 

The testing was done shooting 3 rounds of each type of ammo for group size to determine accuracy potential in an attempt to dispel the myth of copper bullets being less accurate as traditional lead core bullets. All were factory ammo available to anyone from local sources, (Cabela's and Sportsman's supplied the ammo). From the cheapest Remington Corelokt to some Barnes TSX rounds, and I recognized some Swift Scirocco in my group, and some Winchester Power Points too. The .223s had a combo of similar rounds. No varmint bullets were used in this testing today.

 

We had a brief meeting about range safety, etc. and a good discussion about the birds of prey lethality rate from ingesting lead fragments from carcasses and gut piles. Since the California Condor is up around the Grand Canyon, they are of big concern. Especially discussed was the topic of the voluntary use of non-lead ammunition on the Kaibab and Strip hunts in 12AE, 12AW, 12B, 13A, 13B.

 

Unfortunately, I thoroughly cleaned all my rifles last weekend. So I had cold clean bores on my rifles today. But my 7RM did fairly well for a clean bore and using factory ammo not shot in my rifle before. We shot for groups, 3 rounds per ammo type. Shoot 2 groups of 3 then let the barrel cool while we changed out targets and repeat w. 5 different types of ammo. I have not seen the data, but results collected showed copper bullets performed on par, if not slightly better, than the jacketed lead bullets. Could be a number for reasons for this, but it is as conclusive as possible with 5 ammo types and 12 shooters. I think I kept everything under 1.5" (the Swift Scirocco w. the cold/clean bore shot), with a three groups sub-MOA.

 

After shooting for groups, we moved on to hydrostatic shock testing of both types of bullets by shooting into six 1 gallon jugs of water in a row to check for penetration. Also, shooting into ballistic gel blocks. I got to shoot for the 7 Rem Mag rounds, and another shooter shot the .223 rounds. It was pretty cool, and very informative.

 

See photos below of bullet conditions after recovery, and the ballistic gel wound channel results.

 

Chris w. the Peregrine Fund lecturing on the Condor, and the issues they face.

 

Allen w. Some of the shooters

 

Shooting at the bench rest range

 

Here is the Barnes 160 TSX recovered from the 5th gallon jug of water

 

 

 

Here are a couple views of the Remington 150 Corelokt fired into ballistic gel and the wound channel

Note all of the small lead fragments that peel off the bullet during the course of the travel. 21" of penetration at 100 yards, looks like the bullet started expansion at about 2" of penetration. Most hydrostatic shock in the first 12-14" and then a path to 21".

 

 

I blew the 1st block out of the container and it hit the ground. That is the reason for the brown colored block.

 

The 150 Corelokt as it came to rest at 21"

 

 

Close up of the lead fragments

 

 

This is the .223 55gr Barnes TSX bullet ballistic gel test. The light bullet, probably somewhere around 3100-3200fps penetrated about 2-3" deeper than the 150 7mm Corelokt.

 

 

Then we switched the 7mm test. Jacketed lead 150gr. Corelokt into six 1 gallon water jugs.

This is the lead fragments recovered from the water jugs. The jacket totally separated from the lead core and the lead disintegrated, most within the first two jugs. The jacket made it to the 4th jug.

 

Here is the 160 Barnes TSX ballistic gel wound channel A full 32"+ of penetration. Looks like expansion started in about 3-4", with most hydrostatic shock in the first 12'14", then a twisted path like a broadhead the rest of the way through.

 

You can see the twisting path of the petals

 

I am not sure if the first wound channel from the 150 Corelokt helped with the path of penetration, as the 160 TSX was just above the original path.

 

The 160 TSX was poking out the back of the ballistic block after 32" of penetration, and it was facing backwards.

 

 

The 150 Corelokt jacket from the water jug test on left, the 160 TSX from ballistic gel on right

 

160 TSX from ballistic gel

 

 

Corelokt retained weight from water jug test

 

I cut out the 150 Corelokt bullet from the ballistic gel test

 

 

 

 

160 TSX Weight retention from the ballistic gel test

 

Weight retention of the 150 Corelokt from the ballistic gel test

 

The 150 Corelokt particles recovered from the water jug test

 

 

Weight retention of the 160 TSX from the water jug test

 

A huge thanks to AZGFD and the Peregrine Fund for putting on the demonstration and information. Take the photos I supplied for what they are worth.

 

My thoughts in closing. We all strive for the most accurate bullets, and best on game performance to cleanly take the game we pursue. Be it ballistic coefficient, bullet construction, accuracy, weight vs. velocity, etc. that sway your choice, for certain areas of the state, we need to consider the use of non-lead bullets to help conservation efforts. Mainly the lead ingestion from birds of prey/raptors. Especially the endangered and protected species. I don't want this to turn into a debate on which bullet is better, which bullets have issues, etc. ALL bullets can fail.

 

For me personally, I have used non-lead bullets in the past with amazing results. I switched mainly due to the less than stellar BC of those bullets, and trying to use the same load for hunting and shooting very long range for fun. Lower BC bullets do not fare as well in the long range game. But I will be starting some load development using some non-lead bullets for my rifles. Those rounds will have their place and purpose, and I will not use them exclusively. But for closer shots (500-700 yards dependent on cartridge), I would consider these a viable solution for high velocity rounds.

 

Look for load development threads once I start. Since Taylor has a 12AE late hunt, we might just get to utilize one this year on game!!!

[SWDesertRat]

Lance,

Thanks for sharing your observations and capturing with pics.

I was hoping to be an observer for the event but it didn't work out for my schedule.

[KaibabHunter]

Nice write up! I've been doing a lot of research on everything to do with my new setup I.e. Rifle (300 win mag), scope, brakes, recoil pads, and bullets. I don't call myself a gun guy so this is mostly new territory for me.

 

For bullets I've been reading a common likes/dislikes consistently it seems for lead core vs all copper. This is what I've found that seems to consistently pop up on the issue.

 

Lead core (ex. core-Lokt)

Pros: 50+ years proven deadly, inexpensive

Cons: less accurate at longer ranges (say 400+), less weight retention

Main complaint: close range failures at higher velocities (basically exploding, not penetrating)

 

All copper (ex. Barnes TTSX)

Pros: accurate factory ammo close and far (say out to 700), Tikka (my new gun) rifles really like Barnes ammo, 95% ish weight retention

Cons: expensive

Main complaint: "pencils" through animals without proper velocity on impact.

 

The above is just a synopsis of the conversations I've read online on the bullet types and how they perform, not based on personal experience. I've had Nosler partitions recommended to me to try as well as well.

 

Personally I'm leaning towards hunting with Barnes and bought 2 boxes but also got 2 boxes of Core-lokt to start with as I break in my gun. My youngest will be shooting core lokts out of his 270 win and my oldest's 7-08 shoots Hornady SST's pretty well.

 

I guess no matter what you choose, there is a compromise somewhere.

[bigorange]

Very cool. Thanks for sharing. I used Barnes (the free box with voucher plus bought some) in my .270 on my Kaibab hunt a couple years back. Very pleased with how they shot from my gun and very effective on the buck at about 250yds. Petals left a broadhead-type hole through the lungs and large exit hole. As long as my gun likes them I'll keep using them.

[ctracingraptor]

Glad you got to go, i was going to join you, but had to work. Banes has proven itself yet again, with great weight retention. Not very fair to compare a core-lokt to a vor-tx. But excellent review, i would have loved to see more copper round choices, to bad they didnt let you keep the gel lol. Great job Lance, as always.

[rancilio]

Great info. Thank you for the detailed notes and photos.

[azbow]

Nice work and write up Lance. They picked the right guy to help with this for sure. Are they giving out lead free ammo this year for the deer tag holders on the Bab?

[wildwoody]

Love my Barnes tsx's

[ctracingraptor]

They give out free ammo only if you pull a kaibab or strip tag like 12AE, 12AW, 12B, 13A, 13B

[lancetkenyon]

Yes, a free box of loaded ammo, or a box of loose bullets for reloading if you draw a Bab or Strip rifle tag.

[Mocha1545]

Great write up. Some very interesting results.

 

Thanks for sharing Lance!

[520HUNT]

Should have tested it on some Wolves

[firstcoueswas80]

I've always been super impressed with the TTSX and how they kill. Use them in Africa and two different rifles and have used them for the majority of my hunting since I found them. Although now I have switched from them for no other reason than to help at longer ranges period

[Non-Typical Solutions]

Very cool and informative post, thanks for taking the time to share all your pictures and the info.

[IA Born]

Excellent post and write up. Barnes is all I use for my hunting loads, including my daughter's rifle. When all of this first came out, the scientist in me wanted more information that included something besides ballistic gel. Ballistic gel doesn't account for what happens when bones are involved. About that time, the Minnesota DNR did an independent study of their own using sheep (euthanized). They used several different types of bullets and even used 12 gauge slugs since slug hunting is all that's allowed in several Midwestern states. The results were the same as what you documented above and what has been found, but it is a great independent study. I called the MN DNR to get a copy of that full report because I lost my original copy. I've got a copy of the 2-page summary, the full report, a peer-reviewed article published in the journal "Human-Wildlife Interactions", and the MN DNR report on non-toxic (non-lead) shot vs regular (lead) shot. if anyone wants them.