PROP 123???

[deercrazy]

my wife is a teacher, and even if the bill passes, there is no raise. Just smaller cuts to the budget. She has not had a raise in 6 years! She teaches at an A+ rated school in the west valley.

[Guest wdenike]

my wife is a teacher, and even if the bill passes, there is no raise. Just smaller cuts to the budget. She has not had a raise in 6 years! She teaches at an A+ rated school in the west valley.

 

Sounds like her Union is more worried about who their members vote for. Than keeping the kids at the top of the food chain, and paying the teachers a good wage to do the job it takes to keep the kids on top. The rest of the country has this figured out. What the heII is taking the teachers, and politicians so long to figure it out??? Hmm could it be they vote for their wallets???? I feel for ya, I just can't reach ya anymore.

 

 

 

Take care, Willie

[DesertBull]

http://www.wsj.com/articles/the-union-war-on-charter-school-philanthropists-1462139039#livefyre-comment

 

Sad.

[Str8Shot]

 

VOTE NO!

 

I bet the Gov is laughing his butt off! The AEA (teachers union) has the teachers convinced, because of fear, to take a 1 year 5% raise, then for the next 10 years just an inflation raise the years after! The gov steals the Trust money to avoid taking the State money as required in the state legislative laws. The Gov is giving less money than was in the original lawsuit. The Gov then goes and spends state money fighting the lawsuit. And now the Govs state budget wants to reduce the total budget for schools 21 million next year. UGH.

 

The teachers should strike against the Governor NOW, while we (yes I teach) have leverage, which is: (the worst funding per student/per state) against the Governor.

 

Anyone that says the schools have too much money already, have no clue what's going on. Just ask a teacher. The majority of US states spend more than 50 of their yearly budget on schools. Az is well below 50%.

 

My dads trucking retirement pension is more than a beginning teachers salary! That's sad!

 

The teachers and students do need the money, just not what the Gov is pushing for! What a joke.

This lawsuit started 5 years ago and here is where we are at. If Prop 123 gets voted down, the government has another 5 years to come up with another type of settlement. So, if it doesn't pass, that means we could potentially wait 10 years total to get money we should have had years ago. Many teachers who are close to retirement deserve to have their share now.

 

A strike would be great, however, it is May and many of us are preparing students for AP and IB exams; not to mention graduation. I am not sure if I feel comfortable spoiling seniors last weeks of high school. We did strike prior to 301 passing and I do believe walking out had a major impact - class was canceled for 2 days at the high school I worked at. Unfortunately we have 2 weeks until election day - a strike will not happen in this time period.

 

Sam That is BS smoke and mirrors ... Prop 123 is wanted by politicians because it is in essence getting them off the hook for the Millions they are to pay up that should have been going to schools period. Let me Dumb this Down for you Sam

 

I steal $10,000 a year from your paycheck for 5 years

You catch me and take me to court .. and the court says I have to pay you back all the money I took.

Then I take you out , get you drunk and strike a deal to repay you the 50K by taking it from your own 401k and tell you it is the only way you can have it any time soon ...

Now you are out 100K and none the smarter

 

There is a reason why the governor is behind this , there is a reason that Millions have been put into the coffers By Land Developers and Builders to market the bill and push it as a good option ...

 

READ THE dang THING ... There is no allocation of funds , the school administrations can do what they want with the $$$ , and trust me when it comes to raises it will be them and not teachers that get a raise .. Any person with a 3rd grade education, that actually reads the bill, can see how bad this is for schools, taxpayers , and those who want to preserve as much of our state trust land as possible.

[ThomC]

It wont help one bit to give TUSD more money they will squander it on the corrupt administration. The corrupt gilhalva mex mafia will see to that.

[Sam]

 

 

VOTE NO!

 

I bet the Gov is laughing his butt off! The AEA (teachers union) has the teachers convinced, because of fear, to take a 1 year 5% raise, then for the next 10 years just an inflation raise the years after! The gov steals the Trust money to avoid taking the State money as required in the state legislative laws. The Gov is giving less money than was in the original lawsuit. The Gov then goes and spends state money fighting the lawsuit. And now the Govs state budget wants to reduce the total budget for schools 21 million next year. UGH.

 

The teachers should strike against the Governor NOW, while we (yes I teach) have leverage, which is: (the worst funding per student/per state) against the Governor.

 

Anyone that says the schools have too much money already, have no clue what's going on. Just ask a teacher. The majority of US states spend more than 50 of their yearly budget on schools. Az is well below 50%.

 

My dads trucking retirement pension is more than a beginning teachers salary! That's sad!

 

The teachers and students do need the money, just not what the Gov is pushing for! What a joke.

This lawsuit started 5 years ago and here is where we are at. If Prop 123 gets voted down, the government has another 5 years to come up with another type of settlement. So, if it doesn't pass, that means we could potentially wait 10 years total to get money we should have had years ago. Many teachers who are close to retirement deserve to have their share now.

 

A strike would be great, however, it is May and many of us are preparing students for AP and IB exams; not to mention graduation. I am not sure if I feel comfortable spoiling seniors last weeks of high school. We did strike prior to 301 passing and I do believe walking out had a major impact - class was canceled for 2 days at the high school I worked at. Unfortunately we have 2 weeks until election day - a strike will not happen in this time period.

 

Sam That is BS smoke and mirrors ... Prop 123 is wanted by politicians because it is in essence getting them off the hook for the Millions they are to pay up that should have been going to schools period. Let me Dumb this Down for you Sam

 

I steal $10,000 a year from your paycheck for 5 years

You catch me and take me to court .. and the court says I have to pay you back all the money I took.

Then I take you out , get you drunk and strike a deal to repay you the 50K by taking it from your own 401k and tell you it is the only way you can have it any time soon ...

Now you are out 100K and none the smarter

 

There is a reason why the governor is behind this , there is a reason that Millions have been put into the coffers By Land Developers and Builders to market the bill and push it as a good option ...

 

READ THE dang THING ... There is no allocation of funds , the school administrations can do what they want with the $$$ , and trust me when it comes to raises it will be them and not teachers that get a raise .. Any person with a 3rd grade education, that actually reads the bill, can see how bad this is for schools, taxpayers , and those who want to preserve as much of our state trust land as possible.

 

 

Str8shot - thanks for dumbing down the proposition for me. I only have a 2nd grade reading level, so no wonder why I was so confused (this is obviously sarcasm, just in case you get confused). When you say "trust me it will be administrators and not teachers that get the raise" - why should anyone trust you? Do you work for a school district, do you even know anyone that works for a school district? Have you seen the agreed upon salary increases that are in writing at most school districts across the state? These pay raises are for everyone in the district, not just for administrators. These pay raises have already been approved by the school boards on the contingency that 123 passes.

 

You are 100% correct, the school districts have control over what they spend the money on; however, two-thirds of the funds are required to be spent on salaries.

 

In the end this is not the best way to handle the issues with public education in the state of Arizona and the best way to fund the money owed to the school. But, voters are silly to think that the state will come up with an alternative plan anytime soon. How many more years do educators and students need to wait to get the additional funds needed to improve our public schools.

[Str8Shot]

Sam .... Please show me any official documentation that will be filed that states that 2/3 will go to teacher salaries ... I am not going by what people say they will do , because that is how we got here in the first place ...

 

How about you look at what Prop 123 actually changes in HCR 2001 and the official language that will become law , not what they are selling it as ... Also notice that the changes over the 10 years period does not specify k-12 except for the 2016 distribution of 259 million, and any expendable earning above the 2.5 % as Basic state aid (bailing the state out of their responsibility of paying back the money the court awarded the schools)

 

I think the % of state trust money should be adjusted and teachers should be paid more, but there is no binding legal definitions in these changes that state what you claim ... Only the word of Officials and Administrators.

 

I shared the links of what prop 123 actually changes In the laws , not what people are claiming or what the ballot is selling.

 

http://www.azleg.gov/legtext/52leg/1s/laws/hcr2001.pdf

http://www.azleg.gov/legtext/52leg/1s/summary/h.hcr2001_10-30-15_astransmittedtosecretaryofstate.pdf

 

Teachers need better from the state than a band aid.

 

p.s. Not a Teacher or Administrator .. A parent who actually reads the actual laws that props like this change. I said "trust me" because History proves some things never change and School administrators are some of the biggest crooks stealing from students and teachers in this state and it has been that way since I went to kindergarten here.

[ThomC]

Sam you must be nearing retirement. YOU WANT some money now to maximize YOUR retirement. To heck with the long term. The court has told the state to pay up. That doesn't go away if this prop 123 doesn't pass. The state needs to pay up. Passing 123 will just take the pressure of the state.

 

School districts can and will move money around which ever way they want. School districts such as TUSD will not improve education no matter how much money you give them. That is the sad part of this whole thing. It is a no win situation.

[Str8Shot]

ThomC

 

It will Most Likely pass and like 90% of the things we are told by elected officials we will not se the real damage for another 8- 12 years ... They are selling it as a k-12 thing but other than the 259 million this year ( which gets the state off the hook for most of what they owe) the increase in the fund is for all beneficiaries ... People are being told a lot of things and for 2016 I am sure teachers may see a slight bump in pay. But the years to come ? I would bet on a lot of misappropriated funds being spent on the wrong people and wrong things in years 2 - 10.

 

I guess it is too much to ask for laws that state specifics allowing for true transparency and accountability when it comes to the of spending tax dollars and revenue from other sources that are there for a schools.

[DesertBull]

"The American Republic will endure until the day Congress discovers
that it can bribe the public with their own money."
-- Alexis de Tocqueville

 

"A democracy willcontinue to exist up until the time that voters discover they
can vote themselves generous gifts from the public treasury.
From that moment on, the majority always votes for the
candidates who promise the most benefits from the public
treasury, with the result that every democracy will finally
collapse due to loose fiscal policy, which is always followed
by a dictatorship. The average age of the world’s greatest
civilizations from the beginning of history, has been about
200 years." Alexander Tyler, a Scottish history professor 1787

[mattys281]

"The American Republic will endure until the day Congress discovers

that it can bribe the public with their own money."

-- Alexis de Tocqueville

 

"A democracy willcontinue to exist up until the time that voters discover they

can vote themselves generous gifts from the public treasury.

From that moment on, the majority always votes for the

candidates who promise the most benefits from the public

treasury, with the result that every democracy will finally

collapse due to loose fiscal policy, which is always followed

by a dictatorship. The average age of the world’s greatest

civilizations from the beginning of history, has been about

200 years." Alexander Tyler, a Scottish history professor 1787

 

 

This^^^^^ is exactly why we live in a representative republic and NOT a democracy. Our constitution is probably the greatest example of forethought and careful planning that the world has ever seen. Every word carefully chosen to ensure liberty, not democracy. The masses of people are generally speaking always poorly informed and most are unqualified to make decisions that will effect the entire populace. Heck, most people can't even run their own households. That's why the power of the popular vote is intentionally very limited in our government.

 

God save us from ourselves.

 

"Democracy is two wolves and a lamb voting on what to have for lunch. Liberty is a well-armed lamb contesting the vote." Benjamin Franklin

[Chris]

Teachers are not guaranteed a salary raise if Prop123 passes!

 

It is up to each district how to distribute funds.

Most districts are saying they would but ..........we'll see.

[roninflag]

Prop 123 is somewhat of a band aid, but for the next 10 years, it is all we have in this state. Yes, the state owes alot of money to the schools and the state should legally come up with this money. Is prop 123 the best way to accomplish this, probably not. But, again it is the ONLY CHOICE right now. Voting no will not force the government to come up it with an alternative. A no vote will only prevent teachers, counselors and other school district employees from getting a raise.

 

Two-thirds of this money will be used to increase salaries. It will also be used to hire more teachers, thus lowering class size. The remaining one-third will be used for building repairs and student spending. All districts have established a new salary schedule. Districts have also agreed to give current employees compensation for this year, which we were promised but never received.......maybe we should have all quit when we did not get what we were promised. Districts will also be increasing the salary of new hires. This may encourage more qualified people to go into teaching.

 

This is my 22nd year in education. I have a master's degree, taught science, history, coached numerous sports and for the past 17 years been a counselor. The last raise I saw was 7 or 8 years ago. Insurance has gone up and so has my required contribution to state retirement, so my take home pay is less now. A YES VOTE will restore some of the money the employees are owed.

 

A YES VOTE will not only benefit employees, but it will also help our students. The alternative is to vote no and sit back and hope the government comes up with another funding source. Good luck with that. A YES VOTE will also avoid raising taxes. This is the alternative, raise property taxes - how many people will like that?

 

Sorry, but I will take the raise for the next 10 years and give the government 10 years to figure things out. VOTE YES - it is good for teachers and it is good for our students!

 

VOTE YES

when the trust is depleted then what?? i already voted no.

[lancetkenyon]

My older daughter is a special education teacher. This will directly effect her. She says NO to 123, and I will too.

Bad deal for the AZ education system in thelong run. In 10 years, it will be in worse shape than it is now if this bill passes.

[Guest 300ultramag.]

All the money spent on commercials and signage should be towards the payoff. Pretty backwards deal if you axe me