STOMP442 Report post Posted December 21, 2015 Not burning as much powder for one and the design of the Ackley case itself helps keep the burn inside the case rather than the throat of the rifle. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
.270 Report post Posted December 21, 2015 Ain't no chore for a good smith to work over the bolt. I'd hafta think that .264 brass would last a lot longer than the fire formed and resized akleys. I never understood the akley deal. Blow the shoulder out. Weaken the brass. For minimal increase. I do understand wildcattin' tho and understand that part. A .264 is an overlooked and under utilized way to go. If folks tinkered with em a bit, especially with a 1:8 barrel, they'd realize the potential. I've had em up to a little over 3200 with 140's with no problems. Just a thought. Lark Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
STOMP442 Report post Posted December 21, 2015 I am willing to bet my Ackley brass will last a lot longer than standard .264 Win Mag brass. One of the major benefits to Ackley improving is minimizing case stretch. I anneal after fireforming and neck size from there without any issues at all. How much powder are you using to push a 140 over 3200fps? Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
.270 Report post Posted December 21, 2015 One thing I never do is give someone a powder charge. Sometimes I'll recomend a powder, but never a load. There's lotsa books with that kinda stuff, and they have good insurance and lawyers. The main thing is a 26" or longer barrel, compressed load and a conventional boat tail bullet right on the lands. I wouldn't try to go that fast with Berger or Barnes. A nice tight, polished target chamber helps too. Just normal stuff done precisely. Lark Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
STOMP442 Report post Posted December 21, 2015 Ok, just for the sake of making my point then. looking at a few loads listed on loaddata.com using 26" test barrels they are calling for anywhere between 63-68 grains of powder to reach max velocities of just over 3040 with 140 class bullets. Since you claim to be compressing loads I will say you are running a touch more than that. Compare that to my Ackley using only 59 grains of powder to achieve 3180 fps with a Berger even. Now there is nothing wrong with the .264 Win Mag I am never one to hate on a sweet 6.5 but, there are other options out there to get similar or near identical performance without using as much powder or having to step up to a magnum case. Now kids, remember the 6.5-06AI is a wildcat cartridge, what is safe in my rifle may not be safe in yours. Reduce loads and work up slowly. That's not so hard. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
.270 Report post Posted December 22, 2015 So I'm a liar? Winchester used to offer a factory load 140 that was advertised at 3200. I chronagraphed some and they were. I didn't start shooting last week. Sorry I offered the guy an option. Lark Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
308Nut Report post Posted December 22, 2015 Don't be sorry Lark. There are some strong personalities and strong opinions here. As for the rest of you, don't hate on me for saying that either because I will be the first to admit that I rank right up there with the rest of the strong personalities and opinions! Just gotta remember Lark that it all works. Some of us just like to split more hairs than others. If the 264WM works for you, that's awesome. If the 6.5-06AI works for C, awesome. At least we live in a time where we have so many good and viable choices. We really can nail down what works best for us without too much of a gap between what we have and what we desire. Cheers! M 2 Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
.270 Report post Posted December 22, 2015 Really pisses me off for someone to say I can't do what I know I can. heck, I useta shoot 140's outta my .270 at 3200 but I got tired of flat primers so I backed off. Winchester and remington both offered 3200 fps factory loads for the .264 at one time. I know guys that were blending powders back in the 60's and we're doing some crazy things with it. I've stacked powders before with some amazing results, but it's sorta spooky. Back in the "old days" before range finders, the best way to stretch out there and hit something was to increase velocity and straighten out the bullet arc a little. With the tech improvements in the last 20 years, that's pretty much useless now, but I still like velocity. Mainly because I get a kick outta making running shots. And I think the .264 is a great option for a lotta stuff. Use what you want md33. Just trying to give you an option. Lark Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
MMACFIVE Report post Posted December 22, 2015 Dang it, it hurts me to say this but I lean towards Lark on this one. I am a firm believer that velocity follows case capacity. The 264 Win Mag has about 10 grains or roughly 15% more capacity than the 6.5-06 AI so it should be able to push the same bullet faster with the same psi. I want to own one of those two cartridges some day and the decision will be dependent on the platform I build it on. If I re-barrel a standard length magazine it will be the 6.5-06. If I replace my 7 STW it will be the 264 win mag with the bullet seated out as far as practical. If you are exceeding the 264 WM velocities with your 6.5-06 AI I'd be willing to bet you are loading at or above 65 kpsi. If the 264 is loaded to the same psi it should produce more fps. Ok, just for the sake of making my point then. looking at a few loads listed on loaddata.com using 26" test barrels they are calling for anywhere between 63-68 grains of powder to reach max velocities of just over 3040 with 140 class bullets. Since you claim to be compressing loads I will say you are running a touch more than that. Compare that to my Ackley using only 59 grains of powder to achieve 3180 fps with a Berger even. Now there is nothing wrong with the .264 Win Mag I am never one to hate on a sweet 6.5 but, there are other options out there to get similar or near identical performance without using as much powder or having to step up to a magnum case. Now kids, remember the 6.5-06AI is a wildcat cartridge, what is safe in my rifle may not be safe in yours. Reduce loads and work up slowly. That's not so hard. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
muledeerarea33? Report post Posted December 22, 2015 Just looked at midway, seems like to go AI more than doubles or triples the cost for dies over a standard 6.5-06. I know initial investment can be high but not sure if it's worth the cost? The barrel swap will pry be 5-600ish including the barrel. Any other places to get AI or standard dies? Midway is 53 bucks. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
forepaw Report post Posted December 22, 2015 Really pisses me off for someone to say I can't do what I know I can. heck, I useta shoot 140's outta my .270 at 3200 but I got tired of flat primers so I backed off. Winchester and remington both offered 3200 fps factory loads for the .264 at one time. I know guys that were blending powders back in the 60's and we're doing some crazy things with it. I've stacked powders before with some amazing results, but it's sorta spooky. Back in the "old days" before range finders, the best way to stretch out there and hit something was to increase velocity and straighten out the bullet arc a little. With the tech improvements in the last 20 years, that's pretty much useless now, but I still like velocity. Mainly because I get a kick outta making running shots. And I think the .264 is a great option for a lotta stuff. Use what you want md33. Just trying to give you an option. Lark That's some scary stuff right there. forepaw Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
MMACFIVE Report post Posted December 22, 2015 Bob Hagel printed a book in 1978 called "Game Loads and Practical Ballistics for the American Hunter". You can still pick up copies on eBay cheap if you want a little reloading history. For many of us, at least for me, It was the bible of reloading. Bob was was ahead of his time. In Bob's book the 264WM is pushing 140's at 3180+. Lark is also right that when the 264 was announced the 140's were going around 3200 fps. Litigation/Liability and technology has sure impacted all of us. We (some of the old fogies on this forum) used to be obsessed with velocity, and 450 yards was a freaking long ways. Range Finders have really changed the game and velocity is not nearly as important. And our accuracy expectations have changed also. We use to want to shoot as fast as we could and sight our rifles in for a "maximum point blank range". MOA was good enough. On deer you could hold dead on to about 350 yards or so and just pull the trigger. The faster you went the longer the point blank range. This explains why I am still enamored with velocity! Mike Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
muledeerarea33? Report post Posted December 22, 2015 Lark, a .264 increases my smith bill for bolt face work, if it was a different gun I'd consider it. But seeing as I have everything to swap to a 6.5 except barrel and dies I figured it'd be a cheap way to have a caliber I don't have and haven't had yet. The 6.5-06 seems to be a good option and I welcome all opinions, but now this Ackley has me intrigued too. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
.270 Report post Posted December 22, 2015 He's gonna true the bolt anyway. Or should. Shouldn't be much expense to turn it to belted mag specs. The 6.5/06 looks to be a fine found. Just figgerd if you wanted something in .264 diameter I'd mention the win mag. But anytime you start rebarrelling a rifle, it ain't cheap. Just had a pre 64 model 70 , 300 h&h that some moron "ackleyized", rebarreled into a .375. 25" Shilen barrel, screw on brake with a thread protector, barrel and action cerakoted, $800. Guns are spensive. But I figger after I get done with the stock, with the grand in optics and mounts that are on it now, it'll be a $4k+ rifle too. Magnum action pre 64's are getting real rare. Good luck with whatever you decide. You could always opt for the rifle of the gods, the .270. Lark Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Titanium700 Report post Posted December 22, 2015 Even if you got the plain Jane 6.5/06 you will be happy with it. Just use an 8 twist whatever you do. I'm a .264 WM guy myself.....shoot any 6.5 trips my trigger. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
