Arrowsniper Report post Posted July 30, 2015 The reason for such interest in this story, is that it's very easy to stand or pull for either side of this story without all the facts. We put ourselves in the situation and want to pull for or against this guy. Just because I hunt, does not mean that I automatically pull for him. My big question about the facts .... It's my understanding the animal had a collar. After he shot the lion, there seem to be issues about finding this hunter? Certainly need all the facts on this story. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
JACK Report post Posted July 30, 2015 You radical right wingers are just as bad as the left. Really fo sure And what does Planned Parenthood have to do with this thread???????? Nothing really...just that people care more about a dam lion than people selling baby parts... 6 Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
venadito Report post Posted July 30, 2015 Right wingers, left wingers who gives a flying ***k... Whoever brought Planned Parenthood or the Marines that were killed has nothing to do with this issue...*There was and is a lot of outrage on social media for these issues too... This story is about a Jacka** that poached a lion...The outrage from social media is from people that don't have a clue about wildlife conservation and or hunting...Mr. Dentist gave us hunters a black eye for this one... From what I have read, the facts of this matter is that the dentist poached this lion plain and simple...Is the dentist at the mercy of his hired outfitter?...ABSOLUTELY! But I am willing to bet that this is not the first time he has hired this outfitter...Suffer the consequences... They say a man's reputation follows him everywhere...This Dentist is not a hunter he is a poacher that has been caught before, sorry no matter how he tries to spin it, he is already looked at in a negative way...Regardless of how much money he has spent over the years going on these safaris. They all tried to destroy the collar that was on the animal...Guilty! Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Guest akaspecials Report post Posted July 30, 2015 Let's focus on the crime that actually was committed; that's killing a lion in an area where there was not a quota. The guy was hunting in a foreign country where he had paid over $50,000 for a hunt. There is a fair expectation that your guide would know the boundaries of the unit and where and when he could hunt. I have hunted with guides internationally and I had NO CLUE where I am. That's why I hired a guide! They have the knowledge of local boundaries and are responsible for making sure local game laws are followed. As was said earlier: "The important thing to remember is that the professional hunter and the outfitter both knew there was no quota for lion where they were hunting. The question is, did the hunter know that, too?" Is it right to ruin this guy's life without this knowledge? Is it right that his life is now in danger due to armchair activism on social media? I would say it is absolutely wrong. What people are latching onto is that a "pet" was killed, how it was lured out of the park, and how the guy made a bad shot. Although it may be crappy, NONE of that is illegal... There is a purely knee jerk and emotional reaction to this by people with little to no knowledge of hunting. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
.270 Report post Posted July 30, 2015 this guy stepped on his crank and he's gonna get crucified over it. whatever. you go to a continent where folks are starving, and take a suit case fulla money with you and you can do anything you want. he shot a collared cat that was watched closely by folks with authority, and probably bleeding hearts too. look at the guy that shot the big elk in the subdivision in show low? how smart was that? he had a big time guide and everything. pissed off the neighborhood for shooting their pet and he got hammered. he can play dumb and cry all he wants about his ph and everyone else, he was there and he knew better. hel l there are photos of him with the dead lion. he didn't see the collar then? i've read for years that there are only 2 kindsa lions left in africa, the ones raised in captivity and realeased for some rich guy to shoot, and the ones in parks. some friends went to africa a few years ago and the ph had a buncha lions in a big enclosures. had one giant with a spectacular mane. he had every female he owned in with him to get em bred because a guy was flying in and gonna pay a 100grand to shoot it in a few days. guys like bill that actually shot a wild, eat your face off lion back in the day are real lucky. them days is gone. if you're gonna hunt, hunt. i really don't care one way or the other what happens to the guy, other than the stain that huggers try to put on all hunters over it. spending a lotta money doesn't make something acceptable. and this guy didn't spend all that cash in order to benefit conservation. he did it to show how cool he is and brag to his buddies. that's why they have all the photos of it that he posted online. the thing that bugs me worse than all this crap is that the media says nothing about selling dead baby parts but they are all over this like a fat drunk at the strip club. Lark. 3 Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
WampusCat Report post Posted July 30, 2015 Whoever brought Planned Parenthood or the Marines that were killed has nothing to do with this issue...*There was and is a lot of outrage on social media for these issues too... I think the general opinion is the outrage was/is not proportionate to the events. Dead Marines / selling baby parts / potentially enabling an aggresive nuclear power vs. an old cat in a foreign land killed by an alleged poacher pumping hundreds of thousands of dollars into that foreign economy regardless of his intentions. Maybe it's just concern for a nations priorities. From what I have read, the facts of this matter is that the dentist poached this lion plain and simple...Is the dentist at the mercy of his hired outfitter?...ABSOLUTELY! But I am willing to bet that this is not the first time he has hired this outfitter...Suffer the consequences... Do you think the guy that paid big money for a Desert Sheep tag with Sonoran Outfitters is a poacher after he killed the sheep and found out the actual tag was never purchased by the outfitter. I am neither judge nor jury but see a lot of strong judgement about a guy and a lion in a scenario we really don't know much about. What did the shooter actually know regarding the legality? Did you see the dentist trying to destroy the collar? 6 Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Coues assassin Report post Posted July 30, 2015 ...Is the dentist at the mercy of his hired outfitter?...ABSOLUTELY! But I am willing to bet that this is not the first time he has hired this outfitter...Suffer the consequences... Someone beat me to the punch on this response but what about the situation of the guy that shot that sheep with Sonoran outfitters? He went back to them 2 or 3 times until the sheep incident happened. Should he have to suffer the consequences? Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
TonyC Report post Posted July 30, 2015 "Cecil" is a dang lion and pet or not.. WILL be hunted. Just like I wouldn't have a pet deer unless I made extreme precautions to exclude him from any chance of being hunted. Overall, it's hard to determine how this situation occurred and who would be at fault but just like everything.. we need to give the guy the benefit of the doubt and assume he truly didn't know where he was and so on... therefore, it would have been the guide's responsibility to create a legal and successful hunt. Unfortunately, I do not trust most of what the media states... I've experienced first hand about the media and its corruption. For example, back in Nevada, the media had stated that there was an emergency "crash landing" in a residential area however... that was a good friend of mine who just had to land SOFTLY on the street of a neighborhood otherwise he wouldn't get another chance to land for awhile. So, that turned what was a normal average-day landing into an aviation incident/emergency. Now, going back to Mr. Cecil the lion, if this lion was truly poached with the intent of fully knowing their actions.. then yes.. I would be upset however there is no saying what truly happened and the media is too far corrupted to create a reliable story. Therefore, the man should be given the benefit of the doubt. 1 Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
8OWHUNT247 Report post Posted July 30, 2015 Has he been arrested?? No, didn't think so. 1 Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
TonyC Report post Posted July 30, 2015 Has he been arrested?? No, didn't think so. That's a good point.. haha Only time will answer that i guess. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Str8Shot Report post Posted July 30, 2015 ...Is the dentist at the mercy of his hired outfitter?...ABSOLUTELY! But I am willing to bet that this is not the first time he has hired this outfitter...Suffer the consequences... Someone beat me to the punch on this response but what about the situation of the guy that shot that sheep with Sonoran outfitters? He went back to them 2 or 3 times until the sheep incident happened. Should he have to suffer the consequences? This guy was not a novice or new to Trophy Hunting Africa and while I believe it would be hard if not impossible to make any poaching charge stick to him since he can use the fact he was guided and thought it was legal, something tells me a guy that got a year probation for lying to feds about location of harvesting a bear may have had an inclination that what was happening was not 100% legit ... I know for dang sure if I am handing anyone $55,000 or even $5,000 to hunt that way I am going to see the tag and proper paperwork before day one of hunting. From all I have read about the hunter with Sonoran, he was naive and got taken advantage of, something I doubt he lets happen again. I wish I could say I thought the same way about this dentist, but for me something seems off about the whole situation... I may be wrong and honestly Hope I am , but the damage the liberals love to see is done... Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Coues Stew Report post Posted July 30, 2015 All I know Is there woudn't be any mega fauna (Big Game) left in Africa if it wasnt for Big game hunting. Its the only thing that keeps those animals from getting over hunted by poachers and in some cases such as white Rhinos has helped the population cause private land owners are willing to Have them on their land if they are going to get paid eventually due to hunting. Id like to see that park run itself without taking any Big game hunting revenue from now on. 2 Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Hunterjohnny Report post Posted July 30, 2015 Everyone is so wound up one way or the other on this. It's like all media, you are only hearing what you are meant to hear. We dont know all the facts, we just know what is being fed to us to create the frenzy. Facts have no place in current media and if you are beleiving what is posted/printed you are just being led where they want you to go. “Believe none of what you hear, and only half of what you see.” ― Benjamin Franklin 4 Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Guest wdenike Report post Posted July 30, 2015 LMAO. Excuse me now, I have to go do some more laundry. And other wash woman duties. Take care, Willie 1 Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
