billrquimby Report post Posted March 4, 2015 Jerks who steal outdoor equipment are not new. In the mid-1960s, we regularly hunted the Eagle and Chitty creek country below the rim and west of the Stray Horse campgrounds. We seldom saw anyone there in those days. At any rate, my friends and I left our entire camp -- tent, Coleman stoves, sleeping bags, tables, chairs, cooking utinsels, water, even food -- when we had to return to Tucson to work for a few days., We left on a Sunday afternoon and returned after dark the very next Friday to find everything gone! We slept in our truck that night and hunted the next day before going home. I knew George Proctor, Apache-Sitgreaves National Forest supervisor then, and when I called him he said his people would not have removed anything during a deer hunt, so our things had to have been taken by another hunter. A similar thing happened at San Carlos Lake a couple of years after that. I along with several other outdoor writers were camped at the lake when someone from another camp down the lake stole all the fishing tackle out of one of our boats during the night. There have always been crooked people. It's a shame we no longer are allowed to chop off their hands when they are caught. Bill Quimby 8 Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
CouesPursuit Report post Posted March 4, 2015 It's disappointing. You can't even talk about ethics or etiquette these days on an online forum without CPU tough guys and forum clowns chiming in with more of their useless posts. One thing that's not disappointing though, lot of 'ethical' folks on this site aren't afraid to speak their mind. It's not the distance of the shot you took on the animal if you were prepared for it, it's not the ground blind you left in good condition a couple weeks after the season ended, it's how you treat people and what you do for the big picture of hunting, assuming you care if it sticks around for your family and future generations. The clowns on this site that don't care are loud, but the quiet, lurking majority of folks reading these forums to learn are watching. Please keep posting about how you choose to be ethical, I know I will. 8 Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Havasuhunter Report post Posted March 4, 2015 Seems there are a lot of people that are confused between having your stuff out during a hunt and leaving stuff out for weeks or months at a time. The latter is the same as driving out and dumping your trash. More the population grows, the bigger the problem will become. I will never back down online or in person fighting to instill a leave no trace mentality into people. It's matters for the future of our public lands and especially hunting access. I've got no time for the,"it's all about me" hunters. The types that leave 20 stands out, put trailers in spots way in advance of the hunt, illegal baiters, etc. I'm sure I'll get attacked on this because I know some of those types are on this site. 7 Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Str8Shot Report post Posted March 4, 2015 Ethics are branches or a philosophy of self imposed rules based on what an individual or group feels is morally right or wrong/good or bad. The reality is that we do not all follow the same moral compass, and human nature often motivates individuals to push the boundaries of what is right or wrong while still justifying that an action is Ethical. This is the very reason we have rules and laws that actually define the lines in principle to what the majority of individuals would believe is morally right or wrong. This of course does not mean every rule/law is ethical or for that point right, but what makes them fair is that all should abide by them. The fact is many hunters on this site barely read the regulations, and even fewer read or know the rules of our national forests, which vary from forest to forest to some degree. When you live in a society, and are part of a group that often uses ignorance and unknowing, as an argument to justify that what they are doing is ethical and therefore right, you create chaos. You may not like walking an extra 100 yards to cross at the crosswalk, but jaywalking is illegal.. just as you may not like having less security on a trail cam, but lag bolting into a live tree is also illegal. If there is a law governing an action then the only Ethical choice is to follow the law. If you do not like the law, then start a process to try and have it changed. I am an Az native that has been in the outdoors all my life. I have packed out 100's of pounds of other peoples garbage, and cleaned up 100's of campsites over the years and No not all left by hunters, but I can tell you a fair amount have been. Also in my life, camping dozens of weekends a year from the southern border to the North, between fishing and hunting I have yet to have anything taken from a campsite. This does not mean I condone someone taking anything from the forest that is not theirs, but I also do not condone people who choose not to follow the rules/laws. Just because I am a hunter and on a forum does not mean I have to agree with any one person or the mob that sees things differently than I do... I see things very simple.. Follow the rules and laws of Public lands, lakes and Resources leave the places I hike, camp, hunt or fish in better shape and cleaner than when I arrived. Respect others and go out of the way to help if I can. (this does not mean I have to respect ignorance and individuals breaking rules/laws no matter how much they want to sell their reasoning for feeling justified) 11 Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Shedhunteraz Report post Posted March 4, 2015 I do not leave anything in the forest ever! I clean up everyone else's crap. I do not agree with people that leave blinds and stands out, but i would never take it. I have called Forrest services, you know what happens? Nothing. Firstcoueswas110: that makes me LOL. Can't I do both? Now go make me a sandwich!!! ^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^ THIS IS WHY I LOVE MY WIFE, NOW GET HER A SANDWICH AND SOME CLASS Our family enjoys shed hunting, glassing, hunting, fishing, hiking, etc. We are an outdoor family. I ( wife) am the avid shed hunter. It is a huge passion of mine, and I do it every chance I get. thats cool that you guys are happily gay in the hunting community. its pretty rare to be out about something like that. Seriously? Grow up 3 Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
.270 Report post Posted March 4, 2015 you can't legislate ethics. if you try, then we'll all hafta get another hobby. because there are a lotta folks that think hunting is unethical that will pitch in a buncha money and time and effort and legislate us, ethically, right outta the woods. call the cops sometime and tell em you saw somebody being unethical. see what they say. it'll be sorta like this, "well, did he break the law?" you say no, but he was unethical. and they say "well, that ain't against the law, therefore there ain't anything we can do. if he breaks the law, then call us back". people think other folks religions, clothes, tatoos, peircings, political leanings, dogs, etc, any number of different opinions, are unethical. just because they don't like what they do. i know folks that think bow hunters are unethical. i know other folks that think salt or bait is unethical. i know folks that think hounds are unethical. i know folks that think trapping unethical. people need to do what is right. it's usually real easy to determine if you're doing the right thing. if you ain't sure, then don't do it. but if it's legal, then do the he ll ouf of it and don't worry about it, unless you think it ain't right. and why does age make a difference if something is unethical or not? again, ethics is your opinion. hold your opinions sacred to you. but don't get whiny if somebody doesn't agree. Lark. 8 Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
trphyhntr Report post Posted March 4, 2015 I like shooting at animals with my bow from over 100 yards. Many say that is unethical. Some people think riding quads for sheds is ethical. I wouldn't pick up someone's blind but like it was said, it makes you look lazy when you leave one out all year Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
backcountry_brad Report post Posted March 4, 2015 I've said it a lot, as far as I'm concerned, if it's legal it's ethical. ethics is just a fancy word for your opinion. if a stand is legal, it's ethical. same with cameras, camping, quads, range finders, etc. if they ain't legal, they ain't ethical. anything of these things that tend to be divisive at times, as long as they are legal, they are ethical to me. there's a lotta things that are perfectly legal that i wince at, like a .25 auto being legal to hunt elk with or folks paying a dozen or so guys to track an animal down for em so they can jet in and shoot it when they get time in their schedule, take a few photos that are posted on line within minutes of the animal croakin' and then jet back out. those kinda things are legal, so i guess they're ethical. trash ain't legal. so it ain't ethical. and i don't think most of the trash we see dumped on the side of the road is done by outdoorsmen. but we sure get blamed for it. and there are a lotta mixed up things with picking up other folks trash. i picked up a buncha beer cans that some slobs were just tossing out the window on and old 2 tracker. saw a game warden later and he said something about me having an open container in my vehicle. i don't even drink. so i quite pickin' up beer cans. after this last deer season there were several campsites around our place that it looked they just drove away. beer cans, cigarette butts, cope cans, full trash bags. they were guys with tags, but not hunters. others were better than they were before the season. there are all kindsa folks. i really agree with hunters sticking together, no matter the difference of opinions. we have a lot worse things going on than cameras and tree stands. trash, human and the garbage kind, is a big problem. now, somebody make me a samwich. Lark. That's true most of the time,although,it's not always the case. For example; you can kill any bearded turkey but I don't think it would be ethical to kill a bearded hen. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
GJMauro12 Report post Posted March 4, 2015 I'm not trying to stir the pot but I don't agree with having to pull your stand every time you leave the woods and I am surprised so many people agree with this. If I am walking through the woods and find an empty tree stand I will usually climb it to see if I like where it is, check to see if its sturdy and easy to get in and out of and mark it on my GPS incase I am in the area again and want to take a break or even spend a morning or evening hunting it. The regs say first come first serve and I don't know what is wrong with me using someone else's stand that is up and not being used at the time. If they were to arrive and claim the stand I wouldn't argue anything because I know it isn't mine and i'll be on my way. I haven't used tree stands in a long time because I don't have any climbers and I hate carrying a ladder in but if I did want to set up a stand (which has never been a quick process for me) I don't want to take it down every day with as much work as I put in to setting it up in the first place. I use to leave one up year round and I would use it year round. If I am working at the cabin in July with yard work or what ever needs done and want to go sit in the tree for the evening to relax after working all day I don't want to go through the process of setting my stand back up. Even if it was my stand I walked up to and found someone sitting it I would just back out since they were there first. Maybe its because I try to avoid confrontation in the woods as much as possible but it seems to work for me. Basically my point is- I don't see a stand hanging in a tree as trash or abandoned property and where is the problem at if it is not bolted to the tree or putting any sort of stress on that tree. It is a tool that can be used however you see fit. You could be someone out bird watching, nature watching, hunting or just plain relaxing and now I am required to haul it in and out every time I want to run out and sit in a tree. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Big Browns Report post Posted March 4, 2015 I do not leave anything in the forest ever! I clean up everyone else's crap. I do not agree with people that leave blinds and stands out, but i would never take it. I have called Forrest services, you know what happens? Nothing. Firstcoueswas110: that makes me LOL. Can't I do both? Now go make me a sandwich!!! ^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^ THIS IS WHY I LOVE MY WIFE, NOW GET HER A SANDWICH AND SOME CLASS I'll take a Grilled Cheese Sandwich:) Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
.270 Report post Posted March 4, 2015 how 'bout an antlered doe? or a spike bull that broke off both antlers so low you can't tell it ain't a cow? or a young lion? or coyote pups? or a young bear? i won't shoot a spike buck. but i'm all for anyone else doing it. i won't even apply for a cow elk tag. but i'll dang sure help somebody else shoot one. i shot my last bear 20 years ago and will probably never shoot another one. could have shot a dozen of em this past year. but i have no problem with anyone else shooting one. i'll even show em where to go to find one. if that's your "opinion", then don't do it. just don't obsess about someone that does or disparage someone for doing something that's legal. i don't drink or smoke, but it's fine with me if you do. even if i think it's unwise. if it's legal, i'm fine with it, even if i won't do it myself. if it's something i can't abide by, then i'll go someplace else where whatever it is that bugs me so bad ain't taking place. i ain't too sure what the rules even are about blinds and cameras, but if someone leaves a blind or a camera in the woods, but it's legal, fine. that's my opinion. Lark. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Coues 'n' Sheep Report post Posted March 4, 2015 I pick up cans and foil balloons almost everywhere I go because it bugs me and it IS garbage. I don't care if you leave your hunting gear out there... it isn't trash and I know your coming back for it. Not sure why so many folks on here gotta hate on good folks doing nothing wrong... they are just doing it their own way (not yours). Last time I checked we all own the forest and we are supposed to be able to share it. Love how some of you feel the need to pick fights from that key board quarterback position, it is a shame, this used to be a great site with far less of the hating and self-righteous BS... 6 Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Big Browns Report post Posted March 4, 2015 it is a shame, this used to be a great site with far less of the hating and self-righteous BS... I couldn't agree more!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!! Can't we all just get along??????????????????? 2 Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
KidBowHunter Report post Posted March 4, 2015 it is a shame, this used to be a great site with far less of the hating and self-righteous BS... I couldn't agree more!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!! Can't we all just get along??????????????????? x2!!! Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Str8Shot Report post Posted March 5, 2015 I pick up cans and foil balloons almost everywhere I go because it bugs me and it IS garbage. I don't care if you leave your hunting gear out there... it isn't trash and I know your coming back for it. Not sure why so many folks on here gotta hate on good folks doing nothing wrong... they are just doing it their own way (not yours). Last time I checked we all own the forest and we are supposed to be able to share it. Love how some of you feel the need to pick fights from that key board quarterback position, it is a shame, this used to be a great site with far less of the hating and self-righteous BS... CnS You are right we all own and should share the forest . of course that includes the laws and regulations that come with said Use. As far as your statement "Doing nothing Wrong" please enlighten us on how there are not regulations on leaving personal property on public lands"owned by All" there are no abandonment time lines, there are no regulations pertaining to the cutting and defacing of live trees ... please enlighten us on why so many think that is ok to disregard such regulations since they seem so trivial and contrary to the actions they want to take ... ohhhh and while you are at it realize it is the same stupid argument used by liberals who say that people crossing our boarders are not really doing nothing wrong, they are not breaking a law , so they are not criminals..... So lets give them green cards ! the fact remains that their are regulations on how we use our public lands and Any person who decides to turn the other cheek to justify their action , while they may think they are ethical based on their own Moral compass , are breaking laws and in fact a criminal just as they feel the guy "technically not breaking a law removing abandoned property from the field" is not. While I would not engage or condone the action of taking what is not yours. I have no sympathy for someone who does not act in accordance with the rules/laws we should all adhere to, when it happens to them. I guess that idea makes the Officers with their truck bed filled with abandoned stands, chairs, tarps , and blinds are all thieves too and not just doing their job... Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
