Coueser Report post Posted February 8, 2015 Sorry for the question but I have read the AZGFD website and still am confused. I plan on putting in for an early rifle bull tag that I do not have enough bonus points for draw in the "first pass or 20% bonus Pass round" with my first choice. For my second choice, I plan to put in for an archery bull tag that I do have enough points to draw in the "first pass or 20% bonus pass round". My question is do I even have a shot at drawing my first choice or am I allocated a tag in the "first pass 20% bonus pass round" before I have a chance to draw my first choice in the "second pass - first and second hint choices round"? Thanks for any insight that you all may have on this. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Northern Pintail Report post Posted February 8, 2015 Under your scenario you do not have a chance at drawing your first choice as you will draw your second choice in the bonus pass round. 1 Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
wildwoody Report post Posted February 8, 2015 Its a lottery, heck ya you got a chance 1 Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
knothead Report post Posted February 8, 2015 Like Northern Pintail stated. You do not have a chance of ever drawing your first choice if you are in the 20% bonus round pool with your 2nd choice. Many people do not know this, even very avid hunters. A good friend of mine talked to top leadership at G&F and on the commission a few years ago about this exact situation. They know about it and have no intention of fixing it is basically what they told him. The old philosophy used to be: Put in for your dream hunt first choice and your "go to" unit 2nd. Not any more if you are in the bonus round with your 2nd choice. Many years ago we used to put 12A late rifle deer first choice and 17a 2nd. Never drew a late tag and almost always drew 17a. Once loyalty point and Hunter safety point were earned it only took 2 points to be in bonus round of 17a so in actuality we only put in for one choice, 17a. Good Luck 1 Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Coueser Report post Posted February 8, 2015 Interesting that it's set up that way. Thank you all for your input Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
wildwoody Report post Posted February 8, 2015 What , so your saying that if you don't have max points for a species put a unit you don't want to draw for your 1st, and for your 2nd choice put your dream hunt. So then in reality your only getting one chance in the first draw. Example I have 8 deer bonus points, so I put the 13b 1st choices and 12a late 2nd choice, so I have no chance at the strip, even no there are 60 tags for 13b and 20% is 12 tags so where do the other 48 tags go to or is it 20% of all tags , so 1 unit like 13 b can all go in the bonus pass. Just wondering, ya I thought I was a seasoned hunter Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
azelkhunter69 Report post Posted February 8, 2015 What , so your saying that if you don't have max points for a species put a unit you don't want to draw for your 1st, and for your 2nd choice put your dream hunt. So then in reality your only getting one chance in the first draw. Example I have 8 deer bonus points, so I put the 13b 1st choices and 12a late 2nd choice, so I have no chance at the strip, even no there are 60 tags for 13b and 20% is 12 tags so where do the other 48 tags go to or is it 20% of all tags , so 1 unit like 13 b can all go in the bonus pass. Just wondering, ya I thought I was a seasoned hunter They are not saying all of the tags will go in the bonus pass. Only 20% go in that pass. Your first and second choice are lumped together in the Bonus Pass and in the 1-2 pass. If they check your first and there aren't any tags left, they go to your second choice. If there are tags for that choice, they give you tag. These guys are trying to say that it is a waste of time to apply for a hunt for your 1st choice that WILL NOT get drawn in the bonus pass IF you put a hunt for your second choice that WILL get drawn in the bonus pass. If you can't draw your 1st choice in the bonus pass but will draw your 2nd choice in the bonus pass, you never have a chance at drawing your 1st choice so why put it down? I hope that makes sense. 1 Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
wildwoody Report post Posted February 8, 2015 Gotcha I was thinking in the 80% zone. Your talking applicants with max or close to, otherwise none as the top 20%ers Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
knothead Report post Posted February 8, 2015 WildWoody, In your scenario you do have a chance at 13B and 12A west late because you are not in the 20% bonus pass for either one. Your only chance of drawing would be after they process the bonus pass and went to everyone else to fill the remaining 80%. I know it is confusing and the first time I heard this and realized it is true, I was pissed. Now I just live with it and figure it is all part of the application game. My brother in-law has 18 resident antelope points and he told be he really doesn't want to wait for a rifle tag anymore. He asked if he should put 5B rifle first choice and an archery unit that can be easily drawn with 15-16 points second choice. If he does this, I told him he has zero chance of getting a rifle tag. Might as well put same archery hunt #'s first and second choice. Good luck Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
wapitibob Report post Posted February 8, 2015 If you only want to draw a single unit, use it as your 1st choice and don't put down a 2nd. That way, if you don't draw it in the Bonus Pass, you can't draw a 2nd choice in that pass. Then, in the 1-2 Pass you'll have multiple chances at a low draw number, based on your points, to help you draw that hunt code in the 1-2 Pass, again, without the chance to end up with a 2nd choice hunt you didn't want. The downside is you only have one hunt code, limiting your opportunity to draw. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Northern Pintail Report post Posted February 9, 2015 It always amazes me how little people know how the draw system works. 1 Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
azelkhunter69 Report post Posted February 9, 2015 It always amazes me how little people know how the draw system works. Just not that important to some people and/or they don't know how to figure it out on their own. Just look at Flatlander's post about Draw Odds...14 pages and counting. 2 Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
bonecollector777 Report post Posted February 9, 2015 Some of the most hardcore hunters I know don't understand it. It's a pretty complex process when you look at the big picture. Even after studying it and looking at the numbers it's still tough to understand it all. So when some guys have some questions I dont find it surprising at all. 2 Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
firstcoueswas110 Report post Posted February 9, 2015 i put in for the hunts that i want. am i doing it wrong? Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Sinwagon1 Report post Posted February 9, 2015 My bosses nephew never put in and got drawn last year first choice rifle bull in unit 10. It can happen Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
