and for shooting coyotes...

[macknnc]

Some of what I am reading is saying the lower end .22 centerfires, the .22 Hornet, the .222 and .223 group...are not adequate for coyotes...I really question this..I've killed foxes and bobcats with .22 LR rifles, so I personally would not hestiate to take on a coyote with any of the calibers mentioned here. I know they're most typically taken with the deer rifles, but for specialty shooting them, any reason you need more horsepower than the lower end .22 centerfires?

[rcdinaz]

I cant imagine which caliber has killed more of them than the .223... especially now with everyone using the AR platform.

 

Maybe in todays world with better rifles and optics extending ranges by a long way the 22's may be on the light side but if you are shooting them at 300 and in I cant imagine needing more. When I was doing a lot of calling I used a 22-250 and a .243. That 22-250 with NBT's would hammer a coyote dead on the spot out to 400 yds as long as I put one in the boiler no problem. There is only one level of dead so I never went looking for a more deader cartridge to shoot.

[rossislider]

Wow, I'm curious under what context someone or an article would claimed that a .223 is not adequate for coyotes. Sound ridiculous to me.

[azhuntnut]

I have shot a lot of coyotes using a 223 on an AR platform. One thing I noticed was when I got out past 350 yards, it would knock them down, but sometimes they would get up and run off. I was using 69 grain black hills ammo. I switched to a 243 wssm magnum upper and started hammering them. I now use an 87 grain vmax pushing 3450 fps. They drop in there tracks at any yardage no matter where you hit them. My buddy uses an ar10 chambered in 243 and he has the same success. David

[macknnc]

Rossislider:Interesting you would ask that. The fellow that said that was writing 40 odd years ago, and did a lot of writing but was not hopelessly addicted to the facts. George Leonard Herter. Again, though, Herter was not just 'opinionated' he was "I'm right and everyone in the known universe who disagrees with me is wrong' opinionated. And he did run, for decades, a pretty big outdoor supply company, and did have a lot of experience in the field so dismissing his theories out of hand with investigation might be a mistake. (though I did read the lower end .22 centerfires were a bit light somewhere else, I just can't find it)

 

But I am a fan of the .22 Hornet and triple deuce...and I doubt even "Mr. Big Bullet' himself, Elmer Keith, at his peak, would have claimed the Hornet, .222 and .223 as 'light for coyotes.'

[macknnc]

And looking over some more of his writings, old George didn't like any of the .22 centerfires for coyotes...which strikes me as vaguely ridiculous, considering both the .220 Swift and .22-250 have been used (with varying amounts of success, granted) on much larger game than a dang coyote.

 

George Herter is a lot of fun to read but he reminds me of my ex wife..."It's gonna take more than facts

to convince me I'm wrong!"

[rossislider]

Thanks for the info macknnc. It Looks like you have done a lot more research than I. I am going to have to look into these guys a little bit. But I would venture a guess that, in our current era, more coyotes are killed with a AR-15 (.223 or 5.56) that just about any other caliber. Also seems peculiar that many militaries around the world, our own included, find the 5.56/.223 effective for killing 150+ pound men, but that it might not be sufficient for a 30-40 pound dog.

[trphyhntr]

idk who elmer keith or george herter is, but .223 is the GOAT for coyotes. i want to get a .17 and shoot some with it.

[JLW]

that's just silly!

hunters that do it for $ even use "light loads" so they don't tear up the pelts.... and drop em dead in their tracks... with an occasional spin or 2.LOL!

 

James

[longshooter]

I've shot my fair share of coyotes with a 22 lr and 22 mag. Nothing wrong with 22 cals from rim fires to the center fires

[firstcoueswas80]

So much depends on what bullet you are using for coyotes.

 

Example:

 

I shot a coupe coyotes one day with 40 gr Vmax... One was a very little coyote, one was a pretty good size male.. One of the largest I have killed. Both took 5 rounds to the ribs at less then 80 yards before they stopped moving.

 

Same area, different day. Decent size female, about 60 yard with a 68 Hornady BTHP, pushed by IMR 4198, hit her right behind the shoulder, she yelped and ran off. I went over to where she was blood EVERYWHERE. Followed a blood trail that Ray Charles could have followed for about 30 yards and she was dead as could be.

 

I've killed probably 50 with the 50 NBT and TAC... Not a single one has made it more then 10 or so yards and that was only if gut shot, all with the .223. I have also killed another 50 or so with the tame bullet, and Varget from my 22-250 when I had it and not a single one moved after the shot.

 

So, in my experience, the 50 NBT is THE bullet for a coyote. Side note, it also handled my javelina I killed last year perfectly!

[Hyperwrx]

idk who elmer keith or george herter is, but .223 is the GOAT for coyotes. i want to get a .17 and shoot some with it.

 

It depends on a few things. Are you wanting to keep the fur? Are you hunting in a contest? Do you respect the animal you shoot so it receives a quick clean kill?

 

I have shot many coyotes with my .17 fireball. That's a 20g bullet going 4000 fps and sometimes it does not get the job done in an ethical manner. Here is a 40 yard head shot (right between the eyes if you slow the video down) and it does not drop him. Minutes later he is still moving around and I have to shot him again. I now use my .17FB only for foxes and bobcats.

 

http://youtu.be/HEOsq7zNyAQ

 

The standard in the industry for coyotes is a .223. Using a .22 is irresponsible. It hasn't the kinetic energy at 100 yards to get the job done consistently. Consistently is the key here. I'm sure if you search hard enough you can find someone who has killed a coyote with a kitchen spoon- that doesn't mean it's the right weapon for the job.

[Hyperwrx]

that's just silly!

hunters that do it for $ even use "light loads" so they don't tear up the pelts.... and drop em dead in their tracks... with an occasional spin or 2.LOL!

 

James

 

Not true. I contest hunt enough to know that nobody shoots a contest with a light load. Time is of an essence in a contest and you don't want to waste time chasing a coyote down. In typical contest hunts you don't get your coyotes anyhow so why care if the pelt is picture perfect. heck.. who cares fi you have to drag it back in 2 pieces. When I've hunted the Worlds, guys are shooting to drop them in their tracks. .223 is the minimum you'll see an accomplished contest hunter use. Generally they'll go bigger. I hunted with Les Johnson a ways back and he pulled out a .22-250 and got the job done... at a distance the .223 guys wish they could.

 

I just picked up an AR in .17 Remington from Carey Custom Rifles. Curious to see how it does on recreational coyote shooting.

[trphyhntr]

 

idk who elmer keith or george herter is, but .223 is the GOAT for coyotes. i want to get a .17 and shoot some with it.

 

It depends on a few things. Are you wanting to keep the fur? Are you hunting in a contest? Do you respect the animal you shoot so it receives a quick clean kill?

 

I have shot many coyotes with my .17 fireball. That's a 20g bullet going 4000 fps and sometimes it does not get the job done in an ethical manner. Here is a 40 yard head shot (right between the eyes if you slow the video down) and it does not drop him. Minutes later he is still moving around and I have to shot him again. I now use my .17FB only for foxes and bobcats.

 

http://youtu.be/HEOsq7zNyAQ

 

The standard in the industry for coyotes is a .223. Using a .22 is irresponsible. It hasn't the kinetic energy at 100 yards to get the job done consistently. Consistently is the key here. I'm sure if you search hard enough you can find someone who has killed a coyote with a kitchen spoon- that doesn't mean it's the right weapon for the job.

 

oh ya, i personally shoot .243 cuz i dont give a fukk about them.

[Weston]

Typically I don't like to get into caliber conversation because so much more than bullet diameter plays a role in a DRT. When I hunt predators I want a DRT, unless its a bobcat I really don't care at all about pelt damage and won't spend much time looking for a wounded predator. That said, there is a level of ethical responsibility. Although I hunt coyotes for sport and "depredation" I still don't like making an animal suffer. Which is why I rarely hunt predators with anything other than a shot gun. I've killed hundreds of song dogs and I will be the first to say that I personally feel a .223 is not an ideal cartridge for putting song dogs in the dirt. I've lost substantially more coyotes with my .223 than I have with my 22-250 or even 243..... I've played around with different loads of coyotes fairly extensivily and I'm not ashamed to say that I have little confidence in V-max bullets for killing coyotes out of an AR. I've shot hot rodded 40 grainers -moly coated 55 grainers and a ton of 53 grainers and honestly I will say I've probably had more than 30 percent of the dogs I shoot with V-max bullets that I thought I put a good shot on turn into a "non-recovery"

 

That said, I've shot coyotes with a .223 and had plenty of DRT's I have lost confidence in that caliber for being a one and done round, I typically like to hunt in terrain that is much thicker than most people consider "coyote country" and if I have a coyote run more than 100 yards in this country it takes too long to try to find.

 

Furthermore, I've found the .223 to be much too rough on cat pelts (were not even going to bring up what a .223 will do to a fox). The aforementioned experiences I have had have lead me to do one of two things, hunt with a shot gun all the time if the fur is prime and I'm targeting bobcats, Hunt with a larger or faster caliber if I'm letting cats walk and go out to put the hurt on the coyotes.

 

Obviously this is my experience and your experience may differ, but I really tried hard to like the .223 and have hunted with bolt guns and two different AR's I built specifically for hunting Ol Wiley and I have decided that for me it just isn't the caliber I would choose in hardly any circumstance, too rough on pelts on thinner skinned cats and not enough knock down to reliably kill (for me) coyotes. I do still have an AR that I built as a "walking rifle" that has been turned into my "truck gun" or the gun that goes on my quad when I'm trail caming or scouting and if I see a coyote I will shoot it, but when I go out specifically to hunt predators I take a different gun. Theres a lot of merit to Hyperwrx point of competition hunters not using .223, Scott puts down a lot of predators consistently and has for the 8 or so years I've known him and you would be hard pressed to find Arizona predator hunters with more rounded experience than he has.