mklong40 Report post Posted February 28, 2014 Anyone have any news as to why the Boquillas is closed? This is a sore subject for me and several of my buddies. I was led to believe when all this crap went down last year, we would all be able to purchase the permit (another conversation on its own) and enter the ranch. I have a friend who has spent 40 years on the Boquillas hunting, helping the ranchers, doing ranch clean up, etc. and according to the website no permits are available to enter the ranch at this time. My friend called G&F and they informed him the cattle company is controlling access now, not them. He emailed the management company running the Boquillas and they replied informing him entrance is at their discretion. Currently, all access to the ranch is closed. I went to the huntbigboranch.com site and sure enough, no permits are for sale. I try to stay as neutral on political subjects as possible but its sad to me that 250,000 acres of state trust land is cut off to Arizona Residence by a cattle company. I am confused as to the involvement of the GF last year if ultimately its the cattle company calling the shots on entering the ranch. Two final thoughts; I would like to think varminters do an excellent job at curving the predator population on the ranch. I am sure some of you knew Frank, the old timer, who was the head rancher for many years. He used to contribute the quality of Lope, deer, etc. to a collective effort of managing the predator population. I wonder what will happen to the predator population with the current closure. Lastly, when my buddy questioned his rights to enter the ranch as a resident he was informed there is consideration of banning a hunter from all state trust ranches if he/she is sited for an infraction.....this can be at the discretion of the rancher. When he questioned GF on the validity of this, they would not deny or confirm they are looking into this possibility. I am sure there are inaccuracies with my info above compared to what was approved by the GF. I am not here to stir the pot on whats right and wrong. This was my experience yesterday with my friend on the phone with GF and the cattle company. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
BRYCE CANYON Report post Posted February 28, 2014 There is an effort by most of the Northern Arizona ranchers to be issued land owner elk tags by G&F. This is just another step in that direction. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
mklong40 Report post Posted February 28, 2014 By the way; this is also not a bash the GF post. I, personally, have had far more positive experiences with GF than I ever have had negative. Im just sore I can't take my annual prairie doggin and varminting trips that have become a custom amongst friends/family this year on state trust land. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Antmo23 Report post Posted February 28, 2014 If the cattle companies keep this up, the G&F will close the unit to all hunting. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Outdoor Writer Report post Posted February 28, 2014 If I recall, the agreement includes access only during specific BIG-GAME seasons from Aug. into Dec. From the ranch rules: Access by Recreational Users to the Big Boquillas Ranch will close December 17, 2013. Access after that date is prohibited on the Big Boquillas Ranch, unless otherwise expressly authorized in writing by the Lessee. 1 Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
BeardownAZ Report post Posted February 28, 2014 Can someone educate me on this, State Trust land belongs to the state of Arizona correct? Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
mklong40 Report post Posted February 28, 2014 If I recall, the agreement includes access only during specific BIG-GAME seasons from Aug. into Dec. From the ranch rules: Access by Recreational Users to the Big Boquillas Ranch will close December 17, 2013. Access after that date is prohibited on the Big Boquillas Ranch, unless otherwise expressly authorized in writing by the Lessee. Like I said, there is far too much literature on the subject for a moron like myself. However, I do remember there being much debate specific to PDing and in fact even now on the website most of the permit verbiage states exceptions to PDing. So, who knows but your point is my concern...and I am not fully aware of how state trust land is completely cut off to residence. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
GreeneMachine Report post Posted February 28, 2014 Maybe some of that catalina sheep money would have greased the skids for these clueless ranchers. Would have benefitted a WHOLE lot more wildlife and hunters than the lion meat did in the Catalina's Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
creed Report post Posted February 28, 2014 We are dealing with private property and State Trust land. STL is not public land. Without doing research I would think that the Boquillas has leased the STL within the ranch boundaries. This kind of BS is exactly why I will never hunt unit 10 again outside of the national forest. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
8OWHUNT247 Report post Posted February 28, 2014 Is it checker board up there? That happens a lot in WY where a rancher buys 50% of the land and puts the only access gates on the Private sections so as not to allow access. I am just curious if this is the same case on the Bo. I would force them to buy out the other 50% if they want to really act like its all theirs.. If they couldn't (which I am sure they can't) it would open up the negotiations. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
L Cazador Report post Posted February 28, 2014 The agreement, and this is on the ranch rules web site, is access will be granted to the ranch with a valid big game tag or access to certain pastures as designated by the lessee for prairie dog/varmint hunting will be granted by purchase of an access permit provided by the Diamond A ranch headquarters. Price of this permit is $60 for a one week access for prairie dog/shooting, and $60 for a big game tag holder ( turkey, javelina, tags are obviously not included since they fall in the spring), are they not considered big game at the Boquillas??? Yes , some of this is state land that we're being denied access to!! Please note that Diamond A is a lessee not the land owner. Diamond A leases from the State and the Navajo Nation. It appears that Diamond A has been granted full discretion as to access of the ranch, since they have now closed the ranch to all hunting with no clear date as to when or if it will be open to any hunting!! Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Outdoor Writer Report post Posted February 28, 2014 The agreement, and this is on the ranch rules web site, is access will be granted to the ranch with a valid big game tag or access to certain pastures as designated by the lessee for prairie dog/varmint hunting will be granted by purchase of an access permit provided by the Diamond A ranch headquarters. Price of this permit is $60 for a one week access for prairie dog/shooting, and $60 for a big game tag holder ( turkey, javelina, tags are obviously not included since they fall in the spring), are they not considered big game at the Boquillas??? Yes , some of this is state land that we're being denied access to!! Please note that Diamond A is a lessee not the land owner. Diamond A leases from the State and the Navajo Nation. It appears that Diamond A has been granted full discretion as to access of the ranch, since they have now closed the ranch to all hunting with no clear date as to when or if it will be open to any hunting!! I'm guessing the Aubrey Valley Only prairie dog permit is available only for the time period the ranch is open to recreational users -- Aug. to Dec. -- as stated in the rules. It is currently Feb. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
mklong40 Report post Posted February 28, 2014 The agreement, and this is on the ranch rules web site, is access will be granted to the ranch with a valid big game tag or access to certain pastures as designated by the lessee for prairie dog/varmint hunting will be granted by purchase of an access permit provided by the Diamond A ranch headquarters. Price of this permit is $60 for a one week access for prairie dog/shooting, and $60 for a big game tag holder ( turkey, javelina, tags are obviously not included since they fall in the spring), are they not considered big game at the Boquillas??? Yes , some of this is state land that we're being denied access to!! Please note that Diamond A is a lessee not the land owner. Diamond A leases from the State and the Navajo Nation. It appears that Diamond A has been granted full discretion as to access of the ranch, since they have now closed the ranch to all hunting with no clear date as to when or if it will be open to any hunting!! I'm guessing the Aubrey Valley Only prairie dog permit is available only for the time period the ranch is open to recreational users -- Aug. to Dec. -- as stated in the rules. It is currently Feb. Makes a lot of sense...smash the varminters and PDoggers in with people who have waited 10 years to draw a tag! Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Guest wdenike Report post Posted February 28, 2014 This is my take on this situation. And I might add I am very, very, close to the cattle industry. The general public ( tree Huggers ). The same people that hate hunters, also hate the cattle industry. Now they want to stop hunting completely, and they want the cattle completely off state and federal land. For the most part hunters are normally of the same type of people as the ranchers, and understand the cattle business to a certain extent. Point being, as a rule outdoorsmen are generally a friend of the ranchers. Now this is not to be confused with the sorry POS with in our community that are destructive, and PIGS. And there is a larger % of them out there than some on this site would care to admit. Like I said I am close to the situation and SEE AND KNOW. I just personally don't understand the mind set of the ranchers. After all they are a smaller minority then us hunters are. Why would either of us piss off voting friends and allies. This plays right into the ole divide and conquer concept. Know, anybody that knows me knows I tell it as I see it. And if certain ranchers would like to play hard ball with people that are in their corner. What I would suggest for some one to do. Is it is a fact that this is public leased land, for the purpose of raising beef. If they are now going to be in the hunting ranch business. It is my belief the lease agreement should be renegotiated to reflect the running of two businesses. And they should be required to carry the necessary insurance to accommodate their new costumers. This should also apply to the leasing of public land to outfitters. Now if they still choose to snub the people that are in their corner. Buy simply closing the public land to the very people that own it. I would also look in to the tax write offs, and subsidies that that are provided to these businesses. By the very people that they are kicking off the public land. It really is not a good idea to chit in bed and kick it out with your feet. This being said I also think that when the trash of our sport is caught destroying and leaving their trash all over the place the fines should be so severe it hurts their entire family. And we should help by being extra eyes to help stop them. Take care, Willie 3 Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
creed Report post Posted February 28, 2014 Is it is a fact that this is public leased land, for the purpose of raising beef. Take care, Willie It is not public leased land. Most people think it is but is not. Here is some info on STL. And a quote on the info about public access " Land leased for agricultural, mining, commercial or military use is not available for recreation." http://www.ehow.com/about_6653911_information-state-trust-land-arizona.html "Arizona Trust Land is land managed by the State Land Department Trust Land is not public land http://www.azland.gov/programs/natural/recreation_permit.htm Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
