Father/Son Outings

[tjhunt2]

I've sat on this for the last two weeks and thought I could get some answers from the group who I think is responsible for the littering of our forest 2 weeks ago on the 11th. The group in question is the Deer Valley Ward out of Phoenix. They were on a father/son outing the 10th & 11th of May. They were camped north of Payson up off the Control Road. Their father&son outing was located on the road leading to the Geronimo Boy Scout Ranch. On Saturday it sounded like WWII for most of the day. Now I know they have a right to shoot their guns where they were but on this day every camp site was full up and down the road from theirs. It was very annoying and I would have thought they would have had a little more consideration for all the campers around them. This area has become very popular for weekend campers and especially popular for the father/son outings. For those of you who are not familiar with father/son outings they are fathers of the Mormon church who bring their sons on an over night camp out. I'm not exactly sure what goes on at one of these but I assume it's bonding with their sons and sharing their religious thoughts and beliefs among themselves. I don't have a problem with this and actually think it's a good thing for the kids. I have seen many of these groups over the years and the kids always seem to have a good time. We actually had a group camp next to us, this same weekend, on Peg's turkey hunt and they even ask us if they could have our permission to camp by us and told us that there would be around 75 father and sons. Of course they didn't have to ask us, since we don't own the woods, but it was nice that they did and it showed the respect and consideration that we have witnessed from many of these group outing over the past several years.

Now to get back why I'm posting this. With all the shooting going on our one dogs kept herself hidden all day behind the bed and our lab just wanted to run down to see where all the birds were falling. lol Well, they finally quit shooting a few hours before dark and headed home. Thank God the other campers and us had some peace and quiet. Up until now I'm not upset because I have come to expect the shooting from those who have no consideration for nearby campers. We pack up Sunday and head for home when I notice clay pigeons broke all over the ground where the Deer Valley Ward had camped. I parked the truck, walked down, and took several pictures of the mess they left behind. They did pick up their empty shot gun shells but left dozens of rifle casings, shot up pop cans, and I don't know how many broken clay pigeons all over their camp area, in Webber Creek, and on the banks of the creek. I've seen my share of garbage and trash left behind over the years but I can't imagine this coming from a father/son group. It's not a very good example to set for the kids.

I have tried calling the number given for their church and even tried calling during church services with not luck. I'm 99% sure it was the Deer Valley Church but if I'm wrong I will be the first to apologies. If it was them I wanted to ask if they could possibly go clean it up. There are fines for littering the forest and it might even be a federal offence to litter a national forest stream. I know I could turn them in but I haven't got real good evidence except for pictures and I would rather give them the benefit of the doubt to clean it up themselves.

First of all I don't want to come on cwt and sound like I'm bashing the Mormon church, in no way am I, but if you are part of the Deer Valley Ward or know any of them could you bring this to the attention of those responsible for their carelessness in keeping our forest clean for those who follow in their footsteps. Thank you!

 

TJ

 

Casings and clays everywhere.

Kind of hard to see them in this pic.

Picture doesn't show justice.

These were across the creek from camp.

These in the water really didn't set right with me.

Left behind for others to pick up

Really!!!

I picked up several of these.

This actually looks worse than the pic.

 

 

 

[resolute]

Very sad. Not exactly what I would want to teach my son on a father / son outing

[Snapshot]

"Leave no trace", should be taught to everyone.

[elkslare]

We usually come home with a couple extra bags full of trash from other people when we come back from an outing in the hills. The one I hate is lets empty the ash tray here.

[Non-Typical Solutions]

TJ,

No need to sit on something like this, the people responsible need to be contacted and educated.

 

I have been on many fathers and sons outings and indeed it is intended to be a time for both bonding and reflection upon the early years of the church.

 

I have never been around one of these where guns were used or even talked about being used as that really has nothing to do with the intent of the weekend.

 

Having said that each ward has the liberty to choose how that is organized. Most of the time it is a great meal on Friday evening with stories around a big fire, with a full out breakfast in the morning. Upon occasion I have taken my boys fishing as I am really not a huge fan of mass camping, mainly because I get out in the woods to get away from the masses.

 

You will rarely get anybody to answer the phone at the church during meeting time. I will try and track down a number and give this bunch a call.

 

Not a very good example at all of what we stand for or teach.

Thanks for caring about our forest.

[bowhunter4life]

I thought clay targets, shot shells,plastic bags were biodegradable :{ If you know the group, send them an email with pics, very sad.

[Flatlander]

TJ,

No need to sit on something like this, the people responsible need to be contacted and educated.

 

I have been on many fathers and sons outings and indeed it is intended to be a time for both bonding and reflection upon the early years of the church.

 

I have never been around one of these where guns were used or even talked about being used as that really has nothing to do with the intent of the weekend.

 

Having said that each ward has the liberty to choose how that is organized. Most of the time it is a great meal on Friday evening with stories around a big fire, with a full out breakfast in the morning. Upon occasion I have taken my boys fishing as I am really not a huge fan of mass camping, mainly because I get out in the woods to get away from the masses.

 

You will rarely get anybody to answer the phone at the church during meeting time. I will try and track down a number and give this bunch a call.

 

Not a very good example at all of what we stand for or teach.

Thanks for caring about our forest.

NTS - Did you ever get a hold of them? I was able to find the bishop's phone number.

[tjhunt2]

TJ,

No need to sit on something like this, the people responsible need to be contacted and educated.

 

I have been on many fathers and sons outings and indeed it is intended to be a time for both bonding and reflection upon the early years of the church.

 

I have never been around one of these where guns were used or even talked about being used as that really has nothing to do with the intent of the weekend.

 

Having said that each ward has the liberty to choose how that is organized. Most of the time it is a great meal on Friday evening with stories around a big fire, with a full out breakfast in the morning. Upon occasion I have taken my boys fishing as I am really not a huge fan of mass camping, mainly because I get out in the woods to get away from the masses.

 

You will rarely get anybody to answer the phone at the church during meeting time. I will try and track down a number and give this bunch a call.

 

Not a very good example at all of what we stand for or teach.

Thanks for caring about our forest.

NTS - Did you ever get a hold of them? I was able to find the bishop's phone number.

 

No, I haven't been able to get a hold of anyone as of yet. If you would be kind enough to pm me with his phone number I would greatly appreciate it.

 

TJ

[JSHUNTER05]

Props to TJ for your concern and taking the time to bring this up, hopefully those responsible will do the right thing. A buddy of mine goes on these father and son outings from one of the Gilbert churches. I'm going to mention this to him.

[Chef]

Even as you're so easy going TJ, I can only imagine how ticked you must have been while taking the photos.

 

Even if you don't get a hold of those responsible, you definitely got others' attention.

[COUESAZ]

Yes TJ you have all the right in the world to contact the Bishop of that Ward. We are asked to not bring guns and Atv or Utvs during the actual father and sons outings. I take my boys out of school that Friday and we will go out on the Ranger. Then we put it away during the time set aside for the church outing. We wait all day Saturday for everyone to leave then we go shooting. I have come back a few times and had to clean up camp that was left behind. It needs to be brought forth to more of the wards in our church.

[tjhunt2]

I would like to thank those of you who provided me with information that led me to the source of the matter. I was able to talk with the Bishop today and he assured me, in his deepest sincere apology, it would be cleaned up and brought to the attention of those responsible. He ask if I would send him pictures which I did. As I told the Bishop my intent was not to get anyone in a lot of trouble but to bring awareness to those responsible.

Thanks for all your posts.

[Non-Typical Solutions]

Thank you TJ I appreciate the professional manner you handled the matter. Flying off the handle is the easy way and you taught a group of people that part of the stewardship of being blessed with the beautiful outdoors we have is taking care of it.

I appreciate your time and next time, get in touch with me and don't sit on it for two weeks.........great job on your part.

[Flatlander]

Thanks for getting this taken care of TJ. You are a great example.

[tjhunt2]

Thanks for the kind words. Just trying to do what's right.

 

TJ