Ethical kill

[Redman]

According to, Coues-n-Sheep, per his letter to G&F on baiting ban " if it is legal it is ethical" so minus breaking a law there can be no breach of ethics... I am sure, C-n-S thinks completely the same way about the banks and mortgage companies, and that they were being ethical when they screwed Americans, since what they were doing was not against the law... Of course, I believe this notion to be absolutely absurd, and inaccurate ( too many examples of legal behaviors, that go far beyond being remotely close to ethical). I believe ethics, and moral responsibility go far beyond just laws, and though measured on an individual scale, they deserve scrutiny from those in this world, whom may be affected by one's choice.

 

Well based on your reply.... I will scrutinize you... why do you feel the need to point out another members views (CNS) on a totally different topic and then speak for him? That's bush league man...

 

Redman ... I am not speaking for him " If it is legal it is also ethical" are his own words as it pertains to Ethics and hunting (this type of thought can not be exclusive) . This does not constitute a grey area and if truly believed does not allow for one to think the opposite when he or she chooses. I brought up the comment because the key point of the OP was on ethical killing and it seems to be that many( not all) individuals here believe the same way as this highly looked up to member of the site, and they only seem to associate ethics with legality versus the moral practices and beliefs of the majority of people around them.

 

"I am sure, C-n-S thinks completely the same way about the banks and mortgage companies, and that they were being ethical when they screwed Americans" that is speaking for him Str8Shot....

[couesdeerhntr]

I would like to think that everyone that makes a bad shot and cant recover there kill would stop hunting after shooting one animal and not takin the chance of wounding an animal but i know that happens all the time. And i would bet alot of the tags that are givin out are givin to people that wont pull out there rifle tell the season opener and who knows how the rifle will shoot. So as for ethics i have no answer.

[Guest akaspecials]

I'm from the school of the thought that if you draw blood that is your animal/tag unless you see it alive later on or another hunter tags it. People are stealing from me when they shoot multiple animals so I have no problem gently letting them know how I feel.

 

On the issue of long range it is a little different. I very rarely see other people practice so I almost never criticize people on the distance of their shot with two exceptions:

1. They are missing a lot. If someone has missed multiple animals they clearly shouldn't be shooting under those circumstances and they should reassess their capabilities. I will speak up on this one because there is a high chance of wounding multiple animals and once again that is stealing from me. If someone can consistently hit animals at 1000+ yards, that’s their business, not mine.

2. Limitations of equipment. I normally run into this with bird hunting. There isn't a shotgun in the world that will kill ducks at 125 yards. When people shoot these distances it pushes ducks out of the area and ruins everyone else’s hunt, so I'll say something.

 

I usually only breach the subject if I am already in a conversation with people and they mention one of the things I referred to above. Even then, I give my opinion nicely and change the subject if they aren’t receptive. I almost never seek people out so I can sit on a high horse and play ethics police. I have better things to do and it could be hazardous to my health to confront a bunch of armed rednecks in the middle of nowhere.

 

The only times that I actually go out of my way to talk to people regarding ethics is when they ruin my hunt, and this is normally sky busting ducks. 95% of the time they have no clue that what they are doing is wrong. I’ve even invited a few of them to hunt with me so we are both more successful that morning and it’s a win/win situation. The key is how you approach it. If people feel threatened or chided they won’t respond well even if they know they are wrong…

[Becker]

akaspecials I really like your approach. Read some leadership and management books about how to communicate with people in confrontational situations and you will see a very common theme. Words, depending on how you use them, can really dictate the outcome of conversation. "Crucial Conversations" is how it was defined in a class that my wife just took, and it was very interesting to listen to her describe to me how simple single words can make people either feel talked down to or the complete opposite. I know most of us are very passionate about our hunting and our ethical opinions, but if we took some time to really think before we type I think a lot more can come out of the conversations vs stating simply "My way or the highway."

[Snapshot]

One thing I can certainly understand, is in the excitement of the hunt, sometimes hunters just make bad decisions when shooting. It happens. I know what my limitations are, and I try and stay within those boundaries. It's not my place to judge someone elses shooting abilities. It comes down to respecting the wildlife, and not using poor judgement that could wound an animal, and make it unrecoverable.

 

A guy told me once about a nice bull elk he had gutshot with an arrow. The bull ran down into a steep canyon, and the guy refused to go after it. He said the canyon was too steep, and it would be too much work to get the bull out. I had a few harsh words to him about his actions and lack of ethics. He shrugged it off as no big deal. One nice bull that probably died under a tree, and went to waste.

 

We all hear it when we are deer hunting. BOOM.....BOOM.....BOOM......BOOM......reload......BOOM.....BOOM.......BOOM.....BOOM.

[Jbird]

I met a guy once who told me it was his first whitetail hunt. This was in 30A. He asked me if they "were the ones that were smaller and had white tails". I wondered if he had ever even seen a deer in the wild or fired his rifle.

[Snapshot]

The hunters that scare me, are the ones that look at you through their rifle scopes!

[Non-Typical Solutions]

Too bad Lark ain't here to weigh in on this one.............it is almost like hunting over bait

 

Morals and Ethics are such a broad spectrum.

 

Drinkin in camp is that moral or ethical?

 

Driving roads?

 

Spotlighting until the deer are so buggered they ain't there no more?

 

Ten year old out there shooting a gun?

 

Old man out there shooting a gun?

 

It really is too bad that we all don't have the time to be expert shooters at 1000 yards even though I can't imagine being even able to see that far.

 

It is too bad that we all can't put the arrow right through the kill zone.

 

Is a hundred yards too far????

 

I probably would never approach a stranger and try to tell him he was doing something immoral or unethical.

 

If I saw "illegal" activity going on I would report it to those whose job it is to administer the law.

 

Lord have mercy on me if the meter I use to judge others morals or ethics is the same one I use on myself.......

 

Good question.................interesting discussion

 

Final soap box................does common sense ring a bell??????

[Guest akaspecials]

I met a guy once who told me it was his first whitetail hunt. This was in 30A. He asked me if they "were the ones that were smaller and had white tails". I wondered if he had ever even seen a deer in the wild or fired his rifle.

 

You could have turned that into a learning situation and helped the guy out. At least he was getting out and trying it. Not everyone has mentors to teach them or has grown up around hunting like a lot of us. Everyone has to start somewhere...

[Snapshot]

If I saw "illegal" activity going on I would report it to those whose job it is to administer the law.

 

Does that apply just to when you are hunting?

[Non-Typical Solutions]

If I saw "illegal" activity going on I would report it to those whose job it is to administer the law.

 

Does that apply just to when you are hunting?

 

Absolutely not...............

[Hunterjohnny]

If I saw "illegal" activity going on I would report it to those whose job it is to administer the law.

 

Does that apply just to when you are hunting?

Only if I'm not involved!

[Snapshot]

If I saw "illegal" activity going on I would report it to those whose job it is to administer the law.

 

Does that apply just to when you are hunting?

 

Absolutely not...............

 

Just curious. I have no problem confronting people, or making a citizens arrest, if the situation warrants intervention. Dangerous? Yes, but sometimes we need to help out........ or simply to let someone know what they are doing is wrong.

 

The guy that gut shot the elk was soembody I knew, and not a stranger.

[Non-Typical Solutions]

I did a really really dumb thing this past summer.

 

I was taking my boy down to a wrestling camp in the valley.

 

At the corner of Val Vista and McDowel I think.......witnessed a crash.

 

Pulled over to see if everybody was OK.........

 

Saw one driver jump a high wall.......the other person in the car...........all banged up trying to jump a lower wall.

 

At first I was in trying to get the injured guy help mode.....but he finally jumped the wall and took off.

 

Like an idiot, I took off over the wall after him and kept him at bay until police showed up.

 

When I got back to the car.....my wife and son both had very choice words for me.............idiot, dumb and just plainn stupid to name a few.

 

As immoral as we may think some people are accoding to our measure......there are some just flat out really bad people out there...............

[Snapshot]

I did a really really dumb thing this past summer.

 

I was taking my boy down to a wrestling camp in the valley.

 

At the corner of Val Vista and McDowel I think.......witnessed a crash.

 

Pulled over to see if everybody was OK.........

 

Saw one driver jump a high wall.......the other person in the car...........all banged up trying to jump a lower wall.

 

At first I was in trying to get the injured guy help mode.....but he finally jumped the wall and took off.

 

Like an idiot, I took off over the wall after him and kept him at bay until police showed up.

 

When I got back to the car.....my wife and son both had very choice words for me.............idiot, dumb and just plainn stupid to name a few.

 

As immoral as we may think some people are accoding to our measure......there are some just flat out really bad people out there...............

 

I applaud you for your action. I can imagine the wife's reaction. I have been in that boat before. I have no minor children, so I can afford to be reckless If I had kids with me, it would be harder to be confrontational. However, there was the time a drunk guy tried to pickup on my underage stepdaughter when I was only 6 feet away................