Need the opinion of any AC techs

[bradne]

As the title says, I am looking for some advice from any experiencd AC technicians.

 

I have a 4 ton AC unit. Part of it is located in the house (integrated with furnace) and the other part is outside. I had to call an AC service today because I noticed that it was not cooling correctly and there isn't any other time in the next few days that I will be home for a tech to come out. Obviosly the companies that are willing to come out on Saturday are going to charge more. I expect that so I am not too upset about that.

 

I am a bit concerned about what he had to say though. I told him that about a year ago I had a tech from the same company out and at that time he added some freon since it was low. He didn't do anything else except clean it at that time. I was having the same problem then and after he added the freon, it worked good unti the last couple of days when I noticed it not cooling as efficient.

 

When the tech showed up today, He inspected it and told me he thought it was low on freon since it was not cooling and the lines were freezing up (I agree with that). He checked and added three lbs of freon. He did give me a bit of a price break on the call since he told me the other tech should have checked for leaks.

 

He did add some dye to the system and will be back on Friday to look for a leak (says that small leaks take time to show up). My concern is the fact that he told me that more than likely he could not repair a leak on the coil and every time he tries to solder them, he burns through destroying the unit. He then told me I would more than likley have to replace the unit for about $4000.00. This is a worst case scenario, since he has not yet found the leak and is just guessing.

 

I am not wild about plopping down 4 grand for an AC, especially since it seems to me that if these things were soldered when they were built, I don't know why a skilled repairman could not do a repair without destroying a unit. If they do determine that the leak is "not repairable" I will have another company come in and give me a quote, but I am trying to get my ducks in a row here. I did some reading and realize that if it could be repaired that all the freon would have to be removed first. I am sure that would be significantly cheaper than replacing the unit.

 

I am just trying to make sure that am not being suckered to buy a high price new AC from the same company that is "unable" to repair my current one.

[ultramag]

Leaks are a tricky deal the best thing to do is for the tech to find the leak! Then you can determine the best approach to fixing the issue. Sometimes it's is just a rubbing copper line in the condenser unit, easy fix. Sometime the indoor or outdoor coil has a leak inside the fins. These leaks are though to repair without ruining the coil. If you are a handy guy take some dish soap and a spray bottle add a little water and spray the solution onto the copper Lines anywhere and everywhere and look for big bubbles the leak most likely will show up. Freon will have to be removed in order to repair the leak. Look for oil also.

3 lbs in a year the leak Should be easy to find. If you decide to remove panels and such unplug the disconnect. Good luck.

[ultramag]

The tech should have a electronic leak detector "sniffer" I have never been a big fan of dye. In my option. If the tech needs dye he would also find oil which is counter productive. And otherwise waste of time and money to look for dye with a ultraviolet light when oil will be present.

[muleskinner]

Dye is pretty reliable way to find a very small leak...most times oil is present at a leak, but not every time. Fixing the leak will depend on where it is located. Professional ac techs will be hesitant to try to fix something that they don't feel like they can gaurantee. That does'nt mean it can't be fixed. If you have a friend or someone who is willing to try and fix it for you with the understanding that it might work and it might not, then so be it. Replacement cost will depend on a few things, such as the age of the unit, etc. I own an hvac business and I have some contacts in Az that might be able to save you some money if you do have to replace the unit. Most of them are in Tucson. Don't know where you are, but I will help you any way I can.

[bradne]

This is why I love Coueswhitetail. The only question I can't get answered is "What are next weeks winning lottery numbers?".

 

I am in Sierra Vista so Tucson is not far away, maybe further than some AC techs would want to go, but still not too bad.

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This AC is 12 years old and if it is not repairable then I am OK with that. The tech seemed like a pretty good guy, but I have the feeling that some of these guys are pressured to be salesmen also. That is my concern.

[Snapshot]

I used to have a similar system. I lost cooling temp and had a guy I know come out with a "sniffer" . He found a samll leak in a condenser inside the house unit. He added freon and was good to go. He said I could replace theleaky condenser part eventually for about $300?

[bonecollector]

Like what was said earlier usually you can find oil on the lines or where ever it is leaking at. A lot of guys wont repair a leak in the coil. If your condensing unit needs replaced $4000 sounds a bit high just for the condensing unit but then again it depends on brand and seer rating. Good luck.

[Gr8 White Jr]

What ever happened to "A/C Guy" here on the site. Haven't seen him post in a couple of years.

[jnobleinaz]

Freon leaks are the biggest pain in the you know what to deal with. If it is a split system you have to determine if it is in the indoor coil or the outdoor coil. Usually this time of year if it is in the outdoor coil you will see the oil residue very easily. If in the indoor coil depending on brand you have to take apart the case or air handler depending if it is a heat pump or split gas. Finding the leak is the hard part. The best way my brother and I use is to take all of the refrigerant out of the lines then do a high pressure test with nitrogen. Or use a vacuum pump on the system. Shrader calves also leak at the unit when the core o rings give out. Now if the leak is in the condenser you have two issues is it a straight cool unit or a heat pump? If it is a straight cool you can replace just the condenser portion of the unit because you can still use r-22 dry condensers that are being made by American Standard and Trane (our rec) or if it is a heat pump it has to be a 12 SEER or higher then you can use a r-22 dry heat pump condenser that will still work with the metering device for the R-22 inside your system. If not you are looking at an entire new system insiade and out. That is always an option but can get costly depending on where your indoor unit is. If it is the indoor coil you are at the mercy of what manufacturer and specs you have for that unit. If they still make a coil you can use with R-22 you can replace it. Or also look at the an entirely new 410-a refrigerant based system. Whatever the case freon leaks are the biggest pain in our industry to deal with. All this above just gives you an idea that there is no one true answer to the problem but many options that are out there. John Noble Noble Refrigeration

[muleskinner]

John, I am a trane dealer here in N.M. You covered it pretty well. Our industry has gotten a lot more complicated than it used to be. Gone are the days when 3 main refrigerants covered 99% of the equip. R12, R22, and R502. Typical govt meddling along with environmental idiots simply means the cost goes thru the roof.

[PRDATR]

If it is an indoor leak get it fixed now. You don't want it leaking in the house as freon is heavier than air.

[cbryant11]

how did this turn out, i agree with removing freon and pumping with nitrogen but i would do a oil leak check before i did that, oil stains will tell you alot....

[bradne]

The tech won't be back until Friday to take a look for the leaks. With all of the junk I have around here, I don't have a "black" light to look for a leak and I am not seeing any oil with the naked eye. The good part is that the AC is chugging along and cooling just fine for now.

[SunDevil]

Dye is pretty reliable way to find a very small leak...most times oil is present at a leak, but not every time. Fixing the leak will depend on where it is located. Professional ac techs will be hesitant to try to fix something that they don't feel like they can gaurantee. That does'nt mean it can't be fixed. If you have a friend or someone who is willing to try and fix it for you with the understanding that it might work and it might not, then so be it. Replacement cost will depend on a few things, such as the age of the unit, etc. I own an hvac business and I have some contacts in Az that might be able to save you some money if you do have to replace the unit. Most of them are in Tucson. Don't know where you are, but I will help you any way I can.

 

Muleskinner - can you please provide info on the HVAC contacts you have in Tucson? Thanks. Chris.

[azpackhorse]

Dye is pretty reliable way to find a very small leak...most times oil is present at a leak, but not every time. Fixing the leak will depend on where it is located. Professional ac techs will be hesitant to try to fix something that they don't feel like they can gaurantee. That does'nt mean it can't be fixed. If you have a friend or someone who is willing to try and fix it for you with the understanding that it might work and it might not, then so be it. Replacement cost will depend on a few things, such as the age of the unit, etc. I own an hvac business and I have some contacts in Az that might be able to save you some money if you do have to replace the unit. Most of them are in Tucson. Don't know where you are, but I will help you any way I can.

 

Muleskinner - can you please provide info on the HVAC contacts you have in Tucson? Thanks. Chris.

 

Chris, I know a guy that is honest as they come and will do right by you. Let me know if you want his number.