antler point restrictions

[SunDevil]

Dont you think the odds of there being a large, old 2x2 buck without eyeguards is pretty slim? I do. Maybe a big 2x2 carp without eyeguards but not a whitetail. CB

[fatfootdoc]

sundevil,

Pretty slim yes, but how stupid would you feel if you shot one like that and there was an antler point restriction, would you turn yourself in or would you let it rot? ag

[SunDevil]

AG - it would be hard not to shoot at a big buck that was busted out of its bed and was running away. I personally am not going to be pulling the trigger on anything in NM unless I am 100% certain that what I am shooting at is legal.

 

Also, your more experienced coues hunters (glassers) are probably not going to be jumping big bucks out of their beds. Yes it is possible but for the most part not that likely. Glassers are not hiking around as much and are doing a much better job at spotting deer than non-glassers.

 

I personally have not shot at a busted out buck in 8 years and that was done way back before I owned a pair of quality binoculars and had learned to let my eyes do my walking for me.

 

Now I have only hunted NM once but from what I saw, hunting WT in NM is pretty tough. Deer numbers are lower than in AZ and the country is big and rugged. Based on that observation, I would guess the majority of the WT hunters in NM are going to be more experienced and less likely to shoot a buck that is not legal. More than likely, the illegal bucks that are going to be accidentally shot are going to be from non-glassing carp hunters who are running around in their jeeps and quads road hunting.

 

Just my 2 cents. CB

[Noel Arnold]

Sun Devil,

If you read my post,then you know that I have been hunting coues for year's.And thank's to my dad's training I have alway's used high quality optic's. Although I hate to shoot at a buck that I have jumped out because of ground shrinkage, I still do it on ocassion. Two year's ago I did it on a buck that I was thinking was a 100 and he ended up being 106.He would have been 109 if he had not broke off a point.I had about 5 second's to make the decision before he went over the hill.If you talk to any coues hunter that has hunted them a lot of year's , I would think that they have had at least one time were they jumped a very large buck and had to make a spilt decision . The more I think about antler restriction's on coues the more I question it. One possibility might be restricting spike's,I would think most people could tell the difference.

Noel

[fatfootdoc]

SunDevil,

,

I am strictly a spot and stalk hunter for whitetail, however I have shot a deer that I glassed up from about 300 yards and it was moving, it looked good so I dumped him, I got over to him and he was a small racked 2 point with eyeguards and was standing if front of a bush that just happened to make his rack look huge. Point is I never looked again at the rack once I decided to shoot. If you are hunting and you see a buck jump up in range and he looks good , Well I for one will shoot(may not hit, emphasis on shoot ) , my point was is that are some large framed older deer that are only 2 points and will get you into trouble with the antler restrictions. It does not happen alot, but with my luck... AG

[CouesWhitetail]

I personally do not like antler point restrictions. I think they just shift the hunting pressure to the older bucks. And I think they result in a larger number of deer being shot and left in the field due to hunter error. I think antler point restrictions are just another way to lower hunter success while maintaining the number of permits sold. It's what I dislike about many wildlife agencies. They spend so much time trying to come up with ways to increase hunter opportunity while decreasing success so that more people can be in the field without harvesting more bucks. If you want larger bucks in your population, why not just reduce the hunting pressure on the population in general (ie reduce the number of permits issued). If you are not worried about producing large antlers, issue more permits. Buck:doe ratios will decrease, age of harvest will decrease and average size of antlers on harvested deer will decrease. Lowering permit numbers increases buck:doe ratios, increases age and size of harvested deer. It's very simple and it's the type of management I like best, probably because of my time as the biologist for San Carlos. On San Carlos we did both trophy and non-trophy management and it was, in general, just a matter of issuing more or less permits to allow the males to grow old and large, whether it was elk or deer or sheep or antelope or bear or whatever.

 

For those of you interested in learning more about recent research on antler point restrictions, you can search the internet, or better yet, call or email Leonard Ordway or Brain Wakeling at AGFD. I am sure they would be aware of whatever research is out that and would be willing to talk about it with anyone.

 

Amanda

[SunDevil]

Has there been anything published in Pennsylvania since they went to an antler point restriction 3 - 4 years ago?