Stand United and Be Aware

[Silence Dogood]

Do I believe in a democratic society, darn right. Do I believe in more hunter opportunity, more wildlife and that we as sportsmen have every opportunity to make this happen, ALWAYS! Do I fear what groups like Center for Biological Diversity, HSUS, Sierra club with Sandy Barr and all the other anti groups are capable of; HISTORY of past transgressions forces me to!

As of late there has been a lot of talk about the “special interest” groups and their power plays. There has been a lot of bashing of folks that are now perceived as the enemy. I just wanted to get a few things off my chest, and these are just my feelings and not those of any organization. I will never be influenced to make decisions I don’t feel are right or just for Az, my children, or the future of wildlife by any group whether I affiliate with them or not.

I will tell those of you who have never been to a critter group meeting, it is a small but passionate group of truly devoted individuals. I have attended a few from time to time. These folks spend countless volunteer hours, drive hundreds of unpaid miles and make sacrifices for the states wildlife that would take most people decades to equal. So when I hear statements like “small faction” or “special interest” group, I must say I agree completely. There is such a small number of truly engaged folks involved in these groups that “small faction” fits perfectly. And, their “special interest” is spending their nights and weekends volunteering to fight for Arizona wildlife and the habitat they occupy. Are they all friends that all vote the same way, or believe the same things? Far from it, they are as diverse as any group with a common focus you will ever find.I will tell you a few facts about the supposed enemies, just to give you a different perspective. You are quick to rake John Koleszar over the coals. I challenge you to try and attend a meeting that involves wildlife that John isn’t sitting in the room; fighting to preserve the future of all wildlife and hunting. . How many of you have been attending AZGFD commission meetings and fervently fighting for wildlife since 1973, acting as President of several groups, and founder of several more, Pete Cimellaro has. Don Johnson has been targeted as of late. There is not one single man in this state who has done more for wildlife than Don. This man started doing wildlife habitat projects back in the early 70’s, and has hauled more rock, rolled more barbed wire and then cooked more meals for volunteers than any other person has or ever will. If you knew Don, you would know that he has no hidden agendas, garners no special support and will always be a man that acts based on HIS own opinion PERIOD.

Now let me give a few fact I know about some of the allies. I see that past Commissioner Bill McClean is now a “good guy”. This would be the same lawyer who admittedly fought in the capital against PROP 109, which would have secured our rights to hunt and fish. Jennifer martin has been gallantly stood up for. Ms. Martin whom was quoted as identifying with Sandy Barr (Sierra Clubs legal/lobbyist) and her ideologies more than those of the “hook and bullet” crowds. Norm Freeman now there’s a different story. His work with wildlife has been extensive. Among other business ventures, he is the founder of Elemental Technology, a firm that developed wildlife tracking software for wildlife biologists and regulatory bodies. He also co-authored a successful behavior modification program to reduce the juvenile predation of young California condors by coyotes. All of which are much easier to market in his position now.

Many of you have received an email from a senior member of one of the national wildlife groups who served for several years as their highest ranking volunteer. This email asked for our support to fight against HB1270 and the AZSFW. He wrote: “This bill is a continued "Control" tactic by a nominal amount of folks only from Phoenix. This bill would further divide sportsmen and that puts us right where the anti-hunters want us, which is at odds with each other. Phoenix needs to learn that they DO NOT control the entire state! This was curious to me that this same person had just found out that they would not gain employment by AZSFW to develop charter SFW groups around the state. A position this individual had come to AZSFW with of their own accord, not one that AZSFW had offered. Was this truly their opinion of something they felt was bad or an act of defiance? Seems contradictory, and once you hear all these details the validity of this person is questioned. Did AZSFW screw this thing up and cause the firestorm that triggered this email, oh boy did they? I read the bill however and found some merit in parts of it. Other parts I did not like at all. I think it had the possibility to be modified and make everyone happy and still raise a lot of money for wildlife. But it was gone about the wrong way.

Do any of you remember the Malik case that involved a very wealthy Casino owner who had purchased a Commissioners elk tag and was found guilty of illegally taking a bull too close to homes and on Private property? Full support was thrown behind Mr. Malik and his guide by an AZ wildlife group not based on the fact they believed his innocence, but because of financial gains that would be realized. This was wrong, and despite the support, the commission voted (4 to 1 Martin was the nay) to punish Malik for his actions. I ask is this ok to support those found guilty of illegally taking wildlife just because they are wealthy, and was the membership of the group asked if they supported this action? Did this group remove itself from AZSFWC due to HB1270 or was this due to the fact it had again became a very active group and was no longer able to be manipulated by this groups leader. Or was it the fact that one of the members questioned this persons actions. Maybe we will never know.

Do any of you remember the Arizona Game Protective Organization? Neither does Arizona Wildlife Federation, and that was how they started. As they say “to keep politics out of the AZGFD”. Although in my opinion its mission now is “to keep the right side of politics out of the AZGFD”. It appears in my estimation that they only have anything to do with wildlife or hunting groups when they need them to cook and provide food for one of their “board meetings” or “projects” which always requires a sponsor group to provide the volunteers to complete the required task.

I use these three factual examples to illustrate how easily something that while on the surface may seem pure as the driven snow, actually stinks to high heaven when you take off the cloak they wear. Beware of false prophets!!

AZGFD is one of the most unique organizations of its kind in the country. Not part of the state budget (even though the state tries constantly to sweep its funds). Has increased its budget annually without having an audit in 21yrs. Has a 3 person staff overseeing a 3 man habitat construction department who are the hardworking guys who do the work that AZGFD hasn’t trained volunteers to do, and thus can be paid by the feds for those volunteers hours and mileage worked. Although this 3 man crew is a vast reduction from what it used to be, the budget that is allotted for internal completed habitat construction projects has not decreased. When asked why there hasn’t been a reduction in budget to go along with the reduction in force; “well we’ll have to look into that”. Don’t get me wrong, the AZGFD is for the most part a good organization, but they are like any other pseudo government organization: long overdue for some oversight and trimming of the fat. They are hindered by public perception, but why? Over 80% of their revenue is generated by us sportsmen. Why would they worry then about their image in regards to predator control, and not when it comes to needed use of poisons to kill off nonnative fish. Because newspapers and anti-groups can make a huge deal out of a cute fuzzy coyote, or a majestic wolf, but not so much for a flathead minnow. In addition we never question their science based, North American Model inspired approach to handling our wildlife. I would just say that everyone could use a little oversight from time to time and an occasional tweak to keep up with changing times is being proactive.

Was the lack of support for things like Prop 201 back in 1992 the straw that broke the camel’s back and lost us our right to trap on public lands, NO? It was the fact that we as sportsmen had rallied in 1991 against Prop 200 and raised 1.9 million dollars and defeated the attempt to take away trapping. When we got hit the next year we were used up and only raised $625k, and stats say it takes a minimum of a cool million to win or beat a ballot initiative.

Is the Kaibab issue a diversion, far from it! These are real issues we must be prepared to unite and fight against. We must be prepared to open our wallets, give up our time and stand united to fight against. We must open our eyes to the wolves in sheep’s clothing. Make sure you truly know everything about a person or group before you throw your alliance behind them especially on a faceless forum. What’s to keep the anti-groups from planting people in these forums? If they are willing to buy licenses and apply for tags so they won’t get used, what’s to stop them from posting on a free forum? And above all we must be open to sacrificing now for the returns we will see in the future. We have a battle ahead of us as our society moves farther away from the acceptance of hunting and fishing. If we are to assure that future generations can enjoy what we hold so dear, we have to make a difference now. This means more than sitting behind a keyboard. If we want a better chance to draw an elk tag, we must do something to grow more elk. If an initiative arises you disagree with, hit the trenches and fight it, don’t take your ball and go home. Make the leaders of the groups you align yourself with be accountable, make your opinion matter, make your donations matter, don’t allow a charismatic leader or an evasive one blow you off. Make sure you do the research and know ALL the facts before you go marching in. I am sure there are a lot of Germans who wished they’d have gotten the whole story on a certain charismatic leader.

Conservation always,

Silence Dogood

[utah400elk]

You post is not worth reading. It is plain to see that you are a SFW supporter and you support HB2072. I get that, but to try and use the Dogood Bin Franklin thing is just too much. AZSFW divided the hunting community now they preach that the hunting community should be united and talk down on the people who want nothing to do with this group. If you read the bill than you would have seen that there were no solutions/plans listed. They tried to use trigger points to drive a proposal to grab tags. AZSFW is a cancer, nothing more.

[azslim]

The people you talk about have put in a lot of time and effort on behalf of wildlife for many years, but they sure hurt themselves and their credibility with the tag grab - TWICE. Their actions have probably doomed AZSFW in the state, I know they will never get a dime from me and many of my friends. No matter how many attaboys you have, one aw $hit wipes the slate clean. Their actions, specifically trying a second time to get a hold of the tags after the majority of sportsmen in the state opposed it, have led to a big split in the hunting community. Seems to me the only ones that won in this debacle are the anti-hunting orgs, we have a group of people experienced in getting things done based on their long volunteer efforts that have no support from the rank and file and will have a tough time getting it. Yep, Center For Biological Diversity is loving AZSFW right now.

[Ringer]

So we are all nazis now and don't understand anything about the wonderful people who just conspired to screw every hunter in this state. You guys just don't give up. I read every word of the Grand Canyon Wilderness intitiative and it scared the crap out of me. I wrote every politician I could think of and hope we get a new president before they get that one through. Bottom line is AZSFW and their supporters have hit the tripwire and no issue is going to allow them to get away fast enough from the turdbomb. You did what you had to do and now the rest of us will do what we think is right. It seems that every one of your people seems to think that HB2072 was a great idea just handled the wrong way. I think it was the single biggest threat to family hunting we have ever seen. Only 5% of Americans even care about hunting today. You have just divided that 5% so good work there. I am sure G&F is looking forward to working with you.

[muskrat]

Paragraphs. Just sayin'

[KGAINES]

So how long do the 5% stay divided, are we all that hard headed. I think we are all fighting the same war, if we stay divided we are easily defeated.

[javihammer]

Yep, there are threats in Arizona. We need to unite and fight against them. I would encourage the critter groups that have had THREE MONTHS to solicit feedback from their members to help address the biggest threat to hunters in Arizona and break ties from any of the AZSFW related special interests. The AZSFW has no business in Arizona or anywhere else. I also noticed the Capitol Consulting website seems to be touting their "event planning" services now (I don't remember seeing that before). I wonder if they hire "consultants" to consult and work on things like expos? I wonder who those people would be....hmmm.

 

Where does the Arizona Deer Association, Arizona Antelope Foundation and Mohave Sportsman Club stand on separation from the AZSFW/AZSFWC? We all remember (and always will) the arrogant letters, the questionable backdoor tactics, the carefully worded "don't blame me" posts (and yes, we know the AZSFW and AZSFWC are separate entities with the same people and we don't need a hunt education instructor from Northwestern Arizona to tiptoe around that point in any more). Many of us also remember the Game and Fish meeting where not a single person stood up to support HB 2072, it would be hard to believe that many people would support orgs that push a bill no one liked, even people in the ADA, AAF, and MSC. The time for critter groups to get honest about the feelings of their members is right now.....you have had plenty of time.

 

The AZSFW and AZSFWC need to be a great big SUNK COST. Guys like me will do everything possible to see that happen, even if there are other threats out there that need attention. There are some young motivated guys that want to get some good stuff done, groups like AZSFW/AZSFWC are a big waste of energy that would be better spent helping wildlife. If all of these old school people are as well meaning as they claim, they will help us clear the field of the AZSFW and AZSFWC, until they are gone there will be a Grand Canyon sized canyon between us.

 

And one more thing.....HB 2072 had NO redeeming qualities, nada, zero. It was a completely stupid bill introduced in a completely stupid way. There is nothing there worth rewriting or revisiting. TOTAL GARBAGE. Any claim to the contrary is laughable. The language of the bill was dumb, the concepts of the bill were even dumber, the economic claims were so inflated as to be a joke.

 

Ryan

[AZ402]

Wow, just wow......

[Bugler]

I guess I must've been influenced by an anti posing on this site to take their side. Problem with that theory is that most know the people railing against the azsfw group and have hunted at one time or another with them or seen pics of them with animals here etc etc.

I didn't get that part it sounded like we were totally influenced by antis to take on the azsfw and their crusade. Why do I constantly feel like the azsfw and their crusaders talk down to me?

[krp]

This means more than sitting behind a keyboard.

 

you forgot... in your pajamas, sipping a latte, from the latest Greenpeace 'save a whale' eco-cup collection...

 

just say'n...

 

Kent

[TLH]

I bet i can guess who this is....but i will keep it to myself. Most of what you write is not even close to being true--some of what you say is dead on but not much.

 

It is people like yourself that keep dividing us--stop defending a bad thing and start working with all of us!

[SirRoyal]

Man, Silentdog is long winded!

[elkaholic]

whats hb1270 anyway -

 

kinda like any business - you can get pats on the back from past accomplishments and remember when you did this but when you screw up you get your butt chewed out and a warning - you screw up the second time - no questions no B.S. you get a check and your walking papers .

 

azsfw is at he last stage - they had a chance to drop it but they werent satisfied and pushed agin. they need to go - no way anyone is gonna trust them.

 

All those responsable for the second push belonging to organizations who were against 2072 need to step down or be removed from boards . guess ya can't fire them and a butt chewing will do nothing .

 

People will be less likely to join an organization if they feel the leaders do not have their views and interests , especially- TRUST.

[Bugler]

+1 elk