couesdeerhntr Report post Posted October 12, 2011 What's up with the increase of tags in unit thirty three and other units. Was in there last year for the opening of the first rifle hunt and it was a mad house camps and trucks everywhere. And its only going to be worse this year hope they don't keep increasing. Is it a money thing or thru there field servers they have seen an increase in deer? Just wondering how and why they increase deer tags? Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Redman Report post Posted October 12, 2011 Tags have gone up by 20 (650 to 670), then 30 (670 to 700) a year in the last two years in 33. Just start hunting on Sunday when most hunters leave and you have a great hunt with a lot less people. Opportunity vs quality.... Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
AzHuntingAddict Report post Posted October 12, 2011 I will be up there for the oct 21 hunt, and am not looking forward to the mass population. 33 seems to be the cash cow for the game and fish dept since its close to the valley, both tucson and phoenix. I like the idea of heading up later in the week. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Tines Report post Posted October 12, 2011 Lots of deer in 33, that's no secret. Game and Fish obviously know this too. Which is why there's an increase in tags. Based on the increase in tags and success rates, they're assuming that a few extra bucks will be shot compared to previous years (not that big of a deal to them). 33 is a giant unit. Lots of country to hunt. Even then, it can be difficult to get away from other hunters. The problem I see is the "bottleneck" issues that more permits will create. Those who get frustrated because they run into a ton of hunters every year, be prepared, it's only going to get worse. Even if deer numbers are up, 90% of hunters CAN'T (or won't) access 50% of the deer. Many hunters will hit the popular areas in ANY unit where roads go through premium country. My advice, scout a LOT. If you can't, apply for the December tag and have the unit to yourself.... Frustrating, huh? Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
couesdeerhntr Report post Posted October 12, 2011 Yes very frustrating and yes I do go to areas were there are lots of hunters and I do try and get away but what's frustrating is u scout out an area before a hunt and u think u are getting away from everyone but come the hunt it is very hard to get away from a hunter when the hunt starts. If I had horses or mules would be a different story but when it come to hiking on your own someone else can hoof it just as far as you can and no matter how far you go u have to start from a road and it will always lead you to someone and with 700 hundred tags plus the people helping hunt you are bound to run into someone, just wish they would let the deer population grow and maybe ev en give the deer a chance by making an antler rule like they have to be a two point or bigger what do you guys think about that Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
couesdeerhntr Report post Posted October 12, 2011 And I feel if you have a deer management like that for one will be more bucks and a better hunt over time with better deer management. With more opportunities over time for bigger bucks and more deer. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
scoutm Report post Posted October 12, 2011 Look at the bright side guys with 700 tags you're probably looking at over 1,000+ people in the field at the same time. The deer are going to be so pressured they're going to be running around all day long. As long as you can shoot effectively at deer running all out you will have no problems. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Tines Report post Posted October 13, 2011 An antler restriction probably won't happen (nor do I feel it would help THIS particular issue) but to address it further, I'll share some thoughts based on what you've mentioned. Try venturing off into new areas that don't get as much pressure. Maybe you'll see less deer but I don't think I've ever NOT found deer in all of the places I've been in 33. That being said, some of those "high pressure" areas have little pockets that will always hold deer. But even when you have deer all to yourself in a pocket, I know how obnoxious it can be to have hunters all around within sight of you. But if you hunt in those high traffic areas, think outside the box and look into places that might not be easily glassed, even if they're "close to a road". You might reconsider just WHEN you go into the field as well. Middle of the week will always produce less hunter traffic. I realize some people might not have this luxury but it is generally more quality time spent in the field. A few yrs ago I found an area in the preseason that was literally crawling with deer. I glassed up 65 wt (14 bucks) from one spot in 4 hrs in an area down south and I was pretty dang excited for my December hunt. Only to find out that about 20 camps and hunters would be littered all through there during the first 3 general hunts. It's depressing but it is what it is. In fact, a good buddy of mine mentioned "I wouldn't step foot in there at all before the season starts because that area will depress you." I ended up shooting a good buck in that area on the 2nd week of my December hunt. So I guess the hunters didn't find ALL of the bucks... Good luck... Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
couesdeerhntr Report post Posted October 13, 2011 Ya I guess I need to work on shooting at some moving targets lol. I think maybe they should give a antler restriction a try and see what happen I bet they would do alot better and blow up in population because there is no doe hunts Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
200"mulie Report post Posted October 13, 2011 there are lots of deer and lots of hunters....but many hunters dont push into to hard or even get of the road.....i know scoutibg and helping my buddy archery deer hunt in 2 canyons we saw....14 bucks....most of them forks two 3x3 and couple spikes an that is only a tiny portion but they dont need that many tags in there just makes the hunters step all ovr each other runing wachothers hunts and makes deer shut down. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
MattMan Report post Posted October 19, 2011 The intent is to create as much "hunter opportunity" as possible for each hunt, while harvesting as few deer as possible. It ain't rocket science. 33 had too many tags in 2000, before Oct WT was even popular... But I gotta wonder why you applied again this year if you thought there were too many tags last year? Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
gotcoues Report post Posted October 19, 2011 It was my understanding G & F is trying to keep success rates low and will continue to increase tags until sucesss rates are where they want them. This would just be one element in tag allocation obviously. Does any know the success % they are content with. I remember thinking it was really really low. 15 or 20% maybe? Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
MattMan Report post Posted October 19, 2011 Unless a hunt is in the AMP, which is the "Alternative Management Plan", you're correct. I think the target success rate might well be 0. They want to put as many hunters in the field as they can while harvesting relatively similar numbers of deer, and in many units they've passed the curve, and could likely just go with OTC 4 day hunts, sell 10,000 tags for each unit, and not kill any more deer than they are now. With everyone in the field at once, it might even get a little dicey for the hunters, and approach dangerous game hunting on the thrill factor. They're giving us what everyone wanted in the surveys from a few years ago... "Increased opportunity" with "decreased hunt quality". Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
couesdeerhntr Report post Posted October 19, 2011 I am always there helping my cousin or friends hunt during the opener .it is a great unit with good deer and I feel I have a good chance in taking out a decent deer and It is we're I spend most of my time during archery season. A lot less hunters . Just seven hundred tags is getting up there in my eyes and ya if u increase the tags the success rate will give you a lower percentage with mOre people in the field but there is still more deer taken out of the unit it just looks lower on paper. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
AZLance Report post Posted October 20, 2011 33 is still one of the units that if you do your homework you wont see anyone else on your hunt. Last year I guided on the Oct and Nov hunt and we didn't even see any other hunters where we were hunting. I also had the late nov hunt and again saw no other hunters. These were three different areas in 33 and we never saw another hunter. We were successful on each hunt. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
