does anybody know this person?

[donniedent]

Just got a call from a friend of mine who is still hunting. Reported that he helped someone track a bull yesterday morning. Evidently the hunter made a bad shot, in the hind quarter. My friend saw the hunter shortly after the shot, while the hunter was sitting down planning to wait for 30-45 minutes to commence his tracking. My friend offered to help. Well good news, the hunter was really lucky, apparently hit the bull's main artery in the back end and it bled out in about 400 yards. Funny how things work out, even with poor shooting, when fellow hunters help each other.

 

 

Yep, thats the whole point isn't it? Your friend sounds like someone I'd like to know is in the same woods as me.

[Younghunter]

And you will feel better about yourself than some rich guy trying to fill a void in his life by shooting some huge elk to give himself a false sense of accomplishment.

 

Are we really gonna start the class warfare buisness. This has nothing to do with how much money someone has. The only guy that we know for sure had a guide was Craig. It was never stated that the Bowtech guy had a guide, it was only stated that he had a group. Guides are not the issue guys, the issue is the true motivation of alot hunters these days. Guides provide a service. Ask any guide and he will tell you the hunter has the last call, if he wants to pull the trigger on a rag horn its the hunters choice. Its also the hunters choice to hold out for a 400" bull. If Bowtech was being guided, he could have stopped the whole thing with one word as soon as he saw that Craig shot and wounded the bull.

 

Money, guides blah blah blah... it has zero to do with it. If hunters weren't willing to pay trophy fees it would be a non-issue! Guides provide a service plain and simple. Its their job to give you what you want.

 

I guess when you have more money your ethics somehow disolve???

 

Retarded!

 

Whoa must have hit close to home with you!!! I never even mentioned anything about guides. And yes ethics do go down when more money is involved. Ever heard the saying," Money is the root of all evil"? It wasnt me who made that saying.

 

And also this is a website to tell stories, express opinions, and show pics. Sorry if you dont agree with me, but then again you dont have to and i could care less if you do or dont.

 

I just thought I would point out that money is not the root of all evil, "The love of money is the root of all evil.

[elkaholic]

lets move past the money - back to eating crow

heres some simple instructions '' if needed

 

 

Instructions

 

1

Decide to enjoy it. Whether you have to eat crow all time or if it is your first experience eating crow, you can still choose to enjoy the experience. It will only be as bad as you allow it to be.

 

2

Brush it off. Many people will take pleasure with the experience of watching you eat crow. Smart aleck words, funny faces--they will pull out every trick in the book to make you feel as small as the period at the end of this sentence. Do not let them do that to you. Decide that no one can embarrass you. No one can make you anything less than you are. This is your crow. You decide how big or small it is.

 

3

Laugh at yourself. The more you joke about it the less ammo others have to hit you with. When you eat crow it is up to you how it goes down. Laughter will grease the palate but bitterness will be like a dam in your throat. Take charge of your crow and wash it down with some laughter and zest for life.

 

4

Promise yourself that you will never ever eat crow again. When it is all said and done eating crow sucks. Do not let all those people that love to watch you flounder in embarrassment who reveled in your shame ever get to experience that again. From now on the crow will be theirs to eat. They will be the ones who are ashamed and embarrassed. You will be the one laughing and mocking and making the biting comments. They will get theirs! They will eat their own big fat stinky crow!

 

it doesn't go down easy for most people

 

[muzzlehunter75]

Firt of all the crow in the mouth, that's some funny shoot! Second my buddy and I were hunting cow elk, and my buddy hit a cow with his bow, a little far back. the cow passed another hunter, and he shot it. I told my buddy by law it's your cow elk, also considering that the other hunter shot it in the ear. My buddy did go ahead, and split the elk with the hunter. the hunter thought he had rights to it. I could not believe my ears, I wanted to tell this guy where to go stick it, but it was my buddy's cow and he is the only one who could make this decision. On the other hand I wouldn't of, unless I made a horriable shot, and knew that the cow wasn't going to die! If he shot the bull, then it's his, no other hunter or guide, has rights to it unless it was a horriable shot, and the bull wasn't going to die. But sounds to me this hunter and guide made him loose this bull. this is my two sense, sorry if i piss anyone off!

[elkaholic]

now hows your take on this !

from the other site ::

 

this was just posted :;

 

I just spoke with someone partially involved with this mess and was told that the bull was recovered on the 3rd day after being shot and was recovered by the "Bowtech" guy.

 

 

senerio; if he found the bull dead - take possession - without game and fish being contacted and investigating kill site etc.- am i right or wrong!

 

under finding sheds/ skulls / etc.

which should mean the bull was killed by craig

 

 

 

very interesting as to what happens now!!

[richardoutwest]

Let me start off with saying this is my first post also and I’m not going to post my resume just because I don’t have a BIG post count. Doesn’t mean I haven’t read this forum for years, Amanda has put together a great site! I usually don’t get involved in forums because of just this.

elkaholic, don’t see you saying anything to the other guys with less than a dozen post counts so long as they agree with you.

I’m not going to try to BS anyone, that’s why I joined this forum, not to defend the other party, he can do that himself (after he gets done hunting) but to try to see a fair trial is being done and not a lynching. We live in America where we have the right to a fair trial with all the facts from both sides. Some here seem to think we live in a third world country or something. Look out your window and you will be seeing the good old Red, White and Blue flying somewhere close to you. That’s part of what our founding fathers died for!

I have no doubt that tjwking is an upright guy either Lark, don’t know the guy personally so I can’t say anything bad about him. I don’t necessarily agree with some of the things he has put on the WWW but that in no way means I hate the guy. I mean if I have a disagreement with someone, that disagreement is between that person and me. If I choose to post it on the WWW first hand (not 2nd) to tell my perception of what happened that’s fine. I personally would not post up detail description of the truck and plates for retaliation from others. Tjwking posted his side and now we should wait till the other hunter has posted before we make our conclusions.

Look what happened with all the Bowtech stuff, people on here and the other forum has this guy as a staff shooter, factory rep or sponsored just because he has a Bowtech sticker in his back window. Like I said, I am going out and buying a Playboy Bunny for my back window and all the chicks will think I’m Hugh Hefner. I will have three chicks half my age, a T.V. show with all the drama we have here but have fun doing it!

Does Bowtech deserve a bad rap like some here have also implied? What about the guy that gets his truck trashed just because he has a Bowtech sticker in his window and was 200 miles from what happened? All starting from people getting just one side of the story or a 2nd hand story on the WWW.

Also look at what happened on the other site. The original poster, posted up 2nd hand info and later had to go back and change his story. To many times people hear something 2nd hand and they think its gospel, same could be said for hearing just one side.

Both Outfitters involved here are upright as are their guides! Trust me when I say that neither Outfitter wants anything to do with this good or bad. Controversy is hard to sell, hunters who book hunts, wants a good hunt with the best opportunity to harvest a trophy, they are not paying for confrontations. Some here are under the impression that only the rich and famous book hunts for Boone and Crockett animals. Many hunters book hunts simply because they do not have the time to scout, they do not know the area that well or at all, not familiar with the species or new to the sport and want to learn.

I sure hope if some of you go to court or on trial for something you may have not done, you get people that are open minded enough to hear your side before condemning you! After all, isn’t that what you would want?

[richardoutwest]

LOL / WOW, no he DID NOT recover the bull. IN FACT HE IS STILL HUNTING as of a couple of minutes ago!

 

Who post this kind of stuff?

 

Wish I would have read this before hanging up!

[elkaholic]

richard -

 

i only took offence to someone new telling everyone on the site - "enough is enough"

 

enough said in my defense of baggering couesnaz.

[couesnaz]

Exactly why I said enough is enough. Are you guys kidding me? Literally just got done talking to the guy. Trust me, he is still hunting.

[donniedent]

I've probably had the biggest mouth on this subject but I think I'm ready to sit back and wait for the whole story. It should be a good one. Can't wait to hear the other side of this one.

[Couzer]

Bump

[AntlerObsession]

Bump

That is funny!

 

I check this thread multiple times daily to see how this all turns out! Please, Bowtech Guy, do not dissappoint! Enough people have chipped in their $.02, Amanda could live off the interest!

 

Here are some highlights of more thoughtful posts:

 

"... sad story to hear a big bull like that getting away."

 

"hope you have better luck the rest of the season and hope these other fellers butts grow shut."

 

"ain't pursuing big game with a vehicle sorta against the law? and why does this guy need a team o' folks to corral this bull for him?"

 

"It's funny to me how you still have only heard one side of the story."

 

"when it's all done and over somebody always ends up bein' millyvanilly and hasta go underground. c'mon other guys. i wanna hear the re-butt-all."

 

"I always wonder why wounded bulls always measure 400"

 

"This is a chance for us as hunters to police our own. If we don't stand up and say what we, as an American culture, think is appropriate and not appropriate who will? There are laws that govern how we are expected to act in the field according to the law but there are no laws that say how we should act as a culture. We set our own standard."

 

" I do NOT think guides are the problem here guys."

 

"We need to stop basing our personal value on what other think of us, and start basing it on what we think of ourselves and teach our kids that same value!"

 

"Mark my words, if we do not police our own, the government will do it for us!"

 

" I do not understand why it is wrong to have this type of issue discussed in this format. Why should we want to condone a sweeping under the rug of such an incident."

 

"In order to avoid unsavory situations such as this, I specifically target small, undersized, antler challenged representatives of the species I am hunting. It saves me so much trouble."

 

"4 Steps to Properly Eat Crow"

 

"I believe an ethical guide should say he has no interest in being part of such unethical conduct. Now some will say the client is always right and that he has paid the guide to do as he asks, but to that I say bs! A guide or outfitter should not check his ethical standards out the door simply because his client has none. "

 

"This is a discussion forum and this is a very important topic that absolutely needs to be discussed."

 

"Your friend sounds like someone I'd like to know is in the same woods as me."

 

If this is what's being said on the forum, what is being said by PM? My imagination is running wild!

 

Good stuff! Hopefully the second side of the story is catching up on what he's missed and is getting ready to post!

[archeryhuntingnut]

On eating crow, if that happens so be it, but really doubt that is ever going to happen with respect to this story. Those associated with DBLUNG or the BowTech group have speculated about how a completely different story will be told once their associates get back from hunting. Okay here is some more speculation , based on how quickly Richardoutwest Or Couesnaz were able to confirm his associates had not recovered bull, shortly after that post about the same was made, it tells me DBLUNG and his BowTech group are in fact able to access the web and if they wanted to, could have already responded, but do not want to. More speculation, they are concerned that if they do so, whatever they say, Craig will provide a further response, with more factual details, which will put them in even a worse bad light. Yes I speculate that DBLUNG and the Bowteh group are hoping in the worst way that people grow tired of this thread and story, lose interest in it, and that it simply fades away. The last thing the want to do is to attempt to make up a story to justify their conduct. At least that is my speculation. If I have guessed wrong, I will simply eat a second helping of crow, but I truly do not think that is going to happen.

[sjvcon]

Hoo boy!!! I haven't seen this much back and forth since TAM posted the picture of his 4+ years in the waiting Lion Mount, which someone aptly named "the Pink Panther"...man that thing still gives me nightmares!!!

 

I like to hear both sides of the story before I decide what I am going to believe, so hopefully we'll see the other side soon ... I hate waiting.

 

All that said, I know there is a lot of unethical crap that has gone on in the recent past ... usually centering around someone's "Trophy Animal". Blocking trails, slashing tires, sitting someone other than the hunter on a bedded animal all night to say their hunter "got there first".

 

Hope that kind of crap hasn't made it's way to Arizona ... certainly not how I am teaching my boys to hunt. Hunting is about hard work, respect, an ethical code, and skill. Right is right. Wrong is wrong. PERIOD. And we all know which is which. I agree with the guy who said we need to police our own ... and educate our own too.

 

I'll wait to form an opinion on the current thread until I see when/if the other side ever gets posted.

[donniedent]

"hope you have better luck the rest of the season and hope these other fellers butts grow shut."

 

 

I think that statement is my absolute favorite!

 

I didn't go back and read through to find who said it but it sounds a littl like Lark.

 

And THIS one is probably the best rebuttle to one of my comments.

 

"I believe an ethical guide should say he has no interest in being part of such unethical conduct. Now some will say the client is always right and that he has paid the guide to do as he asks, but to that I say bs! A guide or outfitter should not check his ethical standards out the door simply because his client has none. "