The Future of Wolves in Arizona

[Pine Donkey]

Bill Quimby started a topic about wolves he had recently seen. It appears that many people have been seeing an increasing number of wolves in Arizona. The topic of wolf management has been debated before, but I want to open it up again. Below is a letter written by David Allen of the Rocky Mountain Elk Foundation to the Defenders of Wildlife and the Western Wildlife Consevancy. Although this letter is based on wolves on northern states, the issue is applicable to Arizona, and the Mexican Gray Wolf. I am very pleased to see the Elk Foundation go on the offensive against these groups and challenge them to backup thier own actions with fact rather than rhetoric.

 

What are some of the thoughts from CWT members?

 

 

RMEF_Ltr._Defndrs4.10_1_.pdf

[DesertBull]

anyone else think that there are actually more wolves in AZ/NM than what they are telling us?

[AZelkhunter]

suposedly the numbers of wolves in arizona are going down

[bowhuntaz1]

anyone else think that there are actually more wolves in AZ/NM than what they are telling us?

 

I believe there are more... There are not radio collars on EVERY wolf out there. they are pack animals, and some leave on their own or by force and start new packs... Dont get me wrong, I loved it when I saw a couple in unit 27 a few years ago, but I dont want the heard #'s to drop. Its hard enough to get a tag now, what about when my children start putting in for the draw.?.?.?

[Poppa Cap]

Well, speaking from experience, the wolf biologists and the wolfs are NOT being honest with each other. This spring my buddy and I were coyote hunting between Eagar and Vernon. WE saw a BLACK wolf. I tried to do the responsible thing and called the biologist in Alpine. She told me there was no such thing as a BLACK Mexican wolf. Either she didn't know what she was talking about or the wolf knows something she didn't.

 

I will not call anymore sightings in. Far as I am concerned, I seen a black wolf

. Seems to me the wolf biologists are not being truthful with what they know. I know this is the case in my situation. It may not have been a MEXICAN wolf, but it was a wolf. He was alone and no collar. She was not even willing to think about what I thought I saw. This has really made me rethink my opinion of the wolf program. I think that there are more wolves than we are being told about.

[ac guy]

Met the wolf girl at jr turkey camp in 1/27. She's hardheaded, but believes in what she is doing. I'll give her credit, for going to a camp where 90% of the people disagree with her, although she did make the mistake of having some less than flattering remarks about ranchers. IMO, man is part of nature, and decided long ago wolves were no longer needed here. Big waste of funds.

[.270]

when they released the wild wolves in the yellowstone area in just a couple months they were pretty much on their own and doing fine. they were wild animals. didn't take em long to start killin' the heck outta things. and the usfw still lied and hid facts and did all kindsa dishonest crap to keep them on the endangered list, because they didn't want to lose the control they had gained. now they have also done real damage to the other animal populations in those areas, because of the unchecked preying the were allowed to do. but because they had wild animals to start with, it worked.

 

at roughly the same time the so called mexican wolf was released. (it ain't really a wolf because they are all part dog). they have been coddled, fed, doctored, moved, watched over in every way, and they are no closer to having a sustainable population than they did when they started. they are like the mikah waddeh of the dog family. if they would have released a buncha dogs at the same time, and forgot about em, the dogs would be taking care of themselves by now, because they aren't a crossbred, inbred, babied bunch of worthless critters, like the "wolves". the mexican wolf program is, and always will be, a waste of time and money and a lie. the mexican wolf is extinct. there will never be a sustainable population. they are looked after by stupid people. they are a stupid animal with little wild left in them. the entire program is never going to be anything more than an expensive burden on folks that like to use the land. anyone who is involved in the program is basically a liar as far as i'm concerned, because it's well proven it can't and won't work and they know it. Lark.

[Pine Donkey]

Lark,

 

You need to get past this "beating around the bush" and tell us how you really feel...just kidding

 

Seriously, I agree with you that this is an over priced scam that was doomed before it started due to the fact that the wolves are hybridized. I know one individual who is looking to shoot a wolf, then push the genetic issue in court. He plans to demand a DNA test because you can't be guilty of shooting an endangered species if all you shot was a wild mutt that might have a spoonful or two of wolf blood.

 

I recently read (maybe in the AZ republic) that each wolf now in the estimated population has cost the USFWS $180,000. Thats your tax money at work.

[youngbuck]

There has to be more than what they say. Ive seen one in 27, without a collar a few years ago. I also saw the biggest, darkest coyote varmint callin in heavy snow near young. I still think it was a wolf but thats an awfully long ways from where "they are". There was a couple 3 feet of snow and a ways from any houses, near the air strip. I see where man has taken the place of the wolf as far as regulating numbers of "prey animals"; elk deer ect. We can be more precise in what, when, where, and how many we are taking. I do see a reason for wolves to exhist, just not here and now. In the middle of Alaska where man doesnt play a large role in regulating animal desities, sure.

[azslim]

got nothing nice to say about how the Endangered Species act has been bastardized to support a viewpoint that end goal is to eliminate hunting by the average citizen because they don't like it, "science be damned we'll just shop around until we find a Judge that sees things the way we do".......

[billrquimby]

You've asked for opinions, and here's mine.

 

I have no problem with wolves being reintroduced as long as they will be managed as we do other large wildlife. That includes regulated recreational hunting whenever state wildlife managers deem it necessary.

 

Unfortunately, there are people who would like to see predators strictly protected and eventually used to replace hunting by humans. I draw the line at that, as well as the dumb proposal that pops up every few years to reintroduce grizzly bears to Arizona/New Mexico.

 

Bill Quimby

[Ringer]

I was hunting the WM elk hunt a couple of years ago and had two wolves walk close to where I was set up. One was normal color and the other was almost black so I do believe what you are saying. I talked to the Apache G&F guy and he was not surprised that they were there. Didn't look anything like any coyote I ever saw. Neither one had a collar so I also wonder if they even know how many are surviving.

[.270]

there might not be any such thing as a black mexican gray. but it's just the dog popping out in these things that gives em the color phase. one more thing, wolf people all voted for obamanation too. Lark.

[born2bhuntin]

anyone heard the term "start shoveling" I am not in anyway condoning this !

[Rembrant]

Natural selection is a big part of evolution. Animals that are tough and cunning enough to survive invironmental changes get to propagate and the ones that can't cut it dissapear.

I would think that most of our wolf lovers are Darwinians.

The Mexican Wolf couldn't cut it and it dissapeared. Why would a Darwinian work so hard against what they believe in.

They would say that man's intervention in the natural system was the cause of the wolf decline. So, man's intervention should reverse the problem? What man ain't natural?

 

Mike