Seeing Deer but confused...?

[Hunter1432]

Hi everyone,

 

I have been reading posts on here since I became interested in coues hunting this spring but this is my first post. I am from the midwest and have hunted deer my entire life but not like you guys hunt down here. To try to get myself up to speed I purchased the coues book recommnded by so many and have been out scouting 5 times already (my season is in December).

 

I was hoping to get some more advice and/or recommendations from the experts that participate in this forum. I am hunting unit 34A and have seen at least 4 does every time I have been out scouting, but they always seem to be in different places( top of hills, bottom of ravines, water holes, etc.) So I am having a hard time trying to pattern these animals.

 

Where is the best place to look in the morning, midday, afternoon, evening? For example, last weekend I was spotting on a southern facing slope in the morning, looking into the bedding areas on a northern facing slope. Is this typically a good idea, or should I sit on the wooded side looking into the open? Another thing that confused me was about 20 minutes after sunset I saw a doe and a fawn up on top of a large open hill, the next morning I saw a two does on the bottom of that same hill (1/2 to 1 mile away) in the bottom of a ravine...I just thought that a deer would be close to bedding so late and would be close to that same bedding area early in the morning (~sunrise)...?

 

Just looking for some general advice on what you have all noticed when hunting. Thanks for any help you can give me.

 

Jason

[AZP&Y]

Jason,

 

You are right - Az is not the midwest. Not even close. You're on the right path. I hope you say when you're looking - you are using a tripod and the highest/clearest power binocs you can afford. It's the norm for the grey ghost.

 

Here is a topic from days past- Coosefan put some real nice graphics on there. Check it out...

 

http://forums.coueswhitetail.com/forums/in...5&hl=slopes

 

Also use the CWT search engine and put in there 'slopes'. That should give you more than an evenings worth of reading

 

34A is a solid unit with some quality coues bucks!- Good Luck!

 

AzP&Y

[Snapshot]

Confusion is not allowed, it leads to the dark side of the force

 

34A is a great unit, and you will find deer from the valley floor all the way to the top of the mountains.

 

The following information is from the Arizona Game & Fish Department Hunt unit information. It is always a good place to get some general hunting unit information for various species.

 

White-tailed Deer

Overview: Unit 34A has an average population of whitetail this year. The majority of bucks seen will be in the one to two year age classes but there are older class bucks available to the hunter that puts in the effort at pre-season scouting. There are average densities of whitetail in many areas of the Santa Rita Mountains and the foothills.

 

Get out for some scouting to sharpen your eyes and to find the hideouts of those wily old bucks. It is a good idea to do some pre-season scouting not only to find the deer but also to also check and make sure access is still available for your favorite hunting grounds.

Area: The best numbers are in the southern end of the mountains but you can also expect a lot of hunters in small amounts of area between private property as the area is popular. The Squaw Gulch area on the southwest corner of the mountain is also good. If you hike in at least 1/2 mile away from the road you will get away from most hunters. The country on the west side of the Temporal drainage has good numbers of deer. The 72 road goes past the trailhead at the Arizona trail parking lot and accesses Temporal Gulch or the Mansfield canyon area via the 72A road . The thicker cover areas from Mansfield Canyon and south harbor a few older age class bucks.

 

 

The Fort and Hog Canyon areas are favorites of many hunters. The traditional entrance off of Highway 82 is not public access and has been posted by the homeowner's association. Please respect landowner rights and use the alternative access. Access is through Garner Canyon. To get there, exit Highway 83 at Gardner Canyon. Follow this road to the west to Forest Road 795. Take the 795 Road to Forest Road 4111. The 4111 road will take you south into Hog Canyon. You can glass some good habitat along the way.

 

Forest Road 143 on the southwest side of the Santa Rita Mountains goes through some excellent whitetail habitat. Also, Josephine and Bond Canyons are good but be prepared for steep country. For those wanting a little more level hunting, try the State land southwest of Josephine Canyon and F.S. road 143. But be aware that white-tail and Mule deer can occupy the same habitat in these lowland areas.

 

Upper Sawmill Canyon, east of Madera Canyon has some good whitetail hunting. A good way to get to the high country there is to come in on the east side of the mountains to F.S. road 165 into Melendrez Pass and hunt down into Sawmill. This method provides excellent glassing opportunities. To get to the 165 road you will need to take Highway 83 south to the Gardner canyon turnoff (forest road 92) and go west. Take the Fish Canyon road number 163 and follow it past Kentucky camp. The road will continue west and then north, intersecting forest road 165 which will take you west to Melendrez Pass.

 

A new access road was constructed in 1997. This road provides legal access into the Big Casa Blanca and Wood canyon areas. To get there take State Highway 82 to mile marker 25.5 (approximately 5 miles east of Patagonia), and follow the Casa Blanca Canyon road to the northwest. After about 3.5 miles look for a road heading to the north. Follow this road to the crest of the ridge. The road will then travel east and take you into Wood Canyon.

 

Summary: Two key things are to be remembered. First, pick up a Forest Service map to find the above-mentioned roads and canyons. Second, don't forget your binoculars. For whitetail hunting they are as important as your rifle.

 

The early hunt will be pretty warm so get out early in the morning to catch them before they bed up. They will begin to bed shortly after the sun comes up unless we get some cool weather during the hunt.

 

The middle hunt will be cooler and the deer should stay up later but you still will increase your chance of success if you are heading out of camp at the first hint of light or sooner. Remember that deer also have a mid-day flurry of activity around noon to 1:00 p.m. It's a good time to be on a high point glassing.

 

The late hunt will be cool to cold weather. The bucks will be starting to chase the does and will be more visible. It is always a high hunt success time as the bucks are moving more. You will not find high hunter densities during this hunt.

[Hunter1432]

I am using the best binos and spotting scope I can afford right now. A $40 pair of bushnells from Walmart and a Barska spotting scope.

 

I am hunting the northern part of 34A because the Fish and Game site said that it sees less hunting pressure and its closer to my house in Green Valley so I can get out for quick scouting sessions.

 

I have been impressed with the amount of doe I have seen given my inexperience spotting skills. Is there a general technique for areas to glass in the morning or afternoon?

[Snapshot]

The northern half of 34A may get less pressure, but there is an abundance of roads, jeep trails, and old mining roads that are a magnet to the road hunting crowds and it see's alot of ATV acitivity as well.

 

During this time of year and the warmer hunts, you will want to glass the shady side of the ridges and or mountain, as the deer will not spend as much time in the direct sunlight as they will in cooler weather. Glass areas around ridgelines a nd saddles or cuts that are natural travel corridors to feed and bed.

 

I have also seen whitetail bed right in the thicker trees and vegitation on the desert floor

 

 

[POJV]

You may also wish to scout Fagan mountain, if you walk the draw’s up from Fagan lake toward the tops you can see many deer, but again the ones at the lower elevations will be younger; also be aware as there are mule deer in the area and they do not read the regulations as to what altitude they should be at.

Phil

 

[25-06]

Confusion is not allowed, it leads to the dark side of the force

 

34A is a great unit, and you will find deer from the valley floor all the way to the top of the mountains.

 

White-tailed Deer

Overview: Unit 34A has an average population of whitetail this year. The majority of bucks seen will be in the one to two year age classes but there are older class bucks available to the hunter that puts in the effort at pre-season scouting. There are average densities of whitetail in many areas of the Santa Rita Mountains and the foothills.

 

Get out for some scouting to sharpen your eyes and to find the hideouts of those wily old bucks. It is a good idea to do some pre-season scouting not only to find the deer but also to also check and make sure access is still available for your favorite hunting grounds.

Area: The best numbers are in the southern end of the mountains but you can also expect a lot of hunters in small amounts of area between private property as the area is popular. The Squaw Gulch area on the southwest corner of the mountain is also good. If you hike in at least 1/2 mile away from the road you will get away from most hunters. The country on the west side of the Temporal drainage has good numbers of deer. The 72 road goes past the trailhead at the Arizona trail parking lot and accesses Temporal Gulch or the Mansfield canyon area via the 72A road . The thicker cover areas from Mansfield Canyon and south harbor a few older age class bucks.

 

 

The Fort and Hog Canyon areas are favorites of many hunters. The traditional entrance off of Highway 82 is not public access and has been posted by the homeowner's association. Please respect landowner rights and use the alternative access. Access is through Garner Canyon. To get there, exit Highway 83 at Gardner Canyon. Follow this road to the west to Forest Road 795. Take the 795 Road to Forest Road 4111. The 4111 road will take you south into Hog Canyon. You can glass some good habitat along the way.

 

Forest Road 143 on the southwest side of the Santa Rita Mountains goes through some excellent whitetail habitat. Also, Josephine and Bond Canyons are good but be prepared for steep country. For those wanting a little more level hunting, try the State land southwest of Josephine Canyon and F.S. road 143. But be aware that white-tail and Mule deer can occupy the same habitat in these lowland areas.

 

Upper Sawmill Canyon, east of Madera Canyon has some good whitetail hunting. A good way to get to the high country there is to come in on the east side of the mountains to F.S. road 165 into Melendrez Pass and hunt down into Sawmill. This method provides excellent glassing opportunities. To get to the 165 road you will need to take Highway 83 south to the Gardner canyon turnoff (forest road 92) and go west. Take the Fish Canyon road number 163 and follow it past Kentucky camp. The road will continue west and then north, intersecting forest road 165 which will take you west to Melendrez Pass.

 

A new access road was constructed in 1997. This road provides legal access into the Big Casa Blanca and Wood canyon areas. To get there take State Highway 82 to mile marker 25.5 (approximately 5 miles east of Patagonia), and follow the Casa Blanca Canyon road to the northwest. After about 3.5 miles look for a road heading to the north. Follow this road to the crest of the ridge. The road will then travel east and take you into Wood Canyon.

 

Summary: Two key things are to be remembered. First, pick up a Forest Service map to find the above-mentioned roads and canyons. Second, don't forget your binoculars. For whitetail hunting they are as important as your rifle.

 

The early hunt will be pretty warm so get out early in the morning to catch them before they bed up. They will begin to bed shortly after the sun comes up unless we get some cool weather during the hunt.

 

The middle hunt will be cooler and the deer should stay up later but you still will increase your chance of success if you are heading out of camp at the first hint of light or sooner. Remember that deer also have a mid-day flurry of activity around noon to 1:00 p.m. It's a good time to be on a high point glassing.

 

The late hunt will be cool to cold weather. The bucks will be starting to chase the does and will be more visible. It is always a high hunt success time as the bucks are moving more. You will not find high hunter densities during this hunt.

There ya go hunter1432

[bowhuntaz1]

be aware as there are mule deer in the area and they do not read the regulations as to what altitude they should be at.

Phil

 

ha ha laugh my a@@ off!!!

 

[Jimmer Negamanee]

I think you’re less confused than you think. Keep glassing with the optics you have while you save, save, save, for high end glass. (But make sure what you have is on a tri-pod.) Someone on here, and I don’t know who it was (maybe many people), said "If you buy the best, you only cry once."

 

But in the meantime, keep doing what you’re doing. You’re getting your eyes used to seeing deer and, more importantly, parts of deer. Although optics are important, I know many people who grew up out here and who through years of scrambling around the hills and canyons, learned the skill and patience to glass up more deer with two coke bottles duck taped together than I can through my used, but “high end” glass. You’re getting invaluable practice.

 

I’m from the Midwest too (Michigan). The transition to Western hunting is not easy but is worth it. In the West, we have vast expanses of public lands where you never have to ask permission to hunt. The density of animals is lower and the earth seems naked without out all the foliage but it is a rugged beauty that you will grow to love. Enjoy the West. Enjoy the wildlands. Enjoy the freedom!

 

(But don’t listen to me. I have only one coues deer to my credit. And it was a spike, a tasty, tasty, spike.)

 

[jakehaffey]

If your seeing a lot of does then your doing great. It is a great unit and you have a great tag. The bucks will show up once the rut kicks in and that should be right around your hunt. Im guessing the tail end of your hunt will be the best time. Good luck!

[Hunter1432]

Thanks for all the advice everyone, its good to hear that I am not on the completely wrong path.

 

Currently I am scouting the northern part of 34A in Altitudes between 4500-5500ft. I found 3 or 4 water holes but do you think that these waterholes will last until December or will they dry up? My first time to the unit was in late May and at least two of those holes were empty then I didnt' get a chance to see the other two...

 

Also, what is the minimum distance I should camp from a prospective hunting area 1 mile? 2 miles? 5 miles or more?

 

Snapshot, do you think the ATV crowd is a major concern to my hunt? I noticed quite a bit of traffic but was hoping that it would die down over the winter months...maybe I'm wrong?

 

Thanks again for the great advice

[Snapshot]

The nicer the weather gets the more traffic you will see on the roads in there. But do not worry. Get a couple of ridges or canyons away from the roads and you will be fine.

 

I like to camp in an area where I can hike right from camp to my spots without having to drive. A mile away is a good start

 

Do you have the third hunt or the late December hunt?

[Jessedr]

When I go in to a area I go to map Quest. and print out a map of the area. It don't show what roads are closed or give the FOREST ROAD#. But it helps till I can get a State land and Forest Map. Of that area.

[joeybari]

You’re on the right track

As far as hunting over water holes during your hunt I would not put more then a day or two into it bcs you have a late hunt and there is a lot of moisture in the food that they are eating and the bucks are in the rut not thinking about water and food. You can try to position yourself so that when you glass you maybe able to see that water hole at different times of the glassing process.

That being said glass glass glass that is key. Most Coues deer hunters that are successful use height powered glass. 10*50 is a good start but 12*56 or 15 * 56 are a bit better. Good clear binos are very helpful to see our small gray deer. A tripod is also key and extremely helpful. The lighter weight ones are nice so that if you’re walking a distance to your spot you won’t be dead tried before the hunt starts.

As for trying to finger out what Coues deer or doing good luck I don’t think anyone really knows for sure. So many ideas out there and they are all right but is hard to put the finger on the one thing they do all the time day in and day out. I think that is what the allure to Coues deer hunting is try to finger out Your hunt, your unit, your style, your strategy.

Good luck

 

Dollar amounts $

Binos $200 to $2500

Tripod $50 to $450

Tripod head $25 to $300

Gun $150 to skies the limit

Scope $150 to $2900 or more

Clothing $60 to $500

Pack filled $50 to $500 pack water food knife ……….

Range finder $100 to $500

Bullets $15 to $60

GPS $300 to $500

Gas $100 to $500

Camping EQ $55 to $2000

Coues deer in your truck priceless

Wife finding out what you really spent on your hunt instead of her DEADLY

 

 

[Hunter1432]

My hunt is the late December hunt...I feel pretty fortunate hitting it on my first attempt From what I hear it will give me the best chances and I prefer it colder too, so thats nice.

 

Do you think the deer will keep to the same general areas and trails in October as in December? I understand the rut can change things, but generally speaking, they don't move higher or lower in elevation or relocate more than a mile or two, right?

 

Also, does anyone have any advice on camouflage for the higher elevations in the Santa Ritas? Most of my camo was made for hardwood forests, not the more open ridges encountered here.