Driving at Prime Time

[Coach]

I'm helping out a good friend on a 3A/3C archery bull hunt. I'm not a licensed guide and I don't get anything from helping out a buddy besides the extra experience in the field and the hopes that I can be a part in helping a VERY deserving guy get a good bull.

 

So, my main "job" lately has been to sit up high and glass certain areas and let my buddies know if anything good is going on in a particular area. Like most of AZ, this basin has a few 2-track roads. I don't stand to gain a penny if my friend kills, but I'm out there on work days at 4:30 AM listening for bugles and looking for good bulls. What I don't understand is how many "Elmer Fudd" types show up 20 minutes after first light driving through prime elk locations. Just when the area starts getting fired up, some numb-nutz inevitably shows up driving and calling - usually without even turning off the engine. It's crazy. I've seen some really AMAZING bulls from my vantage point prior to the season and almost always find a few 340-350 class bulls looking to clean up any straggling cows. This year, the great bulls are completey gone and the satellites are heading for the thick stuff before shooting light, because so many guys wait until the last minute to drive through, shooting bugles out the truck window.

 

Anyone else seeing this? How can we get the word out that you need to be out of the truck and getting in position AT LEAST a half hour BEFORE light - not cruising the backroads hoping for a window-shot at 6:00 AM?

 

It's infuriating!

[ghost hunter]

They ARE in position. That's the same position you will find them in all day long, unless they are back in town at the local eatery.

[Snapshot]

Unfortunately, it is a common occurance with the "clueless crowd" of hunters.

[Coues Sniper]

They ARE in position. That's the same position you will find them in all day long, unless they are back in town at the local eatery.

+1

The great majority of hunters out there just aren't that serious.

[Switchback]

I'm helping out a good friend on a 3A/3C archery bull hunt. I'm not a licensed guide and I don't get anything from helping out a buddy besides the extra experience in the field and the hopes that I can be a part in helping a VERY deserving guy get a good bull.

 

So, my main "job" lately has been to sit up high and glass certain areas and let my buddies know if anything good is going on in a particular area. Like most of AZ, this basin has a few 2-track roads. I don't stand to gain a penny if my friend kills, but I'm out there on work days at 4:30 AM listening for bugles and looking for good bulls. What I don't understand is how many "Elmer Fudd" types show up 20 minutes after first light driving through prime elk locations. Just when the area starts getting fired up, some numb-nutz inevitably shows up driving and calling - usually without even turning off the engine. It's crazy. I've seen some really AMAZING bulls from my vantage point prior to the season and almost always find a few 340-350 class bulls looking to clean up any straggling cows. This year, the great bulls are completey gone and the satellites are heading for the thick stuff before shooting light, because so many guys wait until the last minute to drive through, shooting bugles out the truck window.

 

Anyone else seeing this? How can we get the word out that you need to be out of the truck and getting in position AT LEAST a half hour BEFORE light - not cruising the backroads hoping for a window-shot at 6:00 AM?

 

It's infuriating!

 

i feel your pain! my dad and I were in a great position last year 3 MILES off the main dirt road when all the sudden we heard a 4 wheeler coming through the chain of meadows right about day break (there was no trail or road).... It is very frustrating as the sport is so popular now and most people you run into now out in the woods don't even have a clue...

 

[Non-Typical Solutions]

Not that the dry lakes in 3A are way off the beaten path, but couple years ago we had a couple of late rifel tags, one was my boy and we had scouted that area out and were happy with the patterns we were able to establish.

 

WOW, opening morning was a circus. People cutting out across that country like it was a freeway. I will never set up there again for opening morning. We did get the satisfaction of watching G$F haul a guy over that was off the beaten path, that was at least a little gratification.

 

You almost have to be in wilderness to avoid that stuff, so many two trackers and those who have no regard for staying on the two trackers.

 

Good luck out there, it can be rough.

[AZantlerhead]

This is something that has worked to my advantage before and can work for you if you know where the game will hole up for the day. The " other kind of hunters" can actually push the animals to where you are sometimes, it's all just part of the game, hunting with EVERYONE else. learn the routes and places the animals will use to evade the " other hunters" and you will be sayin" gee, I hope "shorty" and all 10 off his kin come back, that 10 ft tall, dually, big block,with cherry bombs and bull horn makes the rounds this morning and the bucks/bulls will be here for sure!!!", knowing the deer/elk will head back to their bedrooms early and you can be their waiting......

 

I would suggest packing/ Hikeing 5-10 miles into a roadless, primitive/wilderness area if you don't want to see road hunters , they must wait till 5am to eat at the local diner and tell the waitress what a great white hunter they are before they run the Baja 1000 in the unit you picked . There are a few "wild" units in every state and if you really wanna ditch the guys wearin out their tires instead of boots, you'll have a long hike............. We must all share the country we are working and some will stay on roads(all hours of day and night sometimes) and others will sit on ridges and walk switchbacks till theres no end. There are two kinds of hunters in the world........ Ones that want to actually put in the effort, and ones that simply don't, just like in LIFE. I would actually prefer that the " other hunters" stay in their trucks or on their quads anyway

 

Adapt, Imporovise and Overcome my friend.........

 

I got back to my truck one morning to relocate for the day and just then, at 8 am(lunchtime) this guy drives right through the gate I was parked at and headed into the area I had just walked out of to leave it" untainted for the day". As he drove twenty yards through the gate and waved too me a frigin 10 yr old? kid lifts the Hard Tonneu bed cover he was hideing under(the kind that raise up on struts) and starts " Bow hunting". what some are teaching their kids is simply disgusting.

[russd]

well as i see it at least they won't be killing many animals that way.

[Coach]

AZ Antlerhead - thanks for the response. But, being a local and all, where in 3A/3C can you find a roadless "primitive area" 5-10 miles from any roads? I'm not trying to be a smart-alec. I'd love to find a place like that in this area. We all know it's criss-crossed with roads, some major and some minor, but in reality, I think you would have a heck of a time finding an area in those units that doesn't have at least one fire road going right through the middle of it.

 

I agree with the idea behind your response - getting away from the roads and digging in is what elk hunting is all about. But let's face the facts - anywhere along the rim and the burn beyond into the grasslands is a labyrinth of fire roads, ranch roads and two-tracks that any of us can legally drive on any time we want.

 

I guess I just don't understand the mentality of guys who wait years for a tag then drive around with the heater on jamming tunes and throwing out the occasional bugle, like some 400" bull is going to come sit in the bed asking for headphones to hear the latest country hit.

 

The guy I'm trying to help out has been behind more true AZ throphy bulls than he'd ever admit. He's one of the real "elk gurus" of this state and has some extremely hard-core help at his back - simply because if anyone deserves a great elk harvest due to the decades of helping others filll their tags, he does. OK, sidetracked. The point is, guys, if you're in the field unsure of your next move, please - please, don't just start driving around the backroads. And if you know someone who is inexperienced, try to let them know that giving up and hitting the two-tracks through prime habitat just won't get them what they're looking for, and more importantly might hose someone's setup who was out there long before you ate breakfast. Main roads are obviously going to be full of "plan-B" guys getting from place-to-place because their first setup didn't pan out. That's a given. But for crying out loud, smaller back-roads that happen to skirt or bypass burns and cienegas are not the place to be driving around at first light.

 

With some luck, I'll post pix of a nice bull for this guy. He's already passed on several bulls that make most elk hunters drool. He's a great guy and gives a TON to his community and fellow hunters.

 

Just venting about the road-situation. We'll get 'er done. Great luck to all on their Fall hunts!

[hunterdude]

Yeah I know the feeling I hunted in 6a-s last week and there are a few guys that a number of people knew them as "THE DRUNK GUYS" I had aon a number of occasions that them blowing throught a area spooking the heck out of the elk. I would love to send a stick across the front of their quad and Rhino just to get their attention! I hate guys like that and hope they didn't have any luck better than mine.

[ROCKSLAYER]

i know what your talking about,it has happened to me more times than i can count.i have lived in northern az all my life. i have lived in & hunted this area for well over 35 years.i do not like road hunters, we always called thelm flat lander when i was a kid.as i grew older & got to know some of the southern az hunters ,we found some of thelm to be good ethical hunters with the same ethics & values that we have.what i am trying to say here is that we are all in the same boat.we have way too many people out trying to do the same thing in the same area at the same time.some are experienced,some are not,some are just plain lazy, some just dont know any better.nothings ever gonna be perfect.it will never be the way it was as i was growing up.we all have to learn to deal with the situation.some guys use quads,some do not,some have a hatred twords all quads.i use a quad at times from my camp to go to the area where i will continue my hunt.i chainup my quad & hike from there.did i appreciate having a 3/4 full beer bounce off my head when a f-250 diesel passed me on a two track off of woody moutain rd.yes i did turn around & stop that truck.his his buddys excuse was they hate quads,shouldnt be allowd to use em.coconino sheriffs officer was just as amused as i was.we all need to get along & learn to live with each other.,or were going to let the anti's wildest dreams come true.self destruction

[COUESAZ]

I have seen some great elk and deer taken by road hunters. It truly is a game of chance. We were in 27 a few years ago and a guy that is disabled was driving around roads. This is what he has to do to hunt. He had just driven through the prime areas at prime time. Did not see anything but cows. On his way back to camp on a maintained forest road he had a 350 bull run across the road He was able to pull over and take this fine bull.

 

I have also sat from a high ridge hunting coues deer while some road hunting mule deer hunters killed two big old bucks from road hunting. Just because i do not road hunt does not mean i do not expect it to not be done by others wether they chose to or have to hunt this way. It is all part of the game. Use the preasure to your advantage if you can. There have been road hunters as long as there have been automobiles, Just a fact of hunting that we all have to deal with. I just look at them and think, man if you could see the country i had breakfast, and lunch in. Now the stories of guys driving through meadows and off roads is what makes me sick.

[ROCKSLAYER]

I have seen some great elk and deer taken by road hunters. It truly is a game of chance. We were in 27 a few years ago and a guy that is disabled was driving around roads. This is what he has to do to hunt. He had just driven through the prime areas at prime time. Did not see anything but cows. On his way back to camp on a maintained forest road he had a 350 bull run across the road He was able to pull over and take this fine bull.

 

I have also sat from a high ridge hunting coues deer while some road hunting mule deer hunters killed two big old bucks from road hunting. Just because i do not road hunt does not mean i do not expect it to not be done by others wether they chose to or have to hunt this way. It is all part of the game. Use the preasure to your advantage if you can. There have been road hunters as long as there have been automobiles, Just a fact of hunting that we all have to deal with. I just look at them and think, man if you could see the country i had breakfast, and lunch in. Now the stories of guys driving through meadows and off roads is what makes me sick.

very well said.

[Jessedr]

Couesaz: As rockslayer said right on.

[Packer]

I agree with the idea behind your response - getting away from the roads and digging in is what elk hunting is all about. But let's face the facts - anywhere along the rim and the burn beyond into the grasslands is a labyrinth of fire roads, ranch roads and two-tracks that any of us can legally drive on any time we want.

 

I can definately appreciate your frustration. However, in that unit since the fire most of the roads are "technically" closed. Sure there are still alot of legal roads to drive on but unless it is signed with a white arrow the quads should not be on them. This is about the only area in the white mountains that does not allow cross country travel and where you can only be on roads that are signed open. Regardless of this fact though I know people will still drive there if it is physically possible so the statement you made is true other than the fact that it is not legal where they drive most of the time.

 

Aaron