good news

[bowhunter4life]

looks like were getting 1920 more deer tags.73 more antelope.2281 more elk tags.looks like all this rain this year is helping our biggame in a big way. let it rain baby let it rain..mike

[KGAINES]

I don't want to sound negative but, I don't think the big game population can catch up that fast. Wouldn't it take a couple of good years of rain before there is a noticable increase in the population. If the big game population can handle these added tags ok, but if they are anticipating a population boom it could suck if they are wrong. The truth is they are raising the fees for the residents and non-residents and they are planning on making a buck, thats fine too as long as the animal population don't suffer more than it should.

[hunterdude]

How can they know how good the fawns and calfs will survive the summer when the rains just happened . I think that it would take at least a year to start seeing any difference in the herd size and health. There is still a lot of variables to be looked at I hope they don't over draw our game and end up hurting the herds more.

[GRONG]

Mike it's nothing against you but I'm with Keith on this one. BS on the AZG&F! They should throw themselves a banquet, after this years hunting season ends, for hunting our deer herd into near extinction. All's it is is a business for them, they could give a rats behind about what's good for the herds. They'd give giraffe and elephant tags if someone was stupid enough to buy them. It is truly a shame that they manage our game like a business, all they see is dollar signs and can't see 10 years down the road. They should be ashamed of themselves and their entire organization. But..... it is a goverment run operation that should explain a lot of it.

 

Josh

[wetmule]

I'd have to agree more with Josh's view than against it. They sure seem to be managing their wildlife managers, their personnel and people more than they manage the wildlife of this state. It starts right at the top, from the commissioners to the director, assistant director and on down the line. Very sad indeed.

[KGAINES]

Would it suck to miss a hunt every couple of years so that the herds would stay healthy, nope. I would rather have a great hunt every few years with a better than average chance at a nice buck/ bull, than get drawn every year and talk about how it is getting worse every year. If they managed our herds with the animals as the number one priorty and not how many tags they can sell, it would pay off for everybody. Josh maybe you can answer this, do the majority of the people paying guides to hunt lions have tags for deer, elk, antelope, or are they using money and time that they would have used hunting them. I can deal with not getting drawn, there is always archery deer.

[az4life]

Interesting take on the top[ic. On the surface the announcement sounds positive but after thinking about it, I agree that it would seem nearly impossible for the AZGFD to already have adequate data on the heard increases to make a good call on this. I think past threads have indicated an optomistic concensus that we should have a good year due to all the recent rains, but this seems to be jumping the gun a bit.

 

The department should primarily be managing Arizona's Game, not the burro-crats and employees of the department. Ronald Reagan had a lot to say about government and their approach to problems. While often humorous, they were mostly dead on. this AZGFD decision seems to be another example.

 

"Government is like a baby. An alimentary canal with a big appetite at one end and no sense of responsibility at the other."

 

"No government ever voluntarily reduces itself in size. Government programs, once launched, never disappear. Actually, a government bureau is the nearest thing to eternal life we'll ever see on this earth!"

 

"The most terrifying words in the English langauge are: I'm from the government and I'm here to help. "

 

Nothing like starting the day off with a few good Ronald Reagan quotes!

 

Have a great day.

[GRONG]

Keith, I'd say that when someone comes to hunt lions in the earliest part of the year, Jan-April, then they've got that current year's license. We try to push them to apply and most of the time they do but most of the time they don't get drawn either. For some reason out of staters aren't really interested in hunting Coues with a bow either. At least that's my experience anyway, we just can't get any archery deer hunters to save our tails. We get bear hunters and lion hunters but archery deer just isn't a huge thing unless you're from AZ. Well I guess there is a big pull for archery deer north of the CO river.

 

Az4life, I agree with you. Where did the G&F get their data? I appreciate their optimism but the calf elk haven't even dropped yet and the fawns won't hit the ground till August. The only thing they should've done is dropped most deer tags again and waited till next year to get their elk/deer census. Aside from Coues deer, the muleys up in the 12 units got freakin HAMMERED last year cause of the early snow. They had 3 hunts up there last year and they just mowed them down. Do they think the deer will just miraculously bounce back after a slaughter like they received last fall? Of course they will, according to the G&F. Or rather, in all actuality, they don't even care. ...more tags=more revenue. The more degrees a person has the less common sense they have.

 

I'm done now,

 

Josh

[Red Rabbit]

73 more antelope tags? Last year, only 353 rifle antelope tags were issued. What herd within the state is actually increasing in population? Maybe one should have to turn in 10 coyote tails before they can apply.

My hunch is to go along with idea of the rise in permit fees and the need for more $ caused the rise in tag numbers. Sounds like a good way to mortgage the future of AZ wildlife.

 

Doug~Red Rabbit

[Guest Ernesto C]

Are they offering more tags just to keep Montoya and his customers happy? Maybe? 2281 more elk tags that's a lot,I assume that there are cows and bull included but still.......I think we will need like 2 or 3 years to see the impact or effect of the rain we had on our wildlife population and like Keith said we probably need like 3 consecutive years of good rain to see a really good booming in wildlife population.

I just hope that the G&F did not base their decision on the good rains we had because it takes more that a good rain to offer more tags.I'm not sure but I also heard that they are offering a lot more doe tags in the Kaibab.

 

So time will tell us the answer and lets hope we are all wrong but from were we are now ....we can't se the light.

[sdr3]

As is most always the case, the AZGFD continue to make irrational decisions based on phony data. I can't believe our commission members and regional department heads don't have the commitment to our wildlife to give them a chance to recover from the past 5-7 yrs. of downfall. They think a one yr. drought relief is going to take immediate effect on big game populations throughout the state. Only one comment, they are wrong and I am embarrassed for them. If anything, they should decrease the permit numbers to give the animals a chance to recover.

[bowhunter4life]

like I said,let it rain,the only way bring our herds back is have wet seasons over a few years.this should be the time,keep permits down and let them rebound. .I too agree with all that was said.wanted to bring up a little up roar.we need to be e-mailing the game and fish @ hitting the public meeting to let them know how we arizona hunters feel. mike

[DesertBull]

Remember about a month ago when they were asking for input on increasing the Coues deer tags in units 23 and 6A? Most all of you were in favor of adding the October hunts to these units. That's probably 400-500 tags right there alone.

 

Elk are increasing by leaps and bounds. I have no problem adding more tags. I would not be surprised if those tag numbers that were quoted at the top of this thread include a big increase in the limited Opp. hunts. I doubt if you see a big increase in bull tags in units like 1,27,9 & 10.

 

Antelope? That is puzzling that that they would increase those tags. Hopefully it is mostly the lower success rate archery tags that are increased.

[COUESAZ]

I say clear out some Elk so we can have our Deer herds come back stronger after this good rain. They will have all the good growth cleaned up befor the deer can use it.

[Guest Ernesto C]

DesertBull:

If I remember rigth the Idea was to add an october hunt or a Juniors only hunt but not by adding permits but from taking some permits from the December or other hunts so they can be allocated on a October and/or Juniors only hunt.

 

Ernesto C.