singleshot Report post Posted March 30, 2009 Thanks Doug for the Facts! I have a pretty good Idea of how it all works and I think it's a good system. I also would like to see the 20% pass raised a little higher. I have been fortunate enough to draw 3 archery bull elk tags in 20 years, all in unit 1. The first two tags came in a four year period and then I waited 9 grueling years for my next one. Putting in with my brother we had 12 BP's each for this years draw and were unsuccessful. I would rather play the game knowing that I had some chance every year to pull a good tag than knowing I will have to wait at least ten or twelve. Suzy drew an early rifle bull tag in 1 this year with 11 points, I thought it would take about 15 years to draw this tag and with a preference system it would have taken more than that. Next year she might draw another one, that's what I want to gamble on! Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
jim Report post Posted March 30, 2009 I have put a archery rut tag choice in every year for over 20 years and finally drew it this year. However I have had 12 other elk tags 3 nov archery bull hunts and the rest cows. The system works like it is, you just have to use it. Most of the guy's I know that run cow hunts second choice draw bull tags about every 3 to 4 for years. I will continue to play the game and hope I can draw a rut tag again soon at least I still have that chanch every year. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
m77 Report post Posted March 30, 2009 Good info Doug, thanks. So, what would happen to the numbers and spreading out the premium tags if the premium tags where weighted? Like the once-in-a-lifetime tags. If the apps for all hunts were due in January and started drawing the sheep tags. If you draw a sheep tag this year your out of consideration for the other hunts that year. Then say a unit 1 archery were once in 10 years to draw and also put you in the 2nd round of other elk tag draws for those ten years. Would more hunters start applying for those premium units? Would those tags get spread around to more hunters giving them a chance at a once-in-ten-year draw? How do you do the math? I have always found in interesting how a lot of the conversations on this website seem to alter the regulations of the AZG&F. Sooner than later someone on this site will post a great alternative or addition to the current draw system and G&F will adobt it. SO JUST KEEP ADDING POSTS LIKE THIS IF YOU WANT TO SEE A CHANGE!!!!!!!!!! Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Red Rabbit Report post Posted March 30, 2009 m77, iirc, one proposal made to G&F about the time of the USO fiasco was that deer hunts north of the ditch, and quality elk hunts like early rifle and 9 archery be made premium hunts with a higher fee amount. Not sure I like the idea of hunting becoming a richer man's sport. The idea of draw one tag and you are ineligble for other species has been proposed on the www. I think we talked about it here last year. This would allow almost everyone to have a tag of some sort each year. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
m77 Report post Posted March 30, 2009 Doug, I'm not in favor of raising fees or making hunting a rich man sport. I believe all of our conservation practices here in AZ and throughout the rest of the country need to be watched closely by hunters and well as non. I know the importance of keeping hunters in the field year after year with some sort of a tag, because we need to increase our numbers if we are to survive as a group. Taking a kid or a work buddy out on a hunt is the only way that'll happen. I think this is one of the best hunting websites I visit with some of the most informed hunters. Some times we do step on our own %$#(s with posts of bait sites, trail cam pictures etc, but there is a general hunter helping to inform other hunters mentality on this site. Thanks again for doing some of the numbers. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
SunDevil Report post Posted March 30, 2009 how about these improvements to the draw system: 1) online applications 2) online results with the technology that we have today and all the other states doing it, it is an embarassment that we have to apply on paper and have to call to get the results. just another example of why we should not want bigger and more government Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
30-378shtr Report post Posted March 30, 2009 how about these improvements to the draw system: 1) online applications 2) online results with the technology that we have today and all the other states doing it, it is an embarassment that we have to apply on paper and have to call to get the results. just another example of why we should not want bigger and more government SunDevil, I have to respectfully disagree with bringing back online applications. Two reasons: there were far too many "issues" with the online draw. 2. This makes it far too easy for every Tom, Dick, and Harry weekend warrior to lower our draw odds. Now, some will say that I'm just being selfish and that we need to help bring more hunters into the sport. Well, these weekend warriors are not the ones who are going to be fighting for hunter rights and our sport. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
SunDevil Report post Posted March 30, 2009 the 'issues' that you are referring to must be specific to the vendors that AZ is contracting with to handle it because I have never encountered any 'issues' with the other states that I apply in that have online applications. just my two cents, but I am guessing there are not that many tom, dick and harrys that would apply online but not on paper that would make any impact on peoples draw odds. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
30-378shtr Report post Posted March 30, 2009 There are actually quite a few based on the ease of applying and the fact that they only have to pay BY CREDIT CARD if they actually draw. Less time and money commitment = more applicants. It's like supply and demand. The easier or cheaper people can buy a product, the more people will. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
SunDevil Report post Posted March 30, 2009 I guess I do not recall what the stats were when they went from online to paper. I do not recall it being significant. I would be interested in knowing how much apps went down to support your argument. I agree that fewer people probably apply on paper due to all the inconveniences associated with paper over online but I personally don't think it is significant enough to impact peoples draw odds. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
stanley Report post Posted March 30, 2009 Regarding on-line vs. mail-in only, I'm not sure if that made a signifiant difference in the numbers of applicants or not. It seems like I remember a post a few years ago (when the issues were occuring.....) that published some application data. As I recall, there was not a significant difference in the number of applicants when it was available on-line vs. mail-in only. I would LOVE it if then went back to on-line applications. Much more convenient, IMO! Of course, assuming they could get any previous issues corrected. S. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Red Rabbit Report post Posted March 30, 2009 In what year did online apps cease and mail-only apps rehappen? Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
willhunt4coues Report post Posted March 30, 2009 In what year did online apps cease and mail-only apps rehappen? I believe it happened in 2006 but I am still searching but it does look like the manual apps are only short term click on the link to view the minutes from 2007 http://www.azgfd.gov/pdfs/inside_azgfd/min...8Telephonic.pdf Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
willhunt4coues Report post Posted March 30, 2009 It happened in the spring of 2007 they went to manual apps. Click on the link and scroll twards the bottom. http://www.azgfd.gov/h_f/highlights/highlights_0608.html Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
willhunt4coues Report post Posted March 30, 2009 Sorry half way though the page. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
