270 WSM sizing issues

[L Cazador]

5 hours ago, BeardownAZ said:

Got the brand new Norma brass, it chambers great. Like factory ammo. I'll load these and then see what happens next but I don't for see the problem going away once I go to resize the once fired brass. Next is small base dies. After that, not sure. And still not sure what checking the headspace will do. Don't know one single person that has this caliber unfortunately. Sticking to common calibers from now on, lol   

The key is find a load under max that shoots well. The SAMMI dimension at the case head above the extractor groove is .555". Don't exceed that and set your sizing die to bump shoulder .003-.004". This amount of bump is the headspace needed in a hunting cartridge for quick and easy chambering of repeat shots. You will need a Hornady headspace gauge to set your sizing die for the correct bump (shoulder set back). Pic of Hornady headspace gauge and 270WSM SAMMI dimensions. So for a .003" bump on the cartridge in the picture I would set my die to dimension of 1.182".

[MMACFIVE]

On 11/30/2024 at 7:44 AM, MMACFIVE said:

 

Your chamber is the best headspace measurement you've got. Don't worry about it, buying a headspace kit will not help you in anyway with this.  BTW the very first place brass chambers easy after resizing is almost always near that magical 0.0020" shoulder bump  

I would expect new brass to chamber easily. But after a stout load or 2 I'll bet it is stiff again. Unfortunately Norma is very soft brass and will exceed its elastic limits faster than most brass. Winchester and Lapua brass will be your friend. 

You need a SB die. Removing 0.050" off of your resizing die would likely solve your problem but I don't recommend it because of  shoulder set back. 
 

Good luck. 

[10Turkeys]

Here is a video that popped up on setting up your die for headspace.

 

 

[BeardownAZ]

I don’t know if it’s an omen or what but nothing with this caliber in this rifle has been easy, reloading that is. Gun shoots factory stuff good no issues. Having a hard time finding small base dies for this caliber. 

[L Cazador]

14 hours ago, BeardownAZ said:

I don’t know if it’s an omen or what but nothing with this caliber in this rifle has been easy, reloading that is. Gun shoots factory stuff good no issues. Having a hard time finding small base dies for this caliber. 

Try the instructions in the video. This what I was talking about when using the Hornady headspace gauge. Try setting your die as stated in the instructional video with a headspace gauge. You may not need a small base die with your new brass. 

[BeardownAZ]

3 hours ago, L Cazador said:

Try the instructions in the video. This what I was talking about when using the Hornady headspace gauge. Try setting your die as stated in the instructional video with a headspace gauge. You may not need a small base die with your new brass. 

You mean after the new brass is loaded and fired once as it is right now? Because right now the new unfired Norma brass fits just fine. All brass fits until it is fired then sized and that is when the problems begin.  heck even once fired brass from the rifle its self goes back in no problem as long as I don't resize it. 

[L Cazador]

On 12/30/2024 at 3:25 PM, BeardownAZ said:

You mean after the new brass is loaded and fired once as it is right now? Because right now the new unfired Norma brass fits just fine. All brass fits until it is fired then sized and that is when the problems begin.  heck even once fired brass from the rifle its self goes back in no problem as long as I don't resize it. 

Yes that's what I'm talking about. Where are you located? Any chance you ever in Tucson? I wouldn't charge you anything to figure this out.

[forepaw]

Thanks @10Turkeys for the UR vid.  Good info and good explanation.  And also good to see the equipment available if you want to tune your handloads to perfection (and can afford it).  Possibly not needed however, for those of us with less demanding handloading needs. 

In my case, and with respect to the two rifles with the highest round count, I don't pay any attention to shoulder bump.  I neck size using Lee dies, then I body size using a Redding body die.  Chambering is reliable and easy.  Case life is long, and accuracy good.  In one caliber, using Lapua brass, I am on the 21st firing, with easy chambering and no sign of incipient case head separation.  Possibly, the Lee neck sizing die or the Redding die have built-in shoulder setback in the ideal dimension, but I have not been able to detect it.  Possibly someone with more knowledge can confirm this.

I normally anneal (using the candle method) after every 5 firings, and probably should be more attentive to doing that, but burned fingers gets a little tedious.

   

[L Cazador]

21 hours ago, forepaw said:

Thanks @10Turkeys for the UR vid.  Good info and good explanation.  And also good to see the equipment available if you want to tune your handloads to perfection (and can afford it).  Possibly not needed however, for those of us with less demanding handloading needs. 

In my case, and with respect to the two rifles with the highest round count, I don't pay any attention to shoulder bump.  I neck size using Lee dies, then I body size using a Redding body die.  Chambering is reliable and easy.  Case life is long, and accuracy good.  In one caliber, using Lapua brass, I am on the 21st firing, with easy chambering and no sign of incipient case head separation.  Possibly, the Lee neck sizing die or the Redding die have built-in shoulder setback in the ideal dimension, but I have not been able to detect it.  Possibly someone with more knowledge can confirm this.

I normally anneal (using the candle method) after every 5 firings, and probably should be more attentive to doing that, but burned fingers gets a little tedious.

   

You're one of many that isn't affected by shoulder bump or setback. And with the results that you're getting great that it works for you. Just to confirm Lee neck sizing die does not bump or setback shoulder. It sizes neck portion of case so it will accept and hold a bullet when it's seated. The remainder of the case stays in it's dimensions as extracted from the chamber it was fired in. There is a small amount of brass spring back that does take place usually between .001-.002". This stretching as it's called will eventually lead to the brass being difficult to chamber. This where a body die will restore all dimensions back to SAMMI specs. The body die not only sets the shoulder back but also sizes the shoulder width, the neck diameter, and the body of the case from the .200'' line to the body shoulder junction. Body sizing each and every time a round is reloaded is an excess of work on the case and can result in reduced case life. This is where a bushing style full length die can be a compromise between the two. You can set the shoulder back just enough for a smooth chamber and then size the neck diameter to perfect bullet tension for your load. Like you say above you and your shooting discipline may not require all this precision but there will be other disciplines that will.

[forepaw]

38 minutes ago, L Cazador said:

You're one of many that isn't affected by shoulder bump or setback. And with the results that you're getting great that it works for you. Just to confirm Lee neck sizing die does not bump or setback shoulder. It sizes neck portion of case so it will accept and hold a bullet when it's seated. The remainder of the case stays in it's dimensions as extracted from the chamber it was fired in. There is a small amount of brass spring back that does take place usually between .001-.002". This stretching as it's called will eventually lead to the brass being difficult to chamber. This where a body die will restore all dimensions back to SAMMI specs. The body die not only sets the shoulder back but also sizes the shoulder width, the neck diameter, and the body of the case from the .200'' line to the body shoulder junction. Body sizing each and every time a round is reloaded is an excess of work on the case and can result in reduced case life. This is where a bushing style full length die can be a compromise between the two. You can set the shoulder back just enough for a smooth chamber and then size the neck diameter to perfect bullet tension for your load. Like you say above you and your shooting discipline may not require all this precision but there will be other disciplines that will.

That is great info.  I will print that and put it with my die sets as a reminder.  I didn't think there was that much brass working going on with the body die.  I have come pretty close to getting a couple sets of bushing-style dies, as they really look like the way to go.  Once you have your basic dimensions, just order the bushing size you need.  If you rebarrel, just order another bushing. 

The other thing that might be mentioned for the other readers, is the subject of neck turning.  This step is usually for precise match chambers, i.e. benchrest shooters, and if you neck turn brass with an ordinary factory chamber, even a SAAMI chamber, you might end up with sloppy neck fit, which will likely not help groups.

Thanks again.