so mad!!!

[desertbucks]

I believe with the technology of bows, arrows, broadheads etc that a 100 yard shot is not that crazy if someone had a pin for that yardage and practiced at that distance on a regular basis. If he would have said he shot that deer at 60 yards then guys would argue about thats too far, it really depends on each individual and how they shoot, but remember its the person shooting that distance who has to question him self after wounding a animal and make that decision next time. I beleive and have seen some guys are better at long distance shooting and more comfortable.

[desertbowhunter]

Everyone always wants to blame the broadhead. I beleive that any razor sharp broadhead will do the job. I shot a muley on the the first of January with a undertaker broadhead and the entry and exit holes were simply amazing. My buck only made it 30 yards and was expired within 30 seconds. I am a person who shoots year round and I am very confident in my equipment. Adam in my own opinion if you felt confident in taking a 95 yard shot then more power to you, you shouldn't have to answer to anyone. Last year I also lost a muley and the shot looked perfect, and I shot him with a wac'em at thitry yards bedded down broadside looking away from me. When I shot him I thought he would be forty or fifty yards dead but he wasnt. I had decent blood for 100 yards then he just quit bleeding. I had a complete pass through and found my arrow. There was great blood on it also. I looked for him for 5 days and had about 7 or 8 people helping look and ended up not finding him. The reason Im sharing this I guess is because things happend and all you can do is learn from it. Now are people gonna tell me that thirty yards is to far to shoot at a bedded animal, or tell me to switch broadheads? Who knows, all I know is I hope you find your buck and good luck to you.

[crazyaboutcoues]

I guess I'm old school...If someone told me they could consistently shoot a 3" group at 100 yards with a bow I would think he's on crack. If you could do that you need to shoot in the Olympics. Seeing is believing...I'll bet my paycheck. Any takers????

 

A 95-yard shot at a deer is not only unacceptable but also plain irresponsible. If you can't get closer don't shoot. Wait for another opportunity. Do you have to kill a deer that bad that your only alternative is to take a 95 yard shot? Sorry I don't buy it. Do what you have to do, it's your decision, your character. But don't come here and cry that you can't find a deer that you never should have shot at in the first place.

 

Only my opinion and i'll stick by it 100%

 

 

 

 

[longshooter]

Good shooting Adam.. Don't listen to the ethic police to much around here there just jealous they can't shoot a bow that consistant out to 100 yards... If your confident out that far and you know you can hit the vitals more power to you.. Every one who hunts with a bow will lose a deer some time in there life.

 

 

[AZhunterNCJ]

SO maybe after reading all this its not about the yardage of the shot but shot placement and discipline. I don know all the details in the field but did the hunter practice 100 yd shots with a target close to the ground or at a standing height? Thats gonna change the angle of entry especially at that distance and arc of an arrow. How big of a lethal zone can a bedded deer offer, especially at that distance? I dont like that shot, even if its a buck of a lifetime; which to me deserves even more respect after enduring many a hunting season and natural predators. Im tired of us hunters saying "its a world class deer, shoot!" and throwing all common sense out the window. Thats not how I was taught growing up and Im only 31, so Im not old school. Also what time of day was the animal shot at? Did he have time to wait out the deer and wait to have him stand up? I personally dont want to shoot out to 100 yds, ever. Thats the reason I got into archery hunting, the intense, upclose and personal quest. With todays high tech equipement I think we as hunters are losing that concept and I think discipline goes hand in hand with that. Yeah u might be able to shoot consistantly at that yardage but what is the margin of error on a shot like that. Its not a target, its an animal. Miss the target by a few inches and you get a lesser score. Miss an animal by a few inches and you have a headache, heartache, people judging you and it looks bad for the sport. Man I hope you find that deer! I hope these mishaps that we have read about make us rethink about taking a shot and respect the sport and its quarry.

[crbn4runner]

so how far is to far? lol

[bobbyo]

I have some general comments and then some analysis that could help find an animal.

 

1. Animals that are shot in the heart or double lunged do not go farther than 200 yards. The animal does not die from bleeding to death. It dies from organ failure.

 

2. IMO there is nothing wrong with 95 yard shots. I was taking accurate 70 yard shots with a bow going 195 FPS with steel cables, brass pins, and crooked aluminum arrows.( Who remembers the arrow straightener?)

 

3. Broadheads that claim massive entrance wounds do not appeal to me. How much energy does a massive entrance wound require? I like clean pass through's. Two holes are much easier to trail than one( even small ones). I consider a shot at an animal without a complete pass through a miss.

 

4. Because of the above I feel a bedded animal shot is a poor choice. Even if there could be a pass through the arrow will hit the ground and stay in the animal. With no arrow you will have a harder time determining what type of hit you have and will not know how long to wait.

 

5. How can a 21 year old already have two Antelope tags?

 

6. Headache could not agree with you more except for that tree hugging hippie talk.( I'm one according to Lark). Too much scmaltz, nostalgia and over glorification of our quarry. We are trying to kill! Kill! Kill. Yes Archery is not for the faint of heart. My friend and taxidermist says that the only way to respect an animal is to get them mounted $$$$$$$.

 

7. Adam, you look like you are shooting a speed rig. If so, and especially if you change to a fixed it might benefit you to go to a heavier arrow. At least 50 grains up. What you lose in speed you will makeup for in penetration and stability. You will even get a quieter and smoother bow. If you are already shooting 425 grains ++++ tell me to shut up. Mechanical broadheads work in my opinion, but I like the no fuss with fixed. You will need the small cutting diameter kind if you want to take long shots accurately.

 

8. I think too many of you critics read the B.S. hunting zines that have nothing to do with western spot and stalk hunting. Lets crawl in some cactus for a while and then tell me how far is too far.

 

Now lets find the deer. You said the arrow penetrated half way and then walked over a mile with out sitting down. Did you lose the blood trail at this point? If so, you have to think that the deer back tracked at this point. You need to flag last blood and then put a flag back 100 yards. Walk parallel 25-50 yards to these flags on both sides. Try to find blood. If nothing repeat a few times back. if the trail he took is an actual deer trail follow all obvious feeder trails, bedding areas blah blah blah. I know you have done a lot of this already, but i am trying to help. Be systematic in your search instead of aimlessly wondering. Need to find a knob in vicinity of last blood and glass area. Change angle glass again. Rinse and repeat. If it has walked a mile it still could be alive. Heck you may find a different buck. I say go for it. You can beat yourself up all you want, but at some point you may have to accept that you will not find him. Give it your best shot finding him and then forgive yourself. Your not a perfect hunter like all these short shooters who like to judge you. In hunting you really only have one person to please. I think some old singer named Ricky Nelson said it best:

 

But it's all right now

I learned my lesson well

See ya can't please everyone

So ya got to please yourself.

Archery is not for sissies,

Bob

ps. CRBN4runner you are a good friend.

[Coues 'n' Sheep]

I have some general comments and then some analysis that could help find an animal.

 

1. Animals that are shot in the heart or double lunged do not go farther than 200 yards. The animal does not die from bleeding to death. It dies from organ failure.

 

2. IMO there is nothing wrong with 95 yard shots. I was taking accurate 70 yard shots with a bow going 195 FPS with steel cables, brass pins, and crooked aluminum arrows.( Who remembers the arrow straightener?)

 

3. Broadheads that claim massive entrance wounds do not appeal to me. How much energy does a massive entrance wound require? I like clean pass through's. Two holes are much easier to trail than one( even small ones). I consider a shot at an animal without a complete pass through a miss.

 

4. Because of the above I feel a bedded animal shot is a poor choice. Even if there could be a pass through the arrow will hit the ground and stay in the animal. With no arrow you will have a harder time determining what type of hit you have and will not know how long to wait.

 

5. How can a 21 year old already have two Antelope tags?

 

6. Headache could not agree with you more except for that tree hugging hippie talk.( I'm one according to Lark). Too much scmaltz, nostalgia and over glorification of our quarry. We are trying to kill! Kill! Kill. Yes Archery is not for the faint of heart. My friend and taxidermist says that the only way to respect an animal is to get them mounted $$$$$$$.

 

7. Adam, you look like you are shooting a speed rig. If so, and especially if you change to a fixed it might benefit you to go to a heavier arrow. At least 50 grains up. What you lose in speed you will makeup for in penetration and stability. You will even get a quieter and smoother bow. If you are already shooting 425 grains ++++ tell me to shut up. Mechanical broadheads work in my opinion, but I like the no fuss with fixed. You will need the small cutting diameter kind if you want to take long shots accurately.

 

8. I think too many of you critics read the B.S. hunting zines that have nothing to do with western spot and stalk hunting. Lets crawl in some cactus for a while and then tell me how far is too far.

 

Now lets find the deer. You said the arrow penetrated half way and then walked over a mile with out sitting down. Did you lose the blood trail at this point? If so, you have to think that the deer back tracked at this point. You need to flag last blood and then put a flag back 100 yards. Walk parallel 25-50 yards to these flags on both sides. Try to find blood. If nothing repeat a few times back. if the trail he took is an actual deer trail follow all obvious feeder trails, bedding areas blah blah blah. I know you have done a lot of this already, but i am trying to help. Be systematic in your search instead of aimlessly wondering. Need to find a knob in vicinity of last blood and glass area. Change angle glass again. Rinse and repeat. If it has walked a mile it still could be alive. Heck you may find a different buck. I say go for it. You can beat yourself up all you want, but at some point you may have to accept that you will not find him. Give it your best shot finding him and then forgive yourself. Your not a perfect hunter like all these short shooters who like to judge you. In hunting you really only have one person to please. I think some old singer named Ricky Nelson said it best:

 

But it's all right now

I learned my lesson well

See ya can't please everyone

So ya got to please yourself.

Archery is not for sissies,

Bob

ps. CRBN4runner you are a good friend.

 

Bravo-Bravo!!!! +1....Very well spoken, Bob!

 

[Hunterjohnny]

I have some general comments and then some analysis that could help find an animal.

 

1. Animals that are shot in the heart or double lunged do not go farther than 200 yards. The animal does not die from bleeding to death. It dies from organ failure.

 

2. IMO there is nothing wrong with 95 yard shots. I was taking accurate 70 yard shots with a bow going 195 FPS with steel cables, brass pins, and crooked aluminum arrows.( Who remembers the arrow straightener?)

 

3. Broadheads that claim massive entrance wounds do not appeal to me. How much energy does a massive entrance wound require? I like clean pass through's. Two holes are much easier to trail than one( even small ones). I consider a shot at an animal without a complete pass through a miss.

 

4. Because of the above I feel a bedded animal shot is a poor choice. Even if there could be a pass through the arrow will hit the ground and stay in the animal. With no arrow you will have a harder time determining what type of hit you have and will not know how long to wait.

 

5. How can a 21 year old already have two Antelope tags?

 

6. Headache could not agree with you more except for that tree hugging hippie talk.( I'm one according to Lark). Too much scmaltz, nostalgia and over glorification of our quarry. We are trying to kill! Kill! Kill. Yes Archery is not for the faint of heart. My friend and taxidermist says that the only way to respect an animal is to get them mounted $$$$$$$.

 

7. Adam, you look like you are shooting a speed rig. If so, and especially if you change to a fixed it might benefit you to go to a heavier arrow. At least 50 grains up. What you lose in speed you will makeup for in penetration and stability. You will even get a quieter and smoother bow. If you are already shooting 425 grains ++++ tell me to shut up. Mechanical broadheads work in my opinion, but I like the no fuss with fixed. You will need the small cutting diameter kind if you want to take long shots accurately.

 

8. I think too many of you critics read the B.S. hunting zines that have nothing to do with western spot and stalk hunting. Lets crawl in some cactus for a while and then tell me how far is too far.

 

Now lets find the deer. You said the arrow penetrated half way and then walked over a mile with out sitting down. Did you lose the blood trail at this point? If so, you have to think that the deer back tracked at this point. You need to flag last blood and then put a flag back 100 yards. Walk parallel 25-50 yards to these flags on both sides. Try to find blood. If nothing repeat a few times back. if the trail he took is an actual deer trail follow all obvious feeder trails, bedding areas blah blah blah. I know you have done a lot of this already, but i am trying to help. Be systematic in your search instead of aimlessly wondering. Need to find a knob in vicinity of last blood and glass area. Change angle glass again. Rinse and repeat. If it has walked a mile it still could be alive. Heck you may find a different buck. I say go for it. You can beat yourself up all you want, but at some point you may have to accept that you will not find him. Give it your best shot finding him and then forgive yourself. Your not a perfect hunter like all these short shooters who like to judge you. In hunting you really only have one person to please. I think some old singer named Ricky Nelson said it best:

 

But it's all right now

I learned my lesson well

See ya can't please everyone

So ya got to please yourself.

Archery is not for sissies,

Bob

ps. CRBN4runner you are a good friend.

 

Bravo-Bravo!!!! +1....Very well spoken, Bob!

 

Very good reply. Support and help each other. I dont want anyone judging me when I post up, why are we so quick to do this. Has everyone recovered their wounded deer(then why judge). And share those Lope tags man. Good luck and if you need some help just put a line out. I think you will find plenty.

[Psychozar]

I guess I'm old school...If someone told me they could consistently shoot a 3" group at 100 yards with a bow I would think he's on crack. If you could do that you need to shoot in the Olympics. Seeing is believing...I'll bet my paycheck. Any takers????

 

A 95-yard shot at a deer is not only unacceptable but also plain irresponsible. If you can't get closer don't shoot. Wait for another opportunity. Do you have to kill a deer that bad that your only alternative is to take a 95 yard shot? Sorry I don't buy it. Do what you have to do, it's your decision, your character. But don't come here and cry that you can't find a deer that you never should have shot at in the first place.

 

Only my opinion and i'll stick by it 100%

Amen!!!

 

 

[azpackhorse]

Adam,

 

I don't know what area you are hunting but if it's down South or kinda close to Tucson I would be more than happy to help you look for your deer. I have lost animals before while archery hunting, it is a sickening feeling I know. If you archery hunt big game long enough you WILL lose animals.

I refuse to comment on ethics, the main focus should be on this animal.

 

Good luck young man.

[bchoitz]

I only got half way through the thread and now I have to go to work....

 

Keep at it! I sincerely hope that you find this deer for your benefit as well as for ours. the ONLY way you will know what truly happened is to find that deer.

 

Good luck.

 

Bret

[muleybull]

I know a lot of people are bagging on you on the 95 yard shot.........but I'm thinking, dang that was a good shot!!!!!!

[matthewp45]

Just remember opinions are like buttholes, everyone has one and most of them stink . Keep huntin how you want and enjoy yourself. As long as you are staying within the law!

[TEmbry]

Whoever said a .029 pin would cover a deer is insane. Even at 95 yards, a .029 pin covers about a 3.3" circle, NOT a deer top to bottom.

 

This said, I would never in my life dream of taking a 95 yard shot. If I want to shoot 100 yards, i will grab a rifle. Bowhunting is about getting closer for me. Alot can happen when an arrow has over a 1 second flight time. Being bedded helps, but the animal still could have moved....not that it would matter much seing as the buck was wounded anyway.

 

You guys are free to do as you please, but I for one will never take a 95 yard shot, ever. Sure I have a chance of wounding one closer, but I am putting the odds more in my favor by staying within 40-50 yards than 100 yards. A coues deer is a small target to begin with.

 

Also, if it was a true 12 ring shot, the deer would be dead. A double lunged or heart shot deer is a dead deer running and wont make it far. My last kill was a double lung shot, but a bit higher and farther back than wanted...the deer made it about 300 yards or so, and we were simply amazed. IF you put a DL or heart shot on it, no way it makes it even close to those distances. I guess it could have only caught one lung like you said, dropping in an arrow like that can be tough, especially with close to 20 ft of drop!

 

If your arrow only had half penetration, im guessing you hit above the spine or in the shoulder, either way catching bone. Arrows are good at holding KE at long distances...my current setup is just under 80 ft/lbs of KE, and at 100 yards it is still over 50 ft/lbs of KE, more than enough to blow through an animal on a good shot. BUT just because the arrow is capable, doesn't mean I should take the shot. A target and a live animal are two totally separte things.

 

To each his own, but I can gaurantee if an archer cut his range from 95 to 45 he would have alot less wounds, all else equal. Just a matter of knowing your limitations, and I feel a 100 yard shot should be out of anyones limitations for archery...but if you feel it is within yours, more power to ya. I wish you the best of success in hunting and killing animals. Not everyone should hunt by the same exact self made rules and reasons.

 

I know I am new here, just thought I would voice my opinions on what happened.