so mad!!!

[bobbyo]

TEMBRY,

:

 

You are one funny cat. I love it when someone from a small state with over 1,000,000 WT. gives their two cents about distance limitations to us long shooting barbarians in Arizona. Heck, if I lived in a state with over 1,000,000 deer I would probably limit myself to 30 yards. Alas I live in a large state with an est. WT pop of 85,000 scared deer. From a previous post you said you plan on filling your slam by waltzing out here to Arizona and whacking a deer in two weeks. Do you plan on keeping shots under 50 yards? It is possible keeping to that standard sitting in ground or tree blind, but bring lots of books because you will go many days without seeing anything. I mean not one deer. Be prepared to shoot a yearling.

 

Last year I guided a dude from Wisconsin on a Jan bow hunt. He had the same expectations as you. He has killed trophy animals all over the world. He tells me," Bob, I will not shoot anything under 90," I told him we will see some bucks that big, but " How far can you shoot."

"I have a pin all the way out to 50 yards."

After 5 long days and many, many blown stocks and some boring days in a blind this trophy hunter with standards starts taking 90 yard shots at spikes! Yep those standards sure can change.

 

Tembry a little advice. Don't comment on hunting in a state you have never been to and get an 80 yard pin sighted in.

Bob

[El Fuego]

I think we all need to go back and read Adam's original post. Adam was not asking for opinions and condemnation about the distance he shoots. No, he was just like any of us that would be looking for a pick me up after not being able to find something that he just shot. He needed our support. He wasn't looking for a bunch of blow hard advice from you naysayers and know it alls. So, if you can go back, read his post and help, please help the man. If you cannot offer any help, please do not post here and save your hot air for some other site. If it was not for folks like bobbyo, coues 'n' sheep, azpackhorse and others, I would think this was some anti hunting site.

 

Good luck to you Adam and let us know if you are able to find the deer.

[JMP]

"You are one funny cat. I love it when someone from a small state with over 1,000,000 WT. gives their two cents about distance limitations to us long shooting barbarians in Arizona. Heck, if I lived in a state with over 1,000,000 deer I would probably limit myself to 30 yards. Alas I live in a large state with an est. WT pop of 85,000 scared deer. From a previous post you said you plan on filling your slam by waltzing out here to Arizona and whacking a deer in two weeks. Do you plan on keeping shots

 

 

 

amen, Bob. ... words from my mouth man.

 

TEmbry - three words for your sucess in az: seven deadly pins.

 

 

[.270]

ok, i can't turn this one down. don't hunt with a bow anymore. bad knees, can't run. bad shoulder, can't pull one back. bad eyes, can't see sights for $h!t. but i've stacked up a lotta stuff with bows and arrows. you have to be real discriminating with your shots. ok, first, ethics is just somebodies opinion. ask any peta wierdo if a hunter is ethical. don't get hung up on ethics or on folks that like to sling the word around. it's just someone's opinion. second, you didn't hit the deer in the heart or lungs. you somehow angled the arrow into it's guts or maybe stuck it in the brisket. there is also a chance that the arrow went along the outside of the ribs, maybe under the shoulder, and didn't get into the vitals. especially if it was laying down. when they lay down, everything rolls around and nothing is like it is if they are standing. if you got it in the lungs or heart, you would have found it. end of story. they can't live. their lungs fill up with blood and they pass out because they can't breath, if you get a lung. even just one gets em in a hurry. and a heart shot is always fatal and in just a few seconds. always. no options. a good liver hit will make a buck real sick, real quick and if you keep after him he'll either lay down and die or you'll jump him up and then you can let him lay down again and maybe get another shot. but a good hit in the liver will get em quick. don't let it get ya down and don't pay too much attention to other folks. take the shot you feel like you can make and live with it. but a 95 yards shot is a fair distance for a rifle. in my opinion. learn from it and go on from here. good luck. Lark.

[elkaholic]

hello - guess it's time to make a decision - do you go out this weekend and look for the buck or do you shoot the next one you like ! Not an easy decision but I doubt you'll find the first buck - I say hunt the same area if you haven't already pushed everything out from trying to find the first buck -

Good luck on your hunt and I hope you learned a little from all this ! Good luck - gary

[TEmbry]

TEMBRY,

:

 

You are one funny cat. I love it when someone from a small state with over 1,000,000 WT. gives their two cents about distance limitations to us long shooting barbarians in Arizona. Heck, if I lived in a state with over 1,000,000 deer I would probably limit myself to 30 yards. Alas I live in a large state with an est. WT pop of 85,000 scared deer. From a previous post you said you plan on filling your slam by waltzing out here to Arizona and whacking a deer in two weeks. Do you plan on keeping shots under 50 yards? It is possible keeping to that standard sitting in ground or tree blind, but bring lots of books because you will go many days without seeing anything. I mean not one deer. Be prepared to shoot a yearling.

 

Last year I guided a dude from Wisconsin on a Jan bow hunt. He had the same expectations as you. He has killed trophy animals all over the world. He tells me," Bob, I will not shoot anything under 90," I told him we will see some bucks that big, but " How far can you shoot."

"I have a pin all the way out to 50 yards."

After 5 long days and many, many blown stocks and some boring days in a blind this trophy hunter with standards starts taking 90 yard shots at spikes! Yep those standards sure can change.

 

Tembry a little advice. Don't comment on hunting in a state you have never been to and get an 80 yard pin sighted in.

Bob

 

I figured I'd catch this. You are one hundred percent correct, deer density should dictate taking shots with higher wound rates. Why on Earth does the number of deer around dictate how far you can lethally and ethically take a shot? It doesn't, you decide that. My shooting limitations won't change just because there aren't as many critters running around. Like I said, if you guys want to shoot it more power to ya. I won't. I have pins out to 60 currently. Im sorry your Wisconsin hunter decided to cave on his goals and change his previous practiced range by 40 yards, I wont. If it means I go home without a deer, OK. I don't base my success on taking a deer home no matter what it takes. Not sure why staying within my limitations is laughable to you....but it is ok.

 

I guess I'll just waltz into AZ, and expect to stalk within 20 yards within the first weekend, or else... I know my limitations, and when a target shrinks from what I am currently used to shooting, my range naturally wont double. You can shoot 150 for all I care, your bow will have enough KE to kill from there, so why not? Like I said, numerous times, do whatever pleases you. Just stating I WON'T, and don't need some guy riding my back telling me I'm some bafoon since I hunt in the East and won't shoot past 50 or so yards. SEVERAL fellas from AZ state it before me, but as soon as an out of stater mentions perhaps 95 is too far it is ridiculous.

 

And Waltz in and fill the slam? LOL I love your guys impression of all hunters from the East. I have already stated I expect to take nothing away from the trip besides learning experience. I plan on coming every year from here on out until I get one....but your right, because I merely hope to be succcessful on a trip when traveling to hunt, I am some big egoed know it all. I will not be treestand or blind hunting, I will be glassing, ambushing, and stalking...if I don't get one, I won't break down..I'll simply learn from it and seek revenge the following winter. I can accept defeat, though I'll try everything within my limitations to avoid it. Stalking CAN be done to get within 50 yards, maybe not as easily as 100...but it can happen. I stalked my Pronghorn back in August in the prarie of SD for a 15 yard shot. Just look at it this way, if it is soo impossible for me to get within 50 yards without a treestand, thats just one more deer out there for you to hunt after I leave.

 

 

Not exactly how I wanted to start off here on the boards, but don't get on my case for not wanting to shoot far. Ill stay within 50ish yards, you can shoot at 100. World will keep turning.

 

Best of luck for the coming season...Heres to short blood trails and quick recoveries....regardless if shot at 5 yards or 100 yards.

 

[Codywhi]

rossoutdoors sorry about u buck,,, i support 95 yard shots all day with quality equipment and a ton of practice, witch it sounds like u had, stuff happins there has been three guys on hear that have lost bucks this year but just cuz u go and knock the air out of one at 95 yards they say its not ethical what is ethical? is ethical picking up ur bow a couple weeks or months before the season opens and then decide to practice, or not having a proper tuned arrow,or bow....people but alot of time in to being able to take long shots that are more ethical then people who pick there bow up a week before season and then go hunting,, they where not there and dont know what kind of archer u are or what kind of equipment u had, we are all bowhunter and should all be on the same side !!!!!! next year there will be no more bating so its gonna so either learn about long distance shooting and become an archer and a hunter or go fight over waterholes.....

[AZantlerhead]

Just remember opinions are like buttholes, everyone has one and most of them stink . Keep huntin how you want and enjoy yourself. As long as you are staying within the law!

 

Everything that's Legal is not ethical. Everything that's Illegal is not unethical. Some people confuse the law with ethics these days, I feel they are two different things. I make sure to stay right with both .

 

To each his own. But do you really feel at rest about that shot and sure you'd do it again. I wouldn't sleep at night myself.

[gotcoues]

Good luck on finding your deer.

 

I have tried out lots of different broadheads and I like the wac ems four or three blade. The blades are very secure and stay on. I broke a blade in half but blade was still on (what was left of it). The Rocket Ultimate steels are very affortable and fly great like the wac ems. I don't think their as strong though, the blades seem to come off rather easy. These two heads seem to fly more like my field tips. Someone mentioned smaller heads, I agree on account of trying to get a pass through.

 

I bet lots of guys on here would help you look, I would take them up on it.

 

Can't wait to see those pics!

 

[WFGinNM]

Wow, sorry for you to post this thread. Sometimes I might do something a bit skeptical in life, but I sure won't post it on the net. I hope you find the deer, but you sure are a better shooter than I, I would never think of shooting over 40 yards with a bow. But I have no experience because... Well I guess. . . I guess I'm just not that greedy.

 

--Bill

[Hunterjohnny]

 

(The Merriam-Webster Dictionary defines ethical as “involving or expressing moral approval or disapproval.” The words “moral” and “ethical” are used synonymously in the dictionary. A moral is defined as a “code of conduct.” An ethic is defined as “the principles of conduct governing an individual or a group.”

Stated simply, ethical behavior is behavior that is accepted as good rather than bad, and right rather than wrong.

Unfortunately, because of the way each of us was raised, our past experiences, and our personal beliefs and values, what is ethical to one person might not be ethical to someone else.

Not only can ethics vary from one person to another, ethics can also change over time as society and its values change. What is ethical to one person might not be ethical to someone else.

The original concept of hunting was using the hunter’s skills, abilities and intelligence to outsmart and stalk a wild animal, and make a well-placed shot.

People used to hunt out of necessity. Now we hunt mostly for sport, recreation or trophies.

Hunters are taught to respect wildlife and its habitat, landowners and their rights, other hunters and non-hunters, and game laws and firearms. They’re also taught to be ethical and responsible hunters. They’re taught that in addition to written laws, there are unwritten laws they must follow too.

Every hunter must make his or her own decisions about what is and isn’t ethical.)

 

I started coming to this site regularly because I wasnt seeing the same unethical behavior on here. My definition of unethical in this case would be condeming and not supporting fellow hunters that need it. Ethics and opinions are the same thing, dont be convinced yours is always right.

 

I am truly sorry about your situation. I have never lost one and pray I never do. Odds are only on my side because of my inability to find game most of the time. There were lots of great comment from folks who are here for you, dont worry about the rest. Good luck.

[JMP]

 

 

I figured I'd catch this. You are one hundred percent correct, deer density should dictate taking shots with higher wound rates. Why on Earth does the number of deer around dictate how far you can lethally and ethically take a shot? It doesn't, you decide that. My shooting limitations won't change just because there aren't as many critters running around. Like I said, if you guys want to shoot it more power to ya. I won't. I have pins out to 60 currently. Im sorry your Wisconsin hunter decided to cave on his goals and change his previous practiced range by 40 yards, I wont. If it means I go home without a deer, OK. I don't base my success on taking a deer home no matter what it takes. Not sure why staying within my limitations is laughable to you....but it is ok.

 

I guess I'll just waltz into AZ, and expect to stalk within 20 yards within the first weekend, or else... I know my limitations, and when a target shrinks from what I am currently used to shooting, my range naturally wont double. You can shoot 150 for all I care, your bow will have enough KE to kill from there, so why not? Like I said, numerous times, do whatever pleases you. Just stating I WON'T, and don't need some guy riding my back telling me I'm some bafoon since I hunt in the East and won't shoot past 50 or so yards. SEVERAL fellas from AZ state it before me, but as soon as an out of stater mentions perhaps 95 is too far it is ridiculous.

 

And Waltz in and fill the slam? LOL I love your guys impression of all hunters from the East. I have already stated I expect to take nothing away from the trip besides learning experience. I plan on coming every year from here on out until I get one....but your right, because I merely hope to be succcessful on a trip when traveling to hunt, I am some big egoed know it all. I will not be treestand or blind hunting, I will be glassing, ambushing, and stalking...if I don't get one, I won't break down..I'll simply learn from it and seek revenge the following winter. I can accept defeat, though I'll try everything within my limitations to avoid it. Stalking CAN be done to get within 50 yards, maybe not as easily as 100...but it can happen. I stalked my Pronghorn back in August in the prarie of SD for a 15 yard shot. Just look at it this way, if it is soo impossible for me to get within 50 yards without a treestand, thats just one more deer out there for you to hunt after I leave.

 

 

Not exactly how I wanted to start off here on the boards, but don't get on my case for not wanting to shoot far. Ill stay within 50ish yards, you can shoot at 100. World will keep turning.

 

Best of luck for the coming season...Heres to short blood trails and quick recoveries....regardless if shot at 5 yards or 100 yards.

 

 

dude, it's not about ethics, or deer densities or anything. it's about skill sets that may be sufficient in one situation that may not be in another. the way you hunt back east is probably different than the way we hunt here. You probably don't use optics and tripods the same as we do. but when you come out here, you'll learn. you will develop a new skill set. shooting out to 100 yards is a skill set that with the right equipment can be developed just the same as the guys shooting their 300's out to 1000 yards using the claw. there's more risk of something going wrong with that too, but its a risk those hunters are ok with, and have hopefully trained to minimize. we're just saying that maybe you should be open to and work on developing a skill set that suits the terrain and the quarry you are hunting. if you were hunting elephants in africa you'd practice with a large bore rifle, open sights, and short range quick and very accurate shooting. the terrain out here is open and rugged and big. lots of canyons, steep hills, and sometimes you just can't get any closer. this year i got to 35 yards of the buck i shot. i much prefer that to shooting at 80 yards. but if 80 was all i was given, i sure am glad i am practiced out that far. you're ambitious - you would be too.

[TEmbry]

dude, it's not about ethics, or deer densities or anything. it's about skill sets that may be sufficient in one situation that may not be in another. the way you hunt back east is probably different than the way we hunt here. You probably don't use optics and tripods the same as we do. but when you come out here, you'll learn. you will develop a new skill set. shooting out to 100 yards is a skill set that with the right equipment can be developed just the same as the guys shooting their 300's out to 1000 yards using the claw. there's more risk of something going wrong with that too, but its a risk those hunters are ok with, and have hopefully trained to minimize. we're just saying that maybe you should be open to and work on developing a skill set that suits the terrain and the quarry you are hunting. if you were hunting elephants in africa you'd practice with a large bore rifle, open sights, and short range quick and very accurate shooting. the terrain out here is open and rugged and big. lots of canyons, steep hills, and sometimes you just can't get any closer. this year i got to 35 yards of the buck i shot. i much prefer that to shooting at 80 yards. but if 80 was all i was given, i sure am glad i am practiced out that far. you're ambitious - you would be too.

 

If its not about deer densities...then why was it stated as the reason for longer shots? I can't understand the life of me. There are atleast 5-7 other guys in this thread that have said the same thing as I do, but because I have a different home state I am somehow speaking jibberish.

 

I agree wholeheartedly that shooting long distances is a skill, which I may very well try to accomplish...but only to make those 40-50 yard shots easier. I don't view target shooting as a very good translation into the hunting field. At 100 yards, my arrow has a 1.15 second flight time. That is a LOOOONG time for a deer, especially as small as a Coues, to take a step. Your 12 ringer heart shot can easily become a gut shot with just chance, you can't control the deers action whatsoever. Like I said, it isn't for me. I may come out there and get my but handed to me all 10-14 days, or I might luck out and stalk one on Day 1....but either way it will be at my ranges and on my terms. I can't wait to try the Coues style of hunting, with glassing for long periods. Ill get a chance to wet my feet glassing in a more target rich environment on Kodiak Island come August. I agree it is all about learning a skill set when hunting new places/species....but your effective range does NOT have to grow, just because it is the accepted norm.

 

Again, you guys shoot 100...Ill shoot 50ish. No big deal. If you are fine with it, that is truly all that matters. I just know (like said above by AZAntlerHead) I personally wouldn't be able to sleep well at night for a while knowing I pushed the limits and wounded a buck because of it. Not saying it can't happen at 50, but the odds are certainly alot more in my favor.

 

 

As for the OP, have you had any luck searching by watching the birds/coyotes yet? I know a guy that found his last buck that way, worked well for him to get closure on a buck he wounded. Best of luck, and keep at it no matter how it turns out.

 

[crbn4runner]

 

 

THE REST OF THE STORY WILL BE HERE SHORTLY!!!!!!

[bobbyo]

but your effective range does NOT have to grow, just because it is the accepted norm.

 

Trevor, I am not picking on you because your out of state. I have given up on those other guys. There is still hope for you. Since you have never hunted coues you don't understand how naive that statement is. It is hard to get close and If you are spot and stalk hunting YOUR EFFECTIVE RANGE DOES NEED TO GROW. Because if it doesn't what you do out here will not be called hunting. It will be more like nature watching. Actually when I am stalking I don't try to get closer than 50 yards. 50 yards is my goal. inside of that the odds of getting a relaxed shot at a Coues go way down. Don't believe me. Please start a thread about spot and stalk coues hunting. Ask experienced coues hunters what distance they feel comfortable shooting and why. This thread was not about long shots. Its about recovering an animal. I am really sick of all these brother hunters putting a huge guilt trip on Adam. Actually getting to 95 yards to an unaware Coues deer is good stalking. Many times you will get busted at much further out. I really think Adam should not feel at all bad. He should not lose any sleep about the animal. He should go out this weekend and drill one at 110.

Bob