Unsuccessful hunter in 22S in 2022?

[grey curse]

Go back to the days when someone could draw an elk tag every 5 yrs, deer tag every yr, and antelope tag every 15.  Back when we had to pay up front and loss those funds for 3 months.  The serious hunters will save up all yr to make sure they have the funds. The ones that don’t have the funds didn’t want it that bad anyway.     Oh but wait,  G&F wont get the millions of dollars in  app fee.  Never mind dumb idea.  

[CouesFanatic]

46 minutes ago, HighschoolHunter said:

Dude complains about 10 year olds getting drawn their first year, then says his kids will never have a chance. Pick a side. I’m happy with the AZ system as it is. Everyone gets a chance and the guys that have been in it a while get a 5-10x chance vs the first timers if you actually look at the draw odds. 0 points as a resident and you have less than a 0.5% chance for almost all sheep hunts. And it’s less than .1% for nonresidents for all hunts right up until they have max points, they don’t put a dent in your draw odds. 30+ points as a resident and you have a 3-7% chance for all but the Primo salt river hunts. It’s still terrible but statistically it’s way better than the guys starting out with nothing. I’d be fine with squaring the points too, but don’t flip the 80/20 random/bonus split. Your kids odds of ever drawing a tag would virtually disappear if they did that. 

The odds difference between 0 points and 30 points is virtually nothing. It amazes me that some of you think a guy waiting 40 years should have no edge on the newbies. The system we have raises virtually no increased odds until you get to the bonus point pass. Nevadas squared point system is a more fair way for sheep in AZ. 40 years is a lot of money and time invested. A 10 year old who has drawn only because his dad applied him has little interest, zero time invested and should have much less odds than the person who has applied 40 straight years. Our current system gives very little to the long term applicant until you hit the bonus point pass. We don't have to pick a side, how about we improve the draw system. A lot of states are making changes for once in a lifetime species, but unfortunately Arizona can't even get the website to work correctly. 

[CWpredator]

This might ruffle some feathers but I’m all for kid’s drawing what ever great tags they can now because they will have zero chance in the future going forward. I’m fortunate enough to have my desert ram with low points. I chased odds not legendary units and still killed a B&C sheep. Just took a lot of work. My daughter is turning 10 this year and can start hunting. If she draws a sheep tag, early rifle bull tag, late December coues tag, or strip tag we will be fully embracing that given hunt and making sure it’s a memory she has for life. What’s to say a child’s memory hunting with family are not as valuable as someone that’s been putting in for years? At the end of the day it’s just luck of the draw. My dad and stepdad are in max points for antelope and sheep and they and I don’t feel they are owed a thing. Entitlement isn’t a good look for anyone. Good luck to all in the upcoming draws

[trphyhntr]

 140 tags and 25,000 applicants. Face the fact that it’s a long shot or don’t apply. 

[CouesFanatic]

5 minutes ago, CWpredator said:

This might ruffle some feathers but I’m all for kid’s drawing what ever great tags they can now because they will have zero chance in the future going forward. I’m fortunate enough to have my desert ram with low points. I chased odds not legendary units and still killed a B&C sheep. Just took a lot of work. My daughter is turning 10 this year and can start hunting. If she draws a sheep tag, early rifle bull tag, late December coues tag, or strip tag we will be fully embracing that given hunt and making sure it’s a memory she has for life. What’s to say a child’s memory hunting with family are not as valuable as someone that’s been putting in for years? At the end of the day it’s just luck of the draw. My dad and stepdad are in max points for antelope and sheep and they and I don’t feel they are owed a thing. Entitlement isn’t a good look for anyone. Good luck to all in the upcoming draws

Nobody said their experience isn’t as valuable. All I’m saying is that the people who have invested decades and thousands of dollars should have higher odds than they currently do. We don’t have enough sheep tags to go around, it’s time to relook at the system for oil species. Other states are limiting non res, waiting periods, selecting certain species only, etc. I’m all for habitat and population growth. That’s one good thing AZ has going for it

[PRDATR]

Huge Crap Shoot. I might get dinged for this but G&F could start a Game Farm on a really large scale and once a Ram reaches say 155 release them into a unit a few months before the hunt. 

It's not quite like shooting fish in a barrel as they will be in historic areas where the terrain is unchanged and you still get the challenge.. After all lets be honest. We all love all of the facets of the hunt from camp to the arduous climb and packing out but the real thrill is the stalk and the exhilaration that comes after pulling the trigger, watching the aftermath of a good clean shot and the personal feeling of the reward. It's always about the successful hunt whether you are 10 years old on your first hunt or 80, hoping for five more.

[trphyhntr]

What the xxxx am I reading 

[cohntr6]

On 5/30/2023 at 9:51 AM, Umpqua said:

The worst hunting mistake I ever made was my decision to save a few bucks in my 20's and not buy a hunting license the very first year the bonus point system started.  Now, at the young age of 59, I've finally caught up and with 33 points, and last year was solidly in the bonus pass for sheep.  The premier desert sheep units are now on my radar.  

Here's my question.  I'm interested in what is going on in 22S.  There were two hunters in 22S last year and one killed a 167 6/8 ram.  There is not a second ram listed in the harvest report, so it appears that hunter didn't kill.  I know a bit about the ram that was taken and they harvested on day 5 and had trouble finding the class rams that unit has been known for.  The other hunter must have hunted 10 days, since a total of 15 hunting days are shown on the harvest report.  Do any of you now the story of the hunt where a ram wasn't taken?  Did they have any good opportunities?

I didn't really see anyone respond to the OP!

Sorry Umpqua, but I don't have an answer....just waiting for someone who does.

 

[Bill V]

I drew my tag in 2015 with 24 points and shared my camp with a hunter who drew with no points other than Hunter ed. So hope should spring eternal. That is the beauty of the Arizona system. Odds are long but not impossible.

[SwarovskiCoues]

funniest part is most people that cry put in units that goto max point holders every year 😂 

[Chef]

I just want to be able to post with my ram in my avatar!

[Chef]

😁

[naturebob]

1 hour ago, CouesFanatic said:

The odds difference between 0 points and 30 points is virtually nothing. It amazes me that some of you think a guy waiting 40 years should have no edge on the newbies. The system we have raises virtually no increased odds until you get to the bonus point pass. Nevadas squared point system is a more fair way for sheep in AZ. 40 years is a lot of money and time invested. A 10 year old who has drawn only because his dad applied him has little interest, zero time invested and should have much less odds than the person who has applied 40 straight years. Our current system gives very little to the long term applicant until you hit the bonus point pass. We don't have to pick a side, how about we improve the draw system. A lot of states are making changes for once in a lifetime species, but unfortunately Arizona can't even get the website to work correctly. 

Well said Sir !............BOB!

[yotebuster]

1 hour ago, CouesFanatic said:

The odds difference between 0 points and 30 points is virtually nothing. It amazes me that some of you think a guy waiting 40 years should have no edge on the newbies. The system we have raises virtually no increased odds until you get to the bonus point pass. Nevadas squared point system is a more fair way for sheep in AZ. 40 years is a lot of money and time invested. A 10 year old who has drawn only because his dad applied him has little interest, zero time invested and should have much less odds than the person who has applied 40 straight years. Our current system gives very little to the long term applicant until you hit the bonus point pass. We don't have to pick a side, how about we improve the draw system. A lot of states are making changes for once in a lifetime species, but unfortunately Arizona can't even get the website to work correctly. 

The odds of drawing a sheep tag with 30 points is actually 30 times better than with 0 points.  It’s diluted but it’s a fact.  

[yotebuster]

I said it earlier in this thread and I’ll say it again, AZ has the best sheep hunting in the country, bar none, and has the best way of divvying them out in the country.   You’ve always got a chance, and always working toward something.  Squared points get destroyed by lower point tiers inflating the odds.  Look at your chances of hard tags jn NV.  My points go up exponentially every year but my odds actually stay the same or in some high demand areas DECREASE every year.  I know everyone likes to complain about the G&F, and their abortion of an application website is worth complaining about but the quality and way of handing out tags is the best there is.