Muzzleloader information for beginners

[UggRedBilly]

1 hour ago, dsotm said:

Going to be doing a 45 cal smokeless build (can only use blackhorn to hunt in AZ) soon but have been using an Optima V2 out to 200 yards for the past 5 years, never let me down.

Sweet. What kinda bullet setup do you like if you don't mind me asking?

[dsotm]

1 hour ago, UggRedBilly said:

Sweet. What kinda bullet setup do you like if you don't mind me asking?

Harvester black sabot and either 300gr Deepcurl or XTP

[Heat]

1 hour ago, dsotm said:

Harvester black sabot and either 300gr Deepcurl or XTP

Just ordered the 300 grain XTP in 44 cal and some green Crush Ribs to try. Deepcurls have been MIA for a long while.

[NOTAGS]

I've used the Barnes Spitfire TMZ for years, they penetrate well and expand without disintegrating.  I had started out with the Powerbelts due to how ez  to load and good accuracy, but they fragmented too much, and did not get the penetration I wanted.  The Barnes are very accurate as well.  I shoot the 250 gr, for everything.  I remember someone asked Jim Shockey years ago if he changed bullets depending on game, and he said no, he shoots 250's for everything and he doesnt have to rethink it.  Also, most muzzleloader scopes are designed for the 250 gr as far as BDC features, but also with 150 gr loads.  Those are not much fun to shoot.  I use 100, and practiced with my BDC at the different yardages to know what the changes would be with the lower charge.  I have a Knight Disc, that I bought over 25 years ago, and will never change.  If you shoot the Pyrodex or Triple 7, remember to clean the barrel  every few shots when you go to dial it in, a fouled barrel  will definitely throw you off.   I bought some Blackhorn to try a couple years ago, but have had such good luck with the  Triple 7, and ease of loading, I have  never opened it.  Now the Blackhorn is $79 per jug.....wth?  Each gun will be a little different, when you get one you'll figure out the sweet spot for it with powder and bullet. I picked up a used TC on a whim, and the barrel is so tight, I have to use Spitfire T-EZ on it.

[Heat]

21 hours ago, UggRedBilly said:

Gotcha. I think imma just get a few different types and mess around with them when I buy a muzzy. Is it okay to order powder online and send it to my house. Or is there legalities with shipping anything with gun powder?

Good idea to try different bullets to see what your gun likes. The nice thing is that here in AZ we are wide open on what we can shoot for bullets; lead, copper, plastic tips, sabot, whatever. It's all legal. Other states you are limited on what you can use.

On the powder (and primers) you can order it, but be aware that you will be assessed a rather large fee for having Hazmat shipped to you. If you can find it locally you may not have to pay so much. Also if you can order online and have it shipped to a store nearby, you can usually spare yourself all the shipping fees. It will have to go ground shipping so don't be in a hurry when you order.

[UggRedBilly]

5 hours ago, Heat said:

Good idea to try different bullets to see what your gun likes. The nice thing is that here in AZ we are wide open on what we can shoot for bullets; lead, copper, plastic tips, sabot, whatever. It's all legal. Other states you are limited on what you can use.

On the powder (and primers) you can order it, but be aware that you will be assessed a rather large fee for having Hazmat shipped to you. If you can find it locally you may not have to pay so much. Also if you can order online and have it shipped to a store nearby, you can usually spare yourself all the shipping fees. It will have to go ground shipping so don't be in a hurry when you order.

I was looking online and I am going to be picking up some blackhorn 209 tomorrow from basspro because they have it in store! I am gonna go buy 2 things of it so I can have about 60 shots worth to practice and maybe that'll hold me over till elk season. The tag I am looking at is super easy to draw. I put in for late bull first and then the late cow which both got awesome success rates

[Markleo21377]

On 1/22/2023 at 8:52 PM, UggRedBilly said:

I was looking at the regs and I saw a hunt that I liked that I can draw fairly often in an area I know well. It is a late muzzy hunt. 

I have no experience with muzzleloaders so i wanted to ask around for possible rifles and gear opinions. 

I was looking at CVA optima. Also I was really looking at the Remington 700 UML. 

I heard that the CVA's aren't too good at about the 200 yard mark. But the remmington is much better for long range. 

What should I get? I am willing to spend the extra money for better gear. But if I can make a setup with the CVA or any other gun for cheaper with about a 200-300 yards range I would rather do that if its cheaper. Thanks guys

Some good recommendations but in my opinion none of them touch a CVA paramount in 45 caliber. Has a renowned Bergara barrel and threaded barrel for a muzzle break which is a big deal shooting magnum loads. They shoot lights out way beyond 300 yards. Shoot Blackhorn 209 with power belt ELR’s and you will shoot MOA out to 500 yards. Price point is decent and best box muzzleloader out there. 

good luck in the draw! Mark

[Crazymonkey]

I love my cva paramount pro 45 cal .Put a break on it from anarchy outdoors and run 115 gr by weight of blackhorn 209 with the elr powerbelt. The book has 105 by weight then cva said 112 by weight and then it was 115 by weight .There is no stated max like most muzzleloader rifles that are marked magnum rated which is a standard 150 gr by volume charge.Cva has backed off the 115 gr by weight and says no improvement on accuracy and is back to the 105 gr . At 115 my gun is moa or better and I have no problem ringing the steal plate at Rio Salado out to 300 the max I can shoot at the range. I do need to chronograph the thing since increasing the powder but it was at 2500 plus fps before and the accuracy is the same . I figure the extra powder is going to give me a little flatter shot and is worth the extra recoil.

 

 

 

 

[AZBIG10]

10 hours ago, Markleo21377 said:

Some good recommendations but in my opinion none of them touch a CVA paramount in 45 caliber. Has a renowned Bergara barrel and threaded barrel for a muzzle break which is a big deal shooting magnum loads. They shoot lights out way beyond 300 yards. Shoot Blackhorn 209 with power belt ELR’s and you will shoot MOA out to 500 yards. Price point is decent and best box muzzleloader out there. 

good luck in the draw! Mark

I’m all ears. I have this set up and just found some black horn. Would you mind  sharing any data?

[Markleo21377]

1 hour ago, AZBIG10 said:

I’m all ears. I have this set up and just found some black horn. Would you mind  sharing any data?

Same as crazy monkey posted above. Start at Blackhorn 105 by weight and shoot elr 280’s. Shoot be lights out.

[bigorange]

On 1/23/2023 at 7:32 PM, Heat said:

Thompson Center is basically defunct. They are no longer making guns. Big pass on that one for me with no parts and no after product support if you get a lemon or bad part. Trust me I thought long and hard about buying a Pro Hunter FX which is the non removable barrel version. The one you are thinking of is the Encore I think.

I was wondering why nobody had mentioned TC since they used to be very popular. Did not know that about them. 

[bigorange]

12 hours ago, UggRedBilly said:

I was looking online and I am going to be picking up some blackhorn 209 tomorrow from basspro because they have it in store! I am gonna go buy 2 things of it so I can have about 60 shots worth to practice and maybe that'll hold me over till elk season. The tag I am looking at is super easy to draw. I put in for late bull first and then the late cow which both got awesome success rates

Don’t talk/post about how easy they are to draw if you want them to stay that way. 

[Bucks N Bulls]

I have had a tc for years and it has been great. This year i bought the cva paramount htr in 40 cal. I really like it alot. Groups well and is fast and accurate. I have shot it out to 500 yards. It is proven to shoot further but my max is 500 even with my rifles. I use triple 7 and pyrodex ellets both in my tc and This one i only use blackhorn and very happy with it. 

[NOTAGS]

For those of you who are shooting out to 500 yards, the big questions is, how much KE do you have?  Is it enough for penetration and proper bullet expansion?  I  would question  shooting a muzzleloader  at a bull elk at that range .   Ringing a gong is a whole lot  different.

[Bucks N Bulls]

Who said anything about shooting a bull at 500 yards? I did shoot a deer with this at 450 and it was plenty. The 40 cal with a 125 gr is over 2700 ft per second. And yep i would certainly shoot a bull at 500 with my 7mm and my 300 mag. Get real dude!