Kowa spotters

[JSR]

What’s your experience with them. I’m going to replace a Vortex razor 85mm spotter that someone else evidently could not live without. 
 

Is the Kowa Prominar TSN - 824 a noticing upgrade from the Gen II Razor? 

[high rise hunter]

I just picked up a couple 664s and been putting them up against the BTX 85 in the backyard the last 1.5 days. They're impressive spotters that together optically outperform the BTX. Headed down south in a couple of days so will really get to test them out then.

[Shawn]

I jut got the 664 a couple weeks ago.  I have had the Gen 1 65 and Gen 2 85 razor.  The 664 is better than them both to me.  

[FrustratedMonk]

Few points. First, everyone's eyes are different. Second, I only use spotting scopes for confirmations and not for glassing. Third, take a look at the following link for a spotting scope comparison (take with grain of salt):

https://backwoodspursuit.com/best-spotting-scope-for-hunting/

 

Go with the models with fluorite which includes the 55x, 88x, and 99x; the 77x is non-flourite but is very competitive with alpha glass.

I've done a lot of comparing my STX 65 with my Kowa 554 in the field across a variety of terrain in AZ. For half the cost and half the weight of the STX 65, the fluorite in the 554 punches well above its weight. The STX 65 is better but not 100% better 100% all of the time. My STX stays home more now that I have the 554 (just to show how good the fluorite is).

I was able to compare my 554 with a guide's older STS 65 on Kodiak. To my eyes the 554 was better all around. According to S&S, Swarovski may have recently updated the lenses in the STS. If I did not already have a STX 65 and 95, I'd be all over the 88x or 99x to compliment my 554. 

CameraLand has a Shot Show deal right now so it could be a great opportunity to get a Kowa at a lower price point. 

[Heat]

I'm kind of a tight wad but I like good stuff when I know I am getting my money's worth. I bought the Kowa 554 before my wife's Kaibab late hunt this past fall. No regrets whatsoever. I know I will have that on me from here out. The bigger ones, maybe not. Simply incredible at 2#.

[Heat]

I guess I didn't directly answer your question. If you are going with the Kowa, get one with the Flourite glass! I suspect the 880 series is really the one you want if you don't mind a bigger spotter. It is arguably one of the best spotters you can buy. There is a Kowa in the classifieds that is a great spotter if you are OK with a fixed eyepiece and not stuck on the flourite glass.

[JSR]

Thank you. 
 

It looks like that any of their “prominar” scopes have the better glass. 
 I don’t think I want a fixed power scope but maybe if there was sort of distinct advantage to it over a zoom. 

[Swivelhead]

18 hours ago, JSR said:

 
I don’t think I want a fixed power scope but maybe if there was sort of distinct advantage to it over a zoom. 

Fixed power eyepieces generally have a larger field of view @ their given magnification.  Often, the "sweet spot" is slightly larger.  I own a 663 Prominar scope with a 30X wide eyepiece.  Nice scope but does not have Fluorite lenses.  My 663 with lens caps in place + an Outdoorsman's adapter on it weighs a shade under 3#.

[CatfishKev]

I'm a fan of the 66mm even though they are not fluorite they are still great.  Get 2 of them and build a pair of big eyes. Then you have the option of taking one off for a backpack hunt when needed. And for the price you could build 2 kowas big eye setups for the price of the btx.

[Heat]

Obviously the zoom wins for convenience and variety but for overall image quality, depth of field, and "sweet spot" fixed eyepiece wins. That's a reason why the high quality telescope stuff is all fixed eyepieces and not zoom.

[nooch2222]

On 1/18/2023 at 8:06 PM, high rise hunter said:

I just picked up a couple 664s and been putting them up against the BTX 85 in the backyard the last 1.5 days. They're impressive spotters that together optically outperform the BTX. Headed down south in a couple of days so will really get to test them out then.

Any Feedback with the 664's? I had the BTX eyepiece with 95mm and found it to be to dark and heavy for my liking, But I only took it on one Coues hunt and then sold it because of the weight. Packing out a deer, rifle and optics in October down south was not fun! Now I have the 85mm STX and debating on buy the BTX eyepiece again. Or going with Dual spotters since I picked up some Swaro 15's.

[high rise hunter]

3 hours ago, nooch2222 said:

Any Feedback with the 664's? I had the BTX eyepiece with 95mm and found it to be to dark and heavy for my liking, But I only took it on one Coues hunt and then sold it because of the weight. Packing out a deer, rifle and optics in October down south was not fun! Now I have the 85mm STX and debating on buy the BTX eyepiece again. Or going with Dual spotters since I picked up some Swaro 15's.

I packed both the Kowas and BTX 85mm everywhere I went and 9/10 times I was reaching for the dual spotters. The 664s to my surprise optically blew the BTX out of the water. The FOV and light gathering is significantly better. (Side note - I believe the FOV and exit pupil is better with the 85 then the 95 paired with the BTX.)

A few take aways:

-The dual spotters took a little time to find that perfect sweet spot for my eyes pupillary distance. This was a bit of an annoyance. The BTX is much more refined in this aspect. It's so easy to look through and you instantly get this perfect "circle" view that is crisp from edge to edge and seemingly provides more eye relief which I love. The BTX is user friendly.

-I forgot how much I prefer straight over angled glassing. Target acquisition is so much faster with the dual Kowas then the BTX. FOV probably plays a factor here as well.

-I also packed a 20-60x zoom eye piece for the 664. The eye pieces switch out very quickly and easily and was a good option if I wanted to get a closer look at something. Unfortunately, I left that piece on top of hill down in the 36s so hoping I can find a way to get back down there to scoop it back up. 

-The Outdoor Vision protective case on my BTX doesn't allow me to use the sun shade. Having the sunshades readily available on the Kowas was great.

-The Kowas required more tripod (or longer leg extension) given the straight vs angled spotting. I definitely noticed this with the wind and at times was not able to get quite as steady as the BTX.

-The dual spotters are noticeably heavier than the BTX with the 85 objective. So much to the point where I cringe thinking about packing them on a big, long backpack hunt. On my scale, I have the BTX set up at 100oz and the dual 664s (including the zoom eyepiece) at 133oz so basically 2 LBs heavier. The BTX also takes up a lot less pack space. For this reason I think the BTX is the better backpack "big eyes" setup and Kowas better for everything else and even doable for shorter ~3 day backpack trips. 

 

I'm certainly left wondering how the BTX with the 115mm would compare to the dual Kowas. This would mostly level the playing field in terms of weight and size. The 115 would give 5x extra zoom; FOV would still favor the Kowas but would light gathering match?

[CatfishKev]

On 2/8/2023 at 10:25 AM, high rise hunter said:

I packed both the Kowas and BTX 85mm everywhere I went and 9/10 times I was reaching for the dual spotters. The 664s to my surprise optically blew the BTX out of the water. The FOV and light gathering is significantly better. (Side note - I believe the FOV and exit pupil is better with the 85 then the 95 paired with the BTX.)

A few take aways:

-The dual spotters took a little time to find that perfect sweet spot for my eyes pupillary distance. This was a bit of an annoyance. The BTX is much more refined in this aspect. It's so easy to look through and you instantly get this perfect "circle" view that is crisp from edge to edge and seemingly provides more eye relief which I love. The BTX is user friendly.

-I forgot how much I prefer straight over angled glassing. Target acquisition is so much faster with the dual Kowas then the BTX. FOV probably plays a factor here as well.

-I also packed a 20-60x zoom eye piece for the 664. The eye pieces switch out very quickly and easily and was a good option if I wanted to get a closer look at something. Unfortunately, I left that piece on top of hill down in the 36s so hoping I can find a way to get back down there to scoop it back up. 

-The Outdoor Vision protective case on my BTX doesn't allow me to use the sun shade. Having the sunshades readily available on the Kowas was great.

-The Kowas required more tripod (or longer leg extension) given the straight vs angled spotting. I definitely noticed this with the wind and at times was not able to get quite as steady as the BTX.

-The dual spotters are noticeably heavier than the BTX with the 85 objective. So much to the point where I cringe thinking about packing them on a big, long backpack hunt. On my scale, I have the BTX set up at 100oz and the dual 664s (including the zoom eyepiece) at 133oz so basically 2 LBs heavier. The BTX also takes up a lot less pack space. For this reason I think the BTX is the better backpack "big eyes" setup and Kowas better for everything else and even doable for shorter ~3 day backpack trips. 

 

I'm certainly left wondering how the BTX with the 115mm would compare to the dual Kowas. This would mostly level the playing field in terms of weight and size. The 115 would give 5x extra zoom; FOV would still favor the Kowas but would light gathering match?

Nice to see an objective point of view from someone who actually has both.  Given that you could get 2 big eye setups for the cost of the btx sure makes the kowas setup very appealing.  If I had 5k to play with for optics I'd go NL pure 12s and kowa big eyes.  If packing far pull one of the kowas and just pack the spotters.  

Curious as I haven't seen one of the Adams adapters. Could you drill some more holes in the plate to shave some weight off?  I wonder how hard it would be to form a carbon fiber plate....

[JSR]

Ended up picking up a Zeiss 85 T* FL with flouride glass for $1200

[Swivelhead]

37 minutes ago, JSR said:

Ended up picking up a Zeiss 85 T* FL with flouride glass for $1200

You scored a really nice optic at a great price.