bowsniper Report post Posted September 25, 2008 This is a personal opinion and belief that i hold to be true which is derived from my faith obtained through my religious conviction. It is against gods will to allow same same sex marriage which will contribute to the "downfall" of the country because the success of a nation is inevitably connected to the rightousness of the nation. why are we in such a economic crap hole because we are allowing actions contrary to gods will to be allowed, accepted, and promoted actions such as same sex marriages, abortions etc.. The more wrong decisions we make the less prosperous and we are individually and as a nation. if god does not destroy California with heck fire and brimstone he owes sodom and gomorrah an apology. just my opinion Well said. Mark Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Rembrant Report post Posted September 25, 2008 A truly gay person is genetically determined. They have no more choice in their gayness then you have choice with your height. They don't turn gay. They are just gay. Why do you think gay people have so many traits (stereotypes) in common. You think there is a Gay training center somewhere. These traits transcend race, culture, and religion. World wide gayness. When a guy gets a Harley, he gets the leathers, and may go on to skulls and flames, beards, shades and the whole 9 yards. When a guy hunts, he gets a truck, maybe a quad, gotta have a rifle, and cammo - might as well get the deer head decals for the truck. When a guy buys the racing bicycle, he gets the wind cutting clothes and the funny shoes, and the helmet, and the big legs. When a middle or high schooler wants to look tough he gets the baggy pants and shirts, no belt, saggs down the street and can throw out the hand signs. How many scenarios are there? When a guy or girl decides to become a homo. they will play one roll or the other. The change can come quick or over time. When a guy or girl chooses to stop living the homo. lifestyle, they stop the roll playing, and become what they want to be next. There is absolutely no scientific evidence of a homosexual gene. There was at one time, but it proved to be a lie by a homo. scientist. There are lots of lies, this is just one of them. Mike Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
mr.smith Report post Posted September 25, 2008 I do believe Jesus lived and may have been a great teacher/philosopher, just minus all the miracles and divinity. Really? A guy going around claiming to be God, a good teacher? If He is not who He said He is, then He's not a good teacher, that would make Him more of a liar, or a flaming lunatic! I don't believe he ever made any claim to divinity. It was his followers who were looking for more than a teacher that diefied him. Other than the bible; what records of his life exist? If a guy was going around claiming to be God there surely would have been more written during his life rather than years after his death. The Romans crucified lots of people for lots of things. I believe Jesus' followers immortalized him as a martyr and he "became" God after his death. Also, It's nice to see so many of you acknowledging evolution. Only when it fit's your needs right? Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
bowsniper Report post Posted September 25, 2008 I do believe Jesus lived and may have been a great teacher/philosopher, just minus all the miracles and divinity. Really? A guy going around claiming to be God, a good teacher? If He is not who He said He is, then He's not a good teacher, that would make Him more of a liar, or a flaming lunatic! I don't believe he ever made any claim to divinity. It was his followers who were looking for more than a teacher that diefied him. Other than the bible; what records of his life exist? If a guy was going around claiming to be God there surely would have been more written during his life rather than years after his death. The Romans crucified lots of people for lots of things. I believe Jesus' followers immortalized him as a martyr and he "became" God after his death. Mr. Smith, you should spend some time in the bible. You are wrong. Jesus claimed (and is!) to be the Son of God. Matthew 16:13 13 When Jesus came to the region of Caesarea Philippi, he asked his disciples, “Who do people say that the Son of Man is?”[c] 14 “Well,” they replied, “some say John the Baptist, some say Elijah, and others say Jeremiah or one of the other prophets.” 15 Then he asked them, “But who do you say I am?” 16 Simon Peter answered, “You are the Messiah,[d] the Son of the living God.” 17 Jesus replied, “You are blessed, Simon son of John,[e] because my Father in heaven has revealed this to you. You did not learn this from any human being. 18 Now I say to you that you are Peter (which means ‘rock’),[f] and upon this rock I will build my church, and all the powers of heck[g] will not conquer it. 19 And I will give you the keys of the Kingdom of Heaven. Whatever you forbid[h] on earth will be forbidden in heaven, and whatever you permit on earth will be permitted in heaven.” 20 Then he sternly warned the disciples not to tell anyone that he was the Messiah. Mark Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Kilimanjaro Report post Posted September 25, 2008 I want in so bad in this "disscussion", but absolutely nothing good at all would come of it.. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
mr.smith Report post Posted September 25, 2008 Maybe you missed the part where I mentioned that, I bolded it below. But for further clarification the bible(new testament obviously) was written during the period of appx 40ad to 200ad and later and not a word of it penned by Jesus himself. Much more was written than is included in the KJV. Some of it is actually quite absurd from what I have read of it. Perhaps you should read the bible. And the disincluded gospels. Perhaps you should read the whole post before you quote it and respond. This is going to quickly turn into a pissing contest and I want no part of it so I am done with this thread. I do believe Jesus lived and may have been a great teacher/philosopher, just minus all the miracles and divinity. Really? A guy going around claiming to be God, a good teacher? If He is not who He said He is, then He's not a good teacher, that would make Him more of a liar, or a flaming lunatic! I don't believe he ever made any claim to divinity. It was his followers who were looking for more than a teacher that diefied him. Other than the bible; what records of his life exist? If a guy was going around claiming to be God there surely would have been more written during his life rather than years after his death. The Romans crucified lots of people for lots of things. I believe Jesus' followers immortalized him as a martyr and he "became" God after his death. Mr. Smith, you should spend some time in the bible. You are wrong. Jesus claimed (and is!) to be the Son of God. Matthew 16:13 13 When Jesus came to the region of Caesarea Philippi, he asked his disciples, “Who do people say that the Son of Man is?”[c] 14 “Well,” they replied, “some say John the Baptist, some say Elijah, and others say Jeremiah or one of the other prophets.” 15 Then he asked them, “But who do you say I am?” 16 Simon Peter answered, “You are the Messiah,[d] the Son of the living God.” 17 Jesus replied, “You are blessed, Simon son of John,[e] because my Father in heaven has revealed this to you. You did not learn this from any human being. 18 Now I say to you that you are Peter (which means ‘rock’),[f] and upon this rock I will build my church, and all the powers of heck[g] will not conquer it. 19 And I will give you the keys of the Kingdom of Heaven. Whatever you forbid[h] on earth will be forbidden in heaven, and whatever you permit on earth will be permitted in heaven.” 20 Then he sternly warned the disciples not to tell anyone that he was the Messiah. Mark Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
bowsniper Report post Posted September 25, 2008 Maybe you missed the part where I mentioned that, I bolded it below. But for further clarification the bible(new testament obviously) was written during the period of appx 40ad to 200ad and later and not a word of it penned by Jesus himself. Much more was written than is included in the KJV. Some of it is actually quite absurd from what I have read of it. Perhaps you should read the bible. And the disincluded gospels. Perhaps you should read the whole post before you quote it and respond. This is going to quickly turn into a pissing contest and I want no part of it so I am done with this thread. Mr. Smith, I am sorry that you are so hostile towards Christ. I will say a prayer for you. Mark Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
mr.smith Report post Posted September 25, 2008 Mr. Smith, I am sorry that you are so hostile towards Christ. I will say a prayer for you. Mark Even though our views are vastly different, I sincerely appreciate the gesture and your concern for my spiritual well being. In my view I am not hostile towards him. I believe he was a genius among men in his time. Thanks to all for the (mostly) civil discussion. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
bowhunter4life Report post Posted September 26, 2008 I want in so bad in this "disscussion", but absolutely nothing good at all would come of it.. I'm wih you!! all "gays" can be traced to , " being raped, molested,or a non MAN " figure " influence in there lives. typically these things have accured during an age group 5-14 years of age. it has nothing to do with being born with " I'm gay". I wonder how close we are be being a Sodom and Gomorrah nation. we do provide 75% of all porn to the world. I better stop now, God Bless our nation,we sure need it.mike Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Rembrant Report post Posted September 26, 2008 Yo, Mr Smith, There are a number of guys that were athiests that set out to prove the Bible as bunk and wound up, after the research, accepting Christ as thier Lord and Savior. One is C.S. Lewis - British born, and wrote books in the early to mid 1900's. Lewis wrote "Mere Christianity", "The Chronicals of Narnia" and many others. Another more contemporary Josh Mc Dowell is a college professor (history and literature) who was sick and tired of Christian students coming up with their ramble. He would always shoot them down and do everything he could to embarass them. Mc Dowell set out to study the Bible to expose its problems and inconsistancies, and write a book to tell the world about it. As a result of his research he wrote a book called, "More Than a Carpenter". In this book he tackles the stuff you mentioned; Jesus claiming diety, Bibliographical test, Internal and external evidence tests of the New Testament. These are the tests that ancient manuscripts of all kinds go through to prove validity. Manuscripts such as Aristotle 343BC, Ceasar's "Gallic Wars"AD1100, The Illiad and all the others. Mc Dowell states: "When it comes to manuscript authority of the New Testament (compared to the others) the abundance of material is almost embarrassing in contrast." The other ancient manuscripts are accepted as truth, but somehow the New Testament, though the copies of maunuscripts and proof of its validity - by modern testing methods - is overwhelmingly superior to the others, is somehow easily brushed off as fake? I'd like to go on, but the books are already written - I don't need to write one here. My point is Mr. Smith, that you are not even being honest with yourself, if you won't do the research. I like your audasity, but you gotta try a little harder to keep up! Thanks, Mike Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Rembrant Report post Posted September 26, 2008 Forgot to add something really important: One of my best friends is the chief prosecuting attorney in my area. One day while fishing on Roosevelt he asks me, "Mike, what do you base your faith in Christ on?" Set me back a bit, thought about it, then told him it was a combination of early exposure of the faith by my parents, answers to prayer that I had witnessed, and an overwhelming sense in my heart that Jesus was real. So, then I asked him, "What do you base your faith in Christ on?" He answered, "The evidence". Mike Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Noel Arnold Report post Posted September 26, 2008 Her is another verse were Jesus proclaims who he is. ( I am the door.No man cometh un to the father except by me) Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Ben-Dover Report post Posted September 26, 2008 "NO" ON 102 Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
mr.smith Report post Posted September 26, 2008 Ok, one last reply and then I'm really done. The scripture proves nothing. As I have already mentioned it was written by MAN. Many years AFTER the death of Christ. Sure you can validate that it was written when it was written. Doesnt make it true. "based on a true story" perhaps. Then there are the translations all hand written by scribes. Every copy was different. Finally in who knows what year the church canonized various gospels and compiled the KJV. They agreed upon what best to present as their teachings. All done by man. If we want to base truth on everything we read then I guess I will go get some Dino DNA from amber and start cloning T-rex's to use in the war on terror. It was written so it must be true. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Non-Typical Solutions Report post Posted September 26, 2008 AT least mr. smith you have had the decency to go ahead and have a civil discussion on the matter, much appreciated. Jeff Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
