G&F commission voted unanimously to ban trail cams

[Big Tub]

Should it worry us that there was significant opposition to the ban yet they voted unanimously?  Why bother with comment periods?  Seems eerily familiar to a presidential election where the outcome seems to be established before the voting began.  

[n2horns]

7 hours ago, Desertguide said:

Funny you say all that. One of the commissioners used California and Oregon as an example of why he was voting for the ban. 

The real problem is too many people comming from communists states bringing their bad ideas and ruining clean and free states.

We can joke about all the crap. But it will happen.

[AZLance]

Anyone else notice that they mention "Anglers" in their talking points...  "technology to take wildlife without acquiring angling skills..." 

sounds like fish finders are next...especially with the new live scope fish finders...

[lancetkenyon]

On 6/12/2021 at 1:11 PM, azelkhunter2 said:

Just some of many ranch rules....You can not have ANY blinds of any kind on the ranch and absolutely no hunting within 100 yards of any  water source...

Thanks for the clarification.

[AZBIG10]

1 hour ago, AZLance said:

Anyone else notice that they mention "Anglers" in their talking points...  "technology to take wildlife without acquiring angling skills..." 

sounds like fish finders are next...especially with the new live scope fish finders...

 

can’t help but ponder the governors tag and the fair chase argument.  

[Roosevelt Mark]

As I have said, I don't use trail cams but I don't like the fact of loosing another freedom.  

You start talking about my electronics on my 3 boats I will go to war.  Jmo.

Fishing is not hunting,  fish are let go, bullet 's  and arrows are made to kill sh.t 

[wildwoody]

Nope you don't, lmfao

[bowhunter4life]

This was a personal agenda based on their idea of fair chase...... AZGFD controls all tags, manages success rate of bowhunters (20% harvest of rifle hunters- season closes deer) - just look at all the closed units this year- harvest will always be roughly the same for all big game animals, as they issue and manage each year all  tag allocations based on hunter success and unit conditions. Just look at the history over a time...

For me the biggest disappointment and was truly disgusting as a Sportsman who values open minded discussions and conservation through the North American model.  Witnessing each commissioner pull out and a read their pre-written statements of excuses why fair chase was needed to help wildlife and vote the complete ban of trail camera - Yuck!! Almost made made me throw up sitting there witnessing it.   I lost all respect for the commission as the open public comment discussion was just a process and was on death ears and their facial expressions showed . Additionally, The Emergency rule to open the rule making to the Governor was requested to protect the lives of sportsman and fellow citizens.  Not once did they address public safety. Looks like Sir Royal was correct- the trail camera ban was a self created political agenda.....    

What am I missing here.....    All they talked about was Fair chase with the new definition.  Its interesting as all technologies will guide in a quarry's ability to elude detection- What is overwhelmed mean??   Since I use my 15x 56 swaro and spot n stalk and harvest the javelina, deer or elk... looks like I am now guilty as the critter was not able to elude detection? I found it and went and harvested it with a valid tag.......  Yup a bit frustrated....

Fair Chase is the ethical, sportsmanlike and lawful pursuit and taking of free-range wildlife in a manner that does not give a hunter or an angler improper or unfair advantage over such wildlife.

Fair Chase has been embraced as the proper conduct of a sportsman/sportswoman in the field and has been taught to new hunters for more than a century. It pays respect to the traditions of hunting and angling by emphasizing the development of an individual’s skills rather than reliance on practices or technologies that overwhelm the quarry’s ability to elude detection or take. In many situations, Fair Chase is not something that is enforceable by law.  Rather it should be guided by each person’s own ethical compass, which compels them to do the right thing when no one else is watching—even when doing the wrong thing is legal.

  AZGFD   

 

 

 

[n2horns]

Fair chase will soon be redefined just like there are 58 different genders now, instead of the normal and usual 2 male and female.

[AZtroutman]

16 minutes ago, bowhunter4life said:

 

Fair Chase is the ethical, sportsmanlike and lawful pursuit and taking of free-range wildlife in a manner that does not give a hunter or an angler improper or unfair advantage over such wildlife.

Fair Chase has been embraced as the proper conduct of a sportsman/sportswoman in the field and has been taught to new hunters for more than a century. It pays respect to the traditions of hunting and angling by emphasizing the development of an individual’s skills rather than reliance on practices or technologies that overwhelm the quarry’s ability to elude detection or take. In many situations, Fair Chase is not something that is enforceable by law.  Rather it should be guided by each person’s own ethical compass, which compels them to do the right thing when no one else is watching—even when doing the wrong thing is legal.

  AZGFD   

 

 

 

I highlighted a few things for you from your post. Its like they wrote that in there specifically for trail cameras. Trail cameras are the perfect example of not fair chase. Binos don't overwhelm any animals ability to elude detection or take. 1300 trail cameras from one outfitter on the strip certainly does though.

[AZtroutman]

.

[bowhunter4life]

32 minutes ago, AZtroutman said:

I highlighted a few things for you from your post. Its like they wrote that in there specifically for trail cameras. Trail cameras are the perfect example of not fair chase. Binos don't overwhelm any animals ability to elude detection or take. 1300 trail cameras from one outfitter on the strip certainly does though.

I completely disagree... Have you pre scouted before your hunt??  Ask any hunter who puts the time in to scout and show up a few days before the opening day. Sitting a mile a way glassing with their Binos and learning where they are in the morning, where they bed and where they end up during the evening.  Once opening day hits- they are like clock work and have no chance to elude detection and will overwhelm them when the bullet hits them!  Now throw in the new exciting long range shooting... These critters have zero chance to elude detection and will be harvested due to the diligence of hunters whom did their homework.

 

1300 cameras from the Strip, one outfitter.. really? I had the strip tag and hunted it (without an outfitter but with friends) and there is no way that is truth! I hunted numerous water sources without a camera on it!  

[AZtroutman]

19 minutes ago, bowhunter4life said:

I completely disagree... Have you pre scouted before your hunt??  Ask any hunter who puts the time in to scout and show up a few days before the opening day. Sitting a mile a way glassing with their Binos and learning where they are in the morning, where they bed and where they end up during the evening.  Once opening day hits- they are like clock work and have no chance to elude detection and will overwhelm them when the bullet hits them!  Now throw in the new exciting long range shooting... These critters have zero chance to elude detection and will be harvested due to the diligence of hunters whom did their homework.

 

1300 cameras from the Strip, one outfitter.. really? I had the strip tag and hunted it (without an outfitter but with friends) and there is no way that is truth! I hunted numerous water sources without a camera on it!  

Ok, I guess Matt schimberg who runs A3 on the strip was lying when he said that. 

 

I guess if everyone can just show up 3 days before the hunt and glass a little and know what every deer is doing then we never really needed cameras to help in the first place so everything should be fine now. I'll also call bullshi* that you hunted "numerous" water sources without a camera on it. Unless you hunted 15+ years ago. . .  Or you've never actually hunted the strip.

[SirRoyal]

On 6/11/2021 at 2:50 PM, lancetkenyon said:

To me, this will be all but unenforceable.  A waste of time.  It needed to be black or white.  This is as grey as you can get.

I have said that from day one! I'm pumped and ready to flex some muscle!  Here is why? 

1. It start wrong with THE LIE. THE SIGNIFICANT PUBLIC SAFETY THREAT. 

2. We applied pressure so they changed there narrative to fair chase. 

3. Every single commissioner that did podcasts and or public out reach never one time brought up the LIE. 

4. This was an agenda driven by the minority with prejudices against trail cams with in the CANCEL CULTURE hunting community and with in the dept and with in the commission chaired by Chairman Davis. By the way Bill Brake is now the chairman.

5. This was not a well thought out solution to anything all it did was create a quagmire!

6. Come on gentlemen since when does goverment know how to fix anything?

7. They listed 9 sorry  excuses for the ban. Go read them you will laugh too!

8. They have no Scientific evidence to back up a single claim!

9. The only evidence they have is there own public comments . Which they did twice and each time hunters overwhelming were against this ban. They ignored what the majority of their constituents wanted and catered to the prejudices of the minority. Sound familiar? 

10.  This commission meeting Friday was nothing but a dog and pony show here is why. We were allowed to make public comments before the vote. At the vote time each commissioner read their pre prepared statements of how they would vote and every single one knew not to vote for Option 2 but vote for Option 1. 

11. I thought they would at least consider what was said that day to them . Their minds were already made up . I thought the Commissioners would vote from the integrity of their hearts not by the COLLUSION of 5 . 

12. I realized the AZ Commissioners and Azgfd had taken the innocence of photography thru the lense of a trail camera and allowed the cancel culture hunting community to buy into their progressive agenda. When Peta and Sierra Club and the US Humane Society agree with the Commissioners we got a problem.

13.  I was amazed by their abuse of Power. Everyone of them should resign now starting with Commissioner Davis and then Commissioner Geiler and on down.  Shame on every one of them !  Power without Character is evil and dangerous!

This is not the end!

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

[shooterpar]

With the current drought conditions we have, how can 24hr monitoring of water sources be considered fair chase? 
 

It pays respect to the traditions of hunting and angling by emphasizing the development of an individual’s skills rather than reliance on practices or technologies that overwhelm the quarry’s ability to elude detection or take.