Edge Report post Posted May 5, 2021 It didn't take long for me to stop burning black powder in the rolling block and trapdoor. I'm trying a recipe from Ed Harris's 'The Load' using 12grains Red Dot. Anyone else loading smokeless for low velocity rounds? What recipe works for you? Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
PRDATR Report post Posted May 5, 2021 Are you adding some sort of filler? Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Edge Report post Posted May 5, 2021 No, not recommended 1 Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Bucks&bulls Report post Posted May 5, 2021 Edge and I talked about this awhile back. Wish I had a good answer to the question. I have been looking at a ton of stuff on the internet and old loading manuals. Have a bunch of Unique on hand and found Winchester & Marlin loads using Unique. Loaded up 10 but only shot two. Reason being the velocities I got were WAY off the data. I’m shooting a 1895 Marlin 45-70 and while the loads were still safe in that rifle I didn’t care for the deviation from the data. I will try H4198 when I can find some. Data shows low pressure for that powder. Will report back if and when... Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Edge Report post Posted May 5, 2021 2 minutes ago, Bucks&bulls said: Edge and I talked about this awhile back. Wish I had a good answer to the question. I have been looking at a ton of stuff on the internet and old loading manuals. Have a bunch of Unique on hand and found trapdoor loads using Unique. Loaded up 10 but only shot two. Reason being the velocities I got were WAY off the data. I’m shooting a 1895 Marlin 45-70 and while the loads were still safe in that rifle I didn’t care for the deviation from the data. I will try H4198 when I can find some. Data shows low pressure for that powder. Will report back if and when... Too much velocity? How far off was the data vs your chrono? Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Bucks&bulls Report post Posted May 5, 2021 I don’t have my notes with me but let me say I had a WTF moment. Twice! Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Bucks&bulls Report post Posted May 5, 2021 Yeah the velocity was way more than expected. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
PRDATR Report post Posted May 6, 2021 4 hours ago, Bucks&bulls said: Yeah the velocity was way more than expected. How many grains were you loading? Hence my question to Tim on using a filler. I really don't like using a very fast burning powder that only takes up 10% of the case. Too much potential for erratic pressures especially if the rifle is tilted and the majority of the powder is an inch or two away from the primer. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Bucks&bulls Report post Posted May 6, 2021 The wife said I told her it was ok to pitch the targets and notes for the 45-70 from that outing so I can’t give you the exact numbers but believe I started at 14 grains of Unique under a 405 grain cast bullet. Data showed velocity around 1,200 FPS and I got around 1,500 FPS on the new to me lab radar on the first shot. Recoil was pretty mild and case/primer were perfect, thought I messed up on setting up the new unit so touched off another one and the velocity was very close to to the first. Time to find a more appropriate powder. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Edge Report post Posted May 6, 2021 1 hour ago, PRDATR said: How many grains were you loading? Hence my question to Tim on using a filler. I really don't like using a very fast burning powder that only takes up 10% of the case. Too much potential for erratic pressures especially if the rifle is tilted and the majority of the powder is an inch or two away from the primer. Oh contraire. I'm measuring a 45 70 case now with 13grains of red dot. With a 405gr bullet properly seated, there's only 1/3 of the case empty. That's the charge recommended for the rolling block. Also, not enough empty space for an accidental double charge of 12 or 13 grains of red dot. Look at the difference in length between a 250 and a 405grain round.. 1 Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Edge Report post Posted May 18, 2021 Just returned from out shooting the 45 70 Rolling Block with the 12gr Red Dot loads. What a hoot! Will head out with the 13gr charge soon. Anyone on the west side with a chrono like to go to the range I belong to? Lunch is on me, burger or chili at the Wildhorse. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
PRDATR Report post Posted May 19, 2021 3 hours ago, Edge said: Just returned from out shooting the 45 70 Rolling Block with the 12gr Red Dot loads. What a hoot! Will head out with the 13gr charge soon. Anyone on the west side with a chrono like to go to the range I belong to? Lunch is on me, burger or chili at the Wildhorse. Heck I'd almost break out my Ohler and make the drive just to shoot it. 1 Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Arizona Griz Report post Posted May 19, 2021 3 hours ago, Edge said: Just returned from out shooting the 45 70 Rolling Block with the 12gr Red Dot loads. What a hoot! Will head out with the 13gr charge soon. Anyone on the west side with a chrono like to go to the range I belong to? Lunch is on me, burger or chili at the Wildhorse. I would take you up on the offer if I had a chrono. I just loaded up some 45-90 with 5744 behind a 405 grain cast bullet. Like you said, no filler. Just ordered a vernier mid range rear sight and a front globe to replace the tang peep sight and a bead front on the 1885. 1 Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Edge Report post Posted May 19, 2021 58 minutes ago, Arizona Griz said: I would take you up on the offer if I had a chrono. I just loaded up some 45-90 with 5744 behind a 405 grain cast bullet. Like you said, no filler. Just ordered a vernier mid range rear sight and a front globe to replace the tang peep sight and a bead front on the 1885. Let me know how those work for ya Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Edge Report post Posted August 8, 2021 So I've just returned from chronographing the 45 70 Red Dot loads with Bucksandbulls. 12gr and 13gr loads with a 405gr cast lead out of a breach/break 32" barrel were exactly as advertised on the graph. When loading 15grains the extra 3 grains only saw a net gain of about 50fps. 1 Share this post Link to post Share on other sites