I'm out

[wklman]

I feel if someone comes onto an open forum and, lays it all out for people to read, then they are cutting theirs and their fellow hunters throats.

Rip me a new one, I'm waiting........

 

Yes, lets not talk about anything contraversial. that way we'll all just keep on being warm and fuzzy all the time and the anti's will think we're all perfect little hunters.

[jim]

So basically if b/c or p/y say's so it's unethical or ethical. They are clubs that you have to pay to get into. Why should they decide the whole hunting world's ethics ? Pope an young changed their standards for bow letoff a few years ago to meet the industry standards. To me that takes them right out of the ethics debate, if they can change the rules as they go why would their so called ethics mean anything ?

[Petersen]

I think this was best answered with simply "$$$" and "he can". Seems a lot get wound up in the radio this or that, fair chase, etc., but the bottom line is loving to hunt and having the money to do it as you please. If I was wealthy and could spend $15k-$20k a year in Nevada to hunt mulies I could maybe do the same or at least have a lot of fun trying. I just wish I had $5k to spend on one of the landowner tags for this area. As a Nevada resident I can't even draw out for the area this buck was killed in.

[grizzly]

So basically if b/c or p/y say's so it's unethical or ethical. They are clubs that you have to pay to get into. Why should they decide the whole hunting world's ethics ? Pope an young changed their standards for bow letoff a few years ago to meet the industry standards. To me that takes them right out of the ethics debate, if they can change the rules as they go why would their so called ethics mean anything ?

 

Thank you. I made the same point on page 1 (maybe not as well)and agree completely.

[Guest dryfly]

redbeard-

 

In my opinion you can start a post without attacking someone personally. Let me ask you redbeard does it make you feel like more of a big tough man to knock on someone else? Why not just start a discussions without ripping on someone personally. Why not just talk about the subject you want to discuss? This topic would have been a great one to discuss. It disgusts me that you have to be the Almighty authority and knock somone personally. Do you feel stronger now? DO you feel a tingle? It does not reflect the good side of you to come on a name someone out on a public forum. What do you have to gain? From what I have heard this guy Mr. Ulmer is the most non arrogant, unassuming and nicest guys in the industry. He is a BOWHUNTER! Isn't he the guy who always gives credit to someone else? Why do you have to attack personally Redbeard? Do you feel big, strong and tough now? This isn't showing the best side of you redbeard! Shame on you! Did you not read the rules of this site? Why do you have to attack? What is your gain?

 

I think your outrageous attacks and crazy comparisons should get you ripped off of this board! I would ask the moderator to keep an eye on Mr. redbeard in the future. He obviously has a complex going and must be feeling small. Why Redbeard? Why???? If you want to discuss then discuss but leave the personal attacks at home!

[Becker]

By the use of electronic devices for attracting, locating or pursuing game or guiding the hunter to such game, or by the use of a bow or arrow to which any electronic device is attached.

 

As I recall redbeard you use motion cameras all the time to locate animals to try and arrow......How do you justify yourself???

[CouesWhitetail]

I think perhaps the rules Redbeard posted are out of date? I think this is the latest list of things you can't do if you want to enter something into Boone and Crockett recordbook.

 

For the purpose of entry into the Boone and Crockett Club’s® records, North American big game harvested by the use of the following methods or under the following conditions are ineligible:

 

I. Spotting or herding game from the air, followed by landing in its vicinity for the purpose of pursuit and shooting;

II. Herding or chasing with the aid of any motorized equipment;

III. Use of electronic communication devices to guide hunters to game, artificial lighting, electronic light intensifying devices (night vision optics), sights with built-in electronic range-finding capabilities, thermal imaging equipment, electronic game calls or cameras/timers/motion tracking devices that transmit images and other information to the hunter;

IV. Confined by artificial barriers, including escape-proof fenced enclosures;

V. Transplanted for the purpose of commercial shooting;

VI. By the use of traps or pharmaceuticals;

VII. While swimming, helpless in deep snow, or helpless in any other natural or artificial medium;

VIII. On another hunter’s license;

IX. Not in full compliance with the game laws or regulations of the federal government or of any state, province, territory, or tribal council on reservations or tribal lands;

 

 

 

I think the part about the cameras refers to cameras that send an image immediately to you when an animal is there. I don't think general game camera use is prohibited.

 

Amanda

 

[BOHNTR]

Whether you think the use of radios are fair or not is a mute point in terms of Randy's latest bucks. He chooses to use them....legally. I choose not to use them because to me it takes away the chess game I have with mule deer each and every stalk. I also prefer the guidelines the B&C and P&Y have created. That's my choice. What I do respect about Randy is he hasn't entered them into record books because he knows what the rules are. Definitely shows there's no ego involved there, IMO.

 

 

[Birddog]

I LOVE THIS SITE!!!

[Birddog]

Some of you may disagree but I think it is hard enough here in Arizona to hunt deer and yet we pile on each other over using radios. Now I’m pretty sure we can all agree twenty men scattered all over a mountain side with radios and one guy with a bow is pretty ridiculous. I use radios when I go out. Maybe I am less of a hunter than some of you. I hit the mountains hard and on foot. I may travel seven to ten miles up and mountains. Between four of us there might only be two tags so we normally split up in two groups so that one tag will be in each group. Now let me get this right because I have only been hunting for a few years, if I see a group of deer with a few nice bucks it is unethical for me to let my buddy know that is in the same canyon via radio? How about if we are on the same hill side twenty feet apart, can’t see each other and he lets me know over the radio he sees a buck. Is that unethical? How about if we are side by side and he is having fun and tells me over the radio he sees the buck of a lifetime rather than just telling me? Is that unethical?

 

When I get home tonight I will plop down on the couch and try to get my hunting fix by watching the outdoors channel. I’m pretty sure I will see someone at some point “checkin the feeder” or worried about the best way to get to his tree stand sitting over a food plot in the winter. Wouldn’t that be unethical? And yet tomorrow when I get to work I will check the forum and have you in my ear about how I don’t “measure up” to you as a hunter. Wow! Maybe we all should be watching Redbeard.

 

Bottom line is I enjoy hunting and I will enjoy taking my son out this year for his first hunt. Unethical to me would be breaking a law to harvest your game. If the way I was radios is unethical so be it. To each his own!

 

 

[Becker]

Redbeard quoted it right from pope and young.....

 

http://www.pope-young.org/bowhunting_fairchase.asp

 

"By the use of electronic devices for attracting, locating or pursuing game or guiding the hunter to such game, or by the use of a bow or arrow to which any electronic device is attached."

 

Thats what it says under their Rules of Fair Chase on their website

[Snapshot]

I certainly don't think the use of radios is unethical, like I mentioned earlier, radios are a great tool. Maybe this thread has lost a little in translation to the fact that it was started because of the implication that some hunters only score big animals by the use of radio communication???. There is a big difference between a couple of buddies with radios versus a whole army of guys using radios.

My Dad and I both had radios so that I could keep track of him, but since he passed away, I no longer use them because I hunt by myself 99.99% of the time, even though I carry one for emergency use.

I think maybe Redbeard's point is that technology has bred lazy hunters in a sense that maybe some of their actions maybe construed as unethical in the sense of "the purity" of hunting in general. Trail cams, laser range finders, radios, gps, foodplots, feeders, salt licks and all the other gadgets that take make it easier to bag game. Are these things illegal or unethical? Certainly not as long as they are used within the boundaries of the law.

If I hire an outfitter and a crew of 20 guys with radios and gps to search the hunt unit from top to bottom and radio back to me the location of that trophy buck or bull, is that illegal or unethical? Cetainly not illegal (unless state laws prevail), but ethics are up to the individual as what they perceive as being right or wrong.

In 2006 I helped out my wife's uncle and cousin on a hunt in 35B. They are kind of lazy when it comes to hunting, so I stayed on the mountain too glass until dark. I spotted two decent bucks across a deep canyon, I radioed back to them that I found something and to come take a look. The next morning we hiked across the canyon and he shot one of those bucks. Does that make me or anyone else that does stuff like that "unethical" ? We still had to work very hard to get that deer.

Could Randy Ulmer have taken that deer without radios? I am sure he could. If he doesn't care about putting it in the record book then it shows that he hunts for more than just an entry into a book, and that he just wants to get the biggest animal he can each and every year, and to me that says he is just competing with himself and thats what it is all about.

[HEADACHE]

I am sure glad that when I shot this pig nobody ripped my ethics or choices. . . I used a rangefinder

[Snapshot]

I don't think photoshop has a record book, do they?

[HEADACHE]

I don't think photoshop has a record book, do they?

 

ha ha ha you'd be surprised. .. is it that obvious??? took me four whole minutes!