1uglydude

I happen to be a lawyer, I hunt, and I have a 22 bear tag in my wallet. I sympathize with you, BUT: 1) Closed means closed. 2) Many of the same areas were closed last year (and most years in the last 10 years)...compared to last year, it stayed open 4 extra days. Next year get a tag in 23, they rarely close that part of the forest. 3) No one has hunting "rights"...they're privileges. 4) The season has been open since the first week of May. I've had bears on camera since that time, and made it out for four days. It never quite came together, but it was close. Sorry that you weren't able to make it out yet, but if someone had shot a sow the whole thing could have shut down weeks ago. That's the chance you take. 5) In fact, some of my close calls were on young sows, if I hadn't missed them by 15-30 minutes, and I had decided to take one, your season would have been over weeks ago...who would you complain to then? 6) I likely lost two cameras and a blind in the Sunflower fire, but such losses and safety closures are all part of hunting public land. Public land doesn't mean we have unfettered access. The federal government is the landlord, and although it can be managed under a quasi public trust, that doesn't mean we always get a final say in how it's done. Like you, I don't always agree with what they do, but there is a process set out for it and they stick to it. In theory, we have a voice when they set the forest management plans and other processes open to the public. Often, we don't agree with the final product, but the law is the law. Because the land has a landlord, we only have the privilege of hunting, hiking, camping, etc., on it...we have no right to do anything on land we don't own. Again, I sympathize with you. Take heart in knowing that these closures are usually lifted by mid-July (even though they say it could last into August). We need one or two soaking rains in the area, and it will open up. Your tag is good until July 31. Granted, the sows will probably be bred by then, and the bears will spread out, but you may still get a chance.

http://www.azcentral.com/community/...e-concerns.html I have never hunted the preserve, although I have plans to try it in the future. But even if you've never hunted there and don't plan to, this is something that we should all be concerned about. Safety issue? Please! We're talking about bowhunting on 33 square miles. Here's what really gets me. Scottsdale can't ban hunting, it needs action from AZGFD to do so. As I read ARS 13-3108 (F)(5)©, the director can ban hunting where it is deemed to be "unsafe." I don't think the department should be setting a precedent by deciding that bowhunting on 33 square miles of open country is "unsafe." For crying out loud, the freaking chairman of the preserve was "surprised" to learn that hunting even takes place there!" So, the conflicts with sportsmen must be really common (eyeroll)! Now, I can see why the department might want to appease other users in the park, but public perception is NOT grounds under the statute for closing it. I can understand that trespassing may be an issue when it comes to guys wandering onto private property. There's a solution to that, enforce the trespass laws. I'm usually one for compromise, but this situation doesn't warrant it. We can't keep rolling over. AND WHY IS THE MEETING SCHEDULED FOR 3PM ON A MONDAY?!?!

You drew whichever one you listed as a first choice. Utah doesn't run a 1st/2nd pass like Arizona. It runs a first pass, then any tags leftover from the first pass go to a second pass. Your second choice is meaningless for 99% of the LE hunts because they all go in the first pass. BTW - I also grew up on the Wasatch Front...in Lehi.

This maps doesn't have details, but identifies the general location of the fires. http://gacc.nifc.gov/swcc/predictive/intelligence/ytd_historical/ytd/wf/swa_fire_combined.htm Bull Flat fire is burning on both sides of the fence in 23N and the WMAT.

+1 I also had this tag last year. I passed on a small 5 and a willowy 6 the first weekend. I hunted 10 days total and never could quite get a shot at anything else. I got a long opportunity a good bull, but shot just underneath him. If you can get on a bull that looks pretty, and the shot is there, take him. The rut never really took off during the archery hunt last year. There aren't nearly as many cow in the unit as there used to be. Several hundred junior tags and several Sept/Oct cow hunts have taken their toll. That may have had something to do with the sporatic rutting activity.

Most hunters are. That's why I firmly believe that most "stolen" cameras are actually "confiscated" by the Forest Service.

From the book Javelina: Research and Management in Arizona by Gerald I. Day - "Occasionally javelina teeth become coated with a 'gold-like' appearing substance. These teeth have an accumulation of calculus or tartar that is deposited gradually by the reaction of saliva with food items. On some teeth the tartar forms a thick hard shell that can be chipped off in large flakes and this might be bright, or iridescent, with colors of gold, black, or brown. Skulls with gold-colored teeth make interesting conversation pieces, but do not have any value in the bullion market."

I use them with a heavy duty lock box. I haven't had anyone try to steal one yet, so I don't know how they'd hold up to abuse. It seems like it would take some effort to get through one. I'm sure the Forest Service has the right tools on hand though.

My kids will be in the Gilbert District when the start school, and Gilbert always seems to make a special effort to schedule its breaks at different times than other districts in the east valley. From the various districts I checked, Gilbert is the only district that has its fall break during the early youth hunts this year. Usually, Gilbert kids get the shaft. As for the 3C youth hunt, they also cut the tags way back to 25. It should be a quality hunt because of time of year, lack of OTC archery, and fewer general tags. I wouldn't worry about the adult hunt screwing it up...I'd worry about actually being able to pull the tag.

The guidelines state that, where possible, there shouldn't be a junior deer hunt and a junior elk hunt going in the same unit at the same time. That's why the 3AC junior elk hunt used to be a week later than the other junior elk hunts. Now that the junior deer hunt has been moved to November, the junior elk hunt is the same date as the other junior elk hunts (except for the elk hunts in 22 and 23). To the general question of why they junior elk and deer hunts tend to take place at the same time: First, the guidelines state that they should try to schedule the hunts at the same time as a school break. These hunts often fall during fall break/Columbus Day (although this year fall break is the week before the hunt). Second, they've got to fit junior hunts in when there aren't any general hunts for any other species going on in the unit. If you set aside certain weeks and decide that all junior hunts should take place at that time, it makes it easier to fit all of the general hunts within the schedules provided in the guidelines. It's all about uniformity...where possible. Finally, and this isn't in the guidelines, but I've always assumed (as stated above) that the thinking is that when a kid draws a junior elk tag, scheduling the junior hunt on the same week may open up opportunities for another kid to get a junior deer tag.

According to the hunt guidelines (which are used as a primary source for each year's hunt regulations), the October whitetail hunt should generally open on the "Friday of week 43." If that has landed on a full moon the last few years, then it is only by coincidence. They don't go by moon phase when setting seasons. The reason all the hunts run somewhat later this year is because the first Friday of 2012 was January 6th and leap year threw the count off a bit.

Sorry to hijack the thread, but I'm just curious what your loads/stats are for your .257 wby rounds. I shoot the same caliber using the accubonds. I'm pleased with the accuracy, but I've been thinking of trying out the TTSX because I have liked how they've performed in other calibers. PM me if you'd rather not put specific recipes on a public place.

My inside source who is a Federal Law Enforcement for the FS says he hasn't heard of any such law, but he promised to do some research on the subject for me. I don't like fogginess when it comes to this type of stuff, I want to know where it says..... My guess is that if you run into the right ranger, s/he could fine you using the regulations for littering.

BINGO!

It's a petty offense in the state-wide criminal code, but by its terms it only applies in counties with more than 280,000 people...which is only Maricopa and Pima. It's a common way to draft laws that they don't want to affect rural areas. It also excludes baiting done in the pursuit of hunting. Here's the text: 13-2927. Unlawful feeding of wildlife; classification A. A person commits unlawful feeding of wildlife by intentionally, knowingly or recklessly feeding, attracting or otherwise enticing wildlife into an area, except for: 1. Persons lawfully taking or holding wildlife pursuant to title 17 or pursuant to rules or orders of the Arizona game and fish commission. 2. Public employees or authorized agents acting within the scope of their authority for public safety or for wildlife management purposes. 3. Normal agricultural or livestock operational practices. 4. Tree squirrels or birds. B. This section applies in a county with a population of more than two hundred eighty thousand persons. C. Unlawful feeding of wildlife is a petty offense.

Not illegal in Yavapai or Coconino Counties. Feeding wildlife is only illegal in Maricopa and Pima Counties. Now, if they could claim that he was keeping them as actual "pets" that would be a different story...but that would be hard to prove seeing as it doesn't look like he's keeping them "captive" in any way.

According to who? Under ARS 13-2927 you can't put out food for wildlife in Maricopa and Pima counties only...and hunting activities are specifically exempted from the law. So, what authority are you referring to, because I'm sure a lot of people would like to know if there is something else out there?

Do you really think Non-res applicants are hitting the 10% cap on all hunts? I highly doubt you've got non-residents scrambling to pay nearly $600 for late season cow elk tags. The non-res cap is a CAP, it's not a set aside. In other words, I don't think there are going to be 2,300 non resident elk hunters in Arizona this year.

Have you considered that a large portion of that $7.50 may go to an outside vendor that processes applications and the draw?

That's exactly how I have always read it. 'Tis better to have grandpa transfer the tag than a non-hunting mother.

First, are you sure it's the exact same card? When your expiration date hits, you get a new card in the mail with the SAME number and a different date. So, even though the card number worked at application, it may not work on the draw. Second, I'm willing to bet that the Game and Fish system simply takes the data that you yourself enter into the online database when it enters the card. I can't see them having some poor sap take information that is available digitally and then enter it all by hand. I could be wrong on that, but I doubt it. So, is it possible that you entered the wrong date on the application? If so, it may not have raised a red flag for the bank when the charge was under $20. Different story when you're talking hundreds of dollars. Third, was a it a DEBIT card or a credit card? If it was a debit card, then the amount charged would DEFINITELY impact how the bank treats a mis-typed expiration date. Never use a debit card on the draw. Never. Banks are hyper vigilant when it comes to online debit card purchases.

That doesn't make any sense. If you're saying that a higher percentage of tags may go to the group with less points because of the higher number of applicants, then yes that's true. But that doesn't mean that any individual applicant with fewer points has a greater chance just because he's in that group. If there are 100 tags to give, and 10 guys with 3 points apply and 400 guys with 2 points apply, then chances are most of the tags will go to SOMEONE with 2 points. That doesn't mean that a person with 2 points has greater odds of drawing a tag than someone with 3 points. On some hunts, the odds ARE greater with fewer points because guys with more points end up drawing their second choice in the bonus pass. This is most likely to happen on javelina hunts or some of the early whitetail hunts near the boarder. Squaring points wouldn't solve that. In additiona to the bonus pass issues, you've also got to remember that this particular report doesn't spell out who drew as a first choice, and who drew as a second choice. Nor does it say who drew a first choice on another hunt and wasn't actually considered for a second choice. All you get here is a total number of first and second choice applicants. So, while it may look like a group had better odds with fewer points, that may just mean that a significant number of guys in the group in front of them managed to pull a first choice hunt. There are a lot of variables to consider. In the end, it comes down to luck, but you can increase your odds against house if you attempt to put a reasonable estimate on the unreported variables when you do your math.

That doesn't make any sense. If you're saying that a higher percentage of tags may go to the group with less points because of the higher number of applicants, then yes that's true. But that doesn't mean that any individual applicant with fewer points has a greater chance just because he's in that group. If there are 100 tags to give, and 10 guys with 3 points apply and 400 guys with 2 points apply, then chances are most of the tags will go to SOMEONE with 2 points. That doesn't mean that a person with 2 points has greater odds of drawing a tag than someone with 3 points. On some hunts, the odds ARE greater with fewer points because guys with more points end up drawing their second choice in the bonus pass. This is most likely to happen on javelina hunts or some of the early whitetail hunts near the boarder. Squaring points wouldn't solve that.

As I said before, it's probably because it was a Debit card. This thread should be called "DEBIT Card Dishonored because it was a DEBIT card." Credit cards and debit cards are not the same thing, even though that little VISA symbol may make folks think otherwise. The banks get leery of allowing large internet purchases against checking funds. Most of the times it isn't an issue, but it sucks those few times when it is. I bet that most of the rejected cards were debit cards. Not trying to kick you when you're down, but the more guys that can learn from this the bettter.

First, it's always dangerous to use a debit card for these things because banks are much more likely to deny internet charges for debit cards...their red flags go up more quickly when you're dealing with funds in someone's checking account...and rightly so. Second, I'm not sure what you mean by "it shows that I would have drawn my first choice." The way the results are now shown, it only lists your first choice next to "NT DRWN"...even if you put a second choice. Is that what you're referring to?