Rembrant

I wish I could have all the money I spent on beer back!!!! Mike

Thanks GodisGood for telling us how you feel about this. I can't figure out who this guy is, or why he is there. It seems the dems have played the first Black pres and/or first woman pres card, Barak beat out Hillary, so he's up to bat, and the weirdest thing is that America is buying it. Mike

People keep thinking that I am accusing an individual or guide company of doing something wrong. I am not. (Anybody can dart a bull on public land and hope for the best). And I don’t give a rats butt if a successful person spends his money on a hunt. I am only asking if 500” bulls can be natural or is there some doping going on? A 500” bull seems a lot like a 200” Coues deer, just plain outrageous. The comment about people doing anything for power and fame is justified by human history – even in the hunting realm. I am not accusing Mr. Denny, or anybody else. I have stated over and over, I don’t know. I don’t know Denny, I don’t know Mossback, and I don’t know Utah. But I do know Arizona, the land of monster bulls, and 500” - in my opinion – is unbelievable. Maybe two 500” bulls in the history of record keeping is evidence enough that these bulls are true, rare giants. I hope they are. Asking the ethical questions about hunting is not bad for the sport, it is GOOD for the sport. I am surprised that folks got irritated at my comments, but you gotta admit that it made for an interesting string. And by the way, congrats to you Denny. Mike

Mc Cain waffles on some issues; He didn't vote on the One man, One woman marraige deal, he believes global warming is man caused, and tends to be a little too politically correct at times. BUT, he is a veteran and a war hero. He does have infinately more senate experience than his opposition. He does show backbone when he feels he needs to, i.e. the Iraq surge, and fighting intitlements in the senate. His foriegn policy experience, again, is way above and beyond that of his opponent. I believe the man has heart. He loves this country and cares about her people. His plans of limiting spending, keeping taxes down, drilling for oil, and exploiting other energy avenues, solar nuclear nat. gas and creating jobs by doing this, and the redistributing of the bad mortgages, sounds like a plan. What the heck is Obama's plan? Programs to redistibute wealth? Sit down and have a chat with the Iranian president? We know who McCain is, Who is Barak Obama? Best I can tell is he is a junior senator who has managed to achieve the # 1 liberal ranking in his short carreer because of his pro-abortion, anti-gun, and sociolistic voting record, who calls himself a Christian, yet attends a church who's pastor bad mouths the United States and proclaims a "liberation gospel", a black power sect that really fits better in a muslim setting. Can someone tell me if he ever had a real job before becoming a senator? It is amazing to me that about half of this nation is seriously considering this man as our next president. I think he's the most dangerous man in the world right now. Mike

Three months ago it was determined that my mom qualified for hospice attention - heart rate, blood pressure, bed ridden. So they got her a hospital bed, got her hooked up with the hospice people and took her off the 25 perscription drugs that were keeping her going. Within a month and a half she was on her feet, taking care of her own personal needs, having dinner with other people, moving around as she needed, and removed from hospice care. I'm not making this up. Guess that's why doctors say they are practicing medicine. Mike

Buddy of mine told me about the time he was in waders in a pond and felt something moving on his leg. He reached down into his waders and grabbed something and pulled out three wolf spider legs. Doought! Mike

Tam, Thanks for the counter ballance, I'm good with that. BUT, I'm not envious, and I did not directly accuse anybody or group of people (read it again), and as I stated earlier, I don't know squat about this bull or the area. I only question the validity of 500" bulls. Just seems too rediculous to me. I'm looking at the 1995 Arizona record book. There are 4 entries in the typical catagory that score over 400, and seven in the nontypical. It took up until 1995 for these 11 bulls to get harvested (this doesn't include archery). Nowdays 400+" bulls show up dead every season. I wonder what the latest edition will yield. With hunting popularity being what it is now, I would expect to see an increase in monster bull harvests, but 500 inchers? Putting people on the "Great hunter" pedistal sets us up for the fall. Some of our heros in this sport have fallen hard, as well as a lot of other hunters who fall to the pressure of keeping up a reputation. The technology is available to create super animals. I am raising the question, "Is this happening"? Maybe there is a test that a super bull harvester can submit tissue to to disspell the notion. Asking questions about legalities and validities does not hurt the sport. But if people are doping animals for any reason, if this is happening, this would certainly be detrimental to hunting. Mike

Thanks Phil, Just goes to show you how our imaginations get the best of us. I know your uncle is a heck of a hunter. I was hunting 10 for archery elk before it got popular and Randall was all over that stuff for deer, elk, and antelope long before that. Congrats to him. That bull is well deserved. Mike

Yeah Lark, you said something similar yesterday, someone else came back and said something nasty to you. I was actually writing in to agree with you and my post wouldn't take cause the string got nuked. Kinda glad it did. You know, a lot of huntin has just turned into a flippin circus, but I don't believe there is anything that can be done about it. Folks have a right to make money and spend it on whatever they want. Guides are simply following their dreams in the free interprise system. I was talking to some guys this morning about the big bull that got whacked in unit 10. The conversation was going the same way - money, guides, too much help, airplanes, etc. Then I looked up the pic on this site and saw the hunter was Randall Cramer. I like that guy; have met him and had lengthy conversations with him. I'm glad he got that elk. I'm glad he could afford the guides to insure a monster kill. I don't think any less of him because I know he's a heck of a hunter - way beyond my abilities. Made feel stupid about the stuff I was saying. I think the only answer is to hunt when I can and make the most of it. A lot of the units (maybe all) ain't what they used to be because of the circus. Makes me wish times haven't changed so, but what I really gotta do is just be greatful for being one of the people that knows what it used to be and was able to experience it. I'm still suspicious of the spider bull. Can 500" bulls be legit? Maybe so. But if people are shootin bulls with roids, I hope it gets exposed. Mike

A guy just has to wonder if this bulls previous sheds have been recovered. Seems we would have seen pics of those sheds. Am I suspicious? Just a wee bit. Have 400+ bulls come from that area before? Have folks up there been watching this bull for how many years? Or did he just show up one year? Am I accusing anybody of anything? Nope, 'cause I sure as heck don't know. Just seems a bit queer that 400+ bulls aren't a dime-a-dozen, then pops up a 500" bull? Has there ever been a 500" bull - ever - under any circumstances? If so, where was this 500" bull? Last question: Will some people do just about anything for money, power, or fame? Suspiciously, Mike

Go back and read through the string. A number of social problems arrise with the hs lifestyle. Here are a few: Legislated preferencial treatment = discrimination to non hs folks. hate crimes, uni-sex public restrooms, laws against hiring, firing (even in churches) and services rendered (or not), and unconstitutionally stepping on the 1st ammendment over what people can say about homosexuals (even in churches). Unhealthy lifestyle causes health insurance to rise. Same sex domestic partner health insurance offered by many companies discriminates against opposite sex domestic partners AND causes heath insurance costs to go up. Changing of moral standards that have worked well in this country for over 200 years - particularly in the case of hs exposure to our children. We are being conditioned to thinking the hs lifestyle is OK. This is not a natural thing. This is not evolution or free thinking. This is all part of the hs agenda. Do you enjoy watching hs sitcoms? Do you want your children watching them? Do you want your children being taught about a daddy and a daddy in elementy school? None of the above is good for our society. OK I didn't say anything about God, but I did mention churches to reveal the extreme nature of the hs agenda. They will shove thier lifestyle down our throats and the throats of our children, call anyone who opposes them hatefull bigots, and get all this bologna legalized - all because they want what they do with their genitals to be validated. Wake up! Mike

Happy birthday Bill, thanks for hanging out on this site! Mike

Isn't that McCain's stance on the pork? And always has been?

More liberal thinking.

Forgot to add something really important: One of my best friends is the chief prosecuting attorney in my area. One day while fishing on Roosevelt he asks me, "Mike, what do you base your faith in Christ on?" Set me back a bit, thought about it, then told him it was a combination of early exposure of the faith by my parents, answers to prayer that I had witnessed, and an overwhelming sense in my heart that Jesus was real. So, then I asked him, "What do you base your faith in Christ on?" He answered, "The evidence". Mike

Yo, Mr Smith, There are a number of guys that were athiests that set out to prove the Bible as bunk and wound up, after the research, accepting Christ as thier Lord and Savior. One is C.S. Lewis - British born, and wrote books in the early to mid 1900's. Lewis wrote "Mere Christianity", "The Chronicals of Narnia" and many others. Another more contemporary Josh Mc Dowell is a college professor (history and literature) who was sick and tired of Christian students coming up with their ramble. He would always shoot them down and do everything he could to embarass them. Mc Dowell set out to study the Bible to expose its problems and inconsistancies, and write a book to tell the world about it. As a result of his research he wrote a book called, "More Than a Carpenter". In this book he tackles the stuff you mentioned; Jesus claiming diety, Bibliographical test, Internal and external evidence tests of the New Testament. These are the tests that ancient manuscripts of all kinds go through to prove validity. Manuscripts such as Aristotle 343BC, Ceasar's "Gallic Wars"AD1100, The Illiad and all the others. Mc Dowell states: "When it comes to manuscript authority of the New Testament (compared to the others) the abundance of material is almost embarrassing in contrast." The other ancient manuscripts are accepted as truth, but somehow the New Testament, though the copies of maunuscripts and proof of its validity - by modern testing methods - is overwhelmingly superior to the others, is somehow easily brushed off as fake? I'd like to go on, but the books are already written - I don't need to write one here. My point is Mr. Smith, that you are not even being honest with yourself, if you won't do the research. I like your audasity, but you gotta try a little harder to keep up! Thanks, Mike

When a guy gets a Harley, he gets the leathers, and may go on to skulls and flames, beards, shades and the whole 9 yards. When a guy hunts, he gets a truck, maybe a quad, gotta have a rifle, and cammo - might as well get the deer head decals for the truck. When a guy buys the racing bicycle, he gets the wind cutting clothes and the funny shoes, and the helmet, and the big legs. When a middle or high schooler wants to look tough he gets the baggy pants and shirts, no belt, saggs down the street and can throw out the hand signs. How many scenarios are there? When a guy or girl decides to become a homo. they will play one roll or the other. The change can come quick or over time. When a guy or girl chooses to stop living the homo. lifestyle, they stop the roll playing, and become what they want to be next. There is absolutely no scientific evidence of a homosexual gene. There was at one time, but it proved to be a lie by a homo. scientist. There are lots of lies, this is just one of them. Mike

I do believe Jesus lived and may have been a great teacher/philosopher, just minus all the miracles and divinity. Really? A guy going around claiming to be God, a good teacher? If He is not who He said He is, then He's not a good teacher, that would make Him more of a liar, or a flaming lunatic! I wanna thank everyone for speaking their minds and hearts on this string. I appreciate the Christian men who spoke up about their faith in what they believe to be the truth. A whole bunch of stuff was aired out here and for a person who is able to sort through it, there are things to learn and be aware of. We've seen the Christian perspective, the liberal perspective and the 'head-in-sand' who cares perspective. Mr. Smith says he likes to bring awareness to these forums. Thank you for helping us to be aware. Mike

Lark, Maybe someday over a campfire. And I still wouldn't be hating anybody. Mike

Thanks Bowsniper for straitening me out on the gay vs homosexual terminology. (Dang, I can type gay a whole lot quicker). God gave us all free will. It is our destiny to choose. We can't avoid it; we will all choose one way or another. This is perfectly normal and the way it is set up. It is all about choices. I cannot change anybody's mind about anything. I cannot turn a person from homosexuality any more than I can convince a person to stop being an alcoholic. And I certainly cannot convince anyone that God exists. The point of this thread was that homosexual marraige is bad for our society. I piped in because I know a few ways in which this is true - moral and financial challenges. You don't have to be a Christian to see this, though the Christian worldview detects the problem quickly. Secular thinkers don't see it right away. No one here hates homosexuals. Chances are we all have homosexual friends. Mr. Smith got pretty exited (maybe even angry?) because he percieved we were bashing a group of people that don't think the way the majority of contributers to this string think. Remember, we weren't bashing homo's, we were discussing the challenges to society. What I find interesting is that is is usually the homosexual people that become irrate in these discussions. The Flagstaff city council is holding discussions on the homo 'fairness' initiative. In these discussions the city's pastors are saying that they don't share common ground with homosexuals on moral issues and that they don't think the homosexual agenda should be setting public guidlines that will affect churches and buisnesses. The homosexuals come back with, "I don't feel safe in this building with such abusive people, these people say they promote love but they are bigots!" In my own experiences with homosexuals I find that I can have good friendships with them. I know they are different, and they know that I know they are different. I don't push my beliefs on them, but invariably, in their desire to seek my validation of their choice, the conversation will come to a point where I must explain who I am in Christ and why I cannot agree with them on this issue. This has always chilled the relationship. Please note the difference; when I know who they are, we're good. When they find out who I am, the relationship grows cold. And I am considered intolerant - inherently by what I believe!? It is you God-given right to choose your own belief system Mr. Smith, it just concerns me that you became so upset. By the way, you can look at my profile and see who I am and what I stand for. By looking at your profile, all I can see is that you are an anomynous dart thrower. Mike

What trumps what? That would be funny if it wasn’t so sadly true. And like you say, gays don't want equal treatment, they want preferential treatment. If my wife gets beat up and raped the criminal will get what's coming to him, let's say five to twenty. If a gay person gets raped, they want it to be a 'hate crime' so the criminal gets put away for life. If the sentences aren't good enough as they stand, let's change them. But the preferential treatment the gays want would be discriminatory against the other people in society that are victims of the same exact crime. Don't quite work does it? There is currently a gay 'fairness' initiative tying to be ram-rodded in Flagstaff. This is what they want: Unlawful to fire someone if they perceive they were fired for being gay. Unlawful to not hire someone if they perceive they didn't get the job 'cause they're gay. Unlawful do deny service to someone if it is perceived it's because they're gay. (So if a lesbian couple wants me to paint their portrait, and I choose not to because I don't agree with their lifestyle, I will be breaking the law and fined). Churches are exempt - as far as clergy. The church I go to has about 200 lay leaders (non-clergy). These folks lead small groups, home groups, other various ministries, and teach Sunday school to our kids. So if a trans-gendered Sunday school teacher decides to show up on Sunday to teach the third graders dressed in drag, there will be nothing the church can do about it inside the new law. Or if a gay person wants a leadership position at the church the gay thing cannot be a reason to not hire this person. They also want unisex bathrooms all over the city to accommodate the trans-gendered people. We don’t want to discriminate against them! Mike

Does too! God is Good is right, this stuff has hugh ramifications. It seems as though these gay people are harmless, silly and they ain't hurtin nobody. But they's a sneekin up on ya. In fact they are probably already gettin you and you don't even know it yet. At my work we got "same sex domestic partner health insurance". It cost less for them to get insured than it does me - and I work there! But there ain't no opposite sex domestic health insurance. That's discrimination. Then Janet gives the state the same thing 'cept she's smart enough not to discriminate. the opposite sex partners get it too. Gee, you think this could have anything to do with the monster state defecit, insuring male homosexuals who don't even work for the state and are living the most dangerous lifestyle known? Time to look around a little. Mike

You are assuming that the homosexual people are happy. I know a number of x-gays. THEY say that the homosexual lifestyle is the emptiest most non-fulfilling thing they have ever experienced. Whoah! Did I just type x-gay? Yep these folks are real, and finally realized that sin is a choice. Heck, I heard on Oprah the other day that men who cheat on their wifes have a gene that makes them do it. Let's add them to the list of people that were made that way by God. Let's see now, we have homosexuals, pedifiles, and now men who cheat on their wives. No accountability; they are all victims made that way by God? To God they will answer. Sin is sin, and the more we induldge the further we stray from our maker, wether it be lying, stealing, drunkeness, or homosexuality. The X-gay people I know left the lifestyle because they wanted a closer relationship with Jesus. This is what they chose. Mike

That's why they call it "practicing" medicine. Somebody please let me know when they get it right. I'll do my best to stay away until then. Q: What do you call a medical student that graduates at the bottom of his class? Ans: Doctor. Mike