Becker

You guys will probably like this one!!! Some of you might have seen it before. Regardless it's a Monster!!!

Find the food and you'll find the bears!!!

I have a customer that claims that we have Coues Deer, Mule Deer, Whitetail (They aint no coues, big as a mule deer, top of the shoulders were above the top strand on a fire wire fence!!!), and Fan-tails!!! Too funny. I am a lumper the same as IA Born. You would think that being in the taxidermy trade we would have seen one of these fan-tails, or whatever else everyone calls these so called subspecies of deer. To me I think its all Coues Deer here in AZ and NM. There are lots of variations of colors in not only the hides but in the tails. We get brown colored capes, grey capes, salt and peppered looking capes, light, dark. They are just like people. We all look a little different! I have seen pictures of odd looking small deer and I think Jim H. at G and H explained that there is some dwarfism type genes that can cause smaller deer. I had one gentle man bring in one of the tiniest typical coues deer racks I have ever seen. He swore up and down it was a Fan-tail. Couldn't believe how big it was for a fan tail. Reality is it was just a very young coues with some good genetics. Jim Reynolds has some tiny three point sheds that are real similar to what this buck was. Next time your out looking at a group of bucks pay attention to the tails. Some are really red down the top, others more grey, some even a little black looking. Same reason I have dark brown hair on my head and my wife has blonde hair! My 2 cents.

where are you located?

Maybe you like this one better sjvcon??? He looks a little bigger in this pic!

Yeah they do regress, but a bigger factor up there is moister. Depending on who you talk with there are different ideas about what makes them grow big and when but some of those bucks fluctuate amazing amounts of antler. Some bucks that were 220 ish on a good year can be only 180 on a bad year!!!

Two big Coues bucks!!!

AHAHAHA, Hope you weren't expecting some monster!!!

sjvcon I think this is the buck you were shown pics of. this might be the next year but doesn't really matter!!! And this is a pic of the 50 in velvet, grossed over 250 inches!!!

Yes a couple of years ago the Big Bucks in 13A got slaughtered. It was unreal. I don't remember how many over 200 were killed but it was a ton. That is the one major reason why A has been a little on the down side the last couple of years vs B. The upper age class simply got wiped out!!! A couple of the bucks taken include one nick named the 50 (you can see video of it on muley crazy). I think he was over 40 wide. A nasty non-typical nick named NASTY JACK or something like that. A super wide buck nick named T-BONE or MOOSE that I believe was also 40 wide. Almost all the 13A celebs got whacked. sjvcon, The buck you are most likely talking about has been nicknamed the KING. He usually lives on the park and only, and very rarely does he come off to water when it gets dry up there. The one year he was absolutely huge but the last two years he was been down like 30 to 40 inches or something crazy. It was mentioned bucks moving back and forth from A to B. Only a very few do and those are the ones that live right on the border of the two units anyways. Generally speaking the strip is at a low enough altitude that it doesn't get enough snow for long enough periods to cause the deer to migrate. Yes there are some big tall mountains where it can happen, but for the most part, the deer are year round residents. Now bucks might go 10 miles to rut but thats a different ball game compared to migrations and what not. This year is shaping up to be an awesome year up there. One of the auction tag holders for the 2012-13 season just killed a buck that is said to gross 276 before his tag expired. You can see pics on mossback's facebook i think is where I was looking at them. B is going to outshine A this year again. B grew some giants this year and quite a few 220+ deer. A is going to be about the same. Only a handful of 190 to 215's!!! That being said those are still MONSTER BUCKS, but its the strip and everyone's idea there is a bit skewed of what a BIG Buck is.

TAke that back looks like on line they are wildgame innovations. Don't know retail price but you might check it out if your looking

I heard Costco had some motion cams going for 100 bucks. Stealth cams retail $170 or something like that while we are talking about good camera deals. Haven't checked it out myself but its from a good source!!!

Be careful with them mad momma deer when calling this time of year. I once had a Coues doe come all they way in and actually front kick me a few times!!! BWHAHAHA Wish we had brought a video camera that day. Never laughed so hard in my life!!!! MAN she was mad.

As heat said, you have to have a guide license to guide. BUT You also have to have permits for the different agencies depending on what land you plan to be hunting. FS or BLM lands all require a permit in order to guide on them. Last I knew the only land you don't need permits for is state land, but I am not up and up on the rules anymore. They also require you to have insurance (liability). So I would be careful. Most legit guides are charging anywhere from 2500 to 4500 dollars for guided coues hunts. I know a few that do day rate stuff, but they have to cover their bottom lines with all the required permitting so it stacks up quick. I know guys that piggie back off others permits but they still have to buy into the permits soooo.....I'd be hesitant and make sure he has all the right paperwork. Although I'm not sure if caught if any of the blame would actually fall on you. Most likely they would go after your buddy. Maybe some others can expound some more there.

Most of the deer population in 13A is crammed down in the south west corner. Maybe half to two thirds is flat antelope country. Occasionally you see deer way out there but very rare. There are a few pockets out there that occasionally hold deer but its a gamble.

HuntJunkie mentioned this under the backpacking Arizona thread and I figured I would just start a new thread all about packs. I know there has been a few pack threads but I would like to get a more broad based over view of what everyone is using vs a brand specific thread. I have used badlands and eberlestock and a few other hunting packs. Currently I have an eberlestock dragon fly but it is finally falling apart. I know they have a warranty but my problem lately is the overall weight of these hunting packs. In order to get the size and options that I am looking for the packs are upwards of 9 lbs empty! Like others have mentioned I have, Well I wouldn't say a ton of gear, but my hunting gear is heavy. Binos, scopes, tripods, and guns add up fast! I am currently looking at the Kifaru packs, specifically the timberline models. They have a 1, 2, and 3. I am interested in the middle version. Now to my questions I guess. Have any of you dropped the money and tried these Kifarus. Every review I have read lately seems to either be, "I would never spend that money on a pack", or else "Best thing I ever spent money on". Also seems most of the reviews lean towards a guy that helped design the pack so obviously he is going to rant and rave about it. So anyone have a kifaru??? And what other brands are you using and what are your pros and cons. My other thought was looking into so called "backpacking" packs, vs packs made for "hunting".

I agree with all but #4 on Heats list. At least if we are talking about the strip. Which in most if not all assumptions means 13A and 13B. The Kiabab has migrations but is in most circles not considered the strip. The big deer are a result of management. The Kiabab would produce more and most likely even bigger deer. However the tag numbers prevent the majority of them from reaching that age class. If my memory is right, the deer genetics on the strip are a result of transplanting deer there from the Kiabab. Very few deer taken allow for old bucks and thusly BIG Antlers!

RPH, Do you use your bino's when spot lighting??? You can tell a lot more about what you are looking at, and see a ton farther if you use your binoculars. Sit them on top of the spot light as a rest so you look right where the light is shinning. If you already use this technique sorry but figured I would offer it up.

Still a little too early to tell. Also hard to get a good idea of whats going on just from the back. You can't tell if he is going to grow G3's or how long his main beams are looking, but with those eyeguards he is off to a good start!!! They still have a month or more of growing time still!!!

Love the Sabino Canyon post. They wont even let you carry a fire arm through there anymore. At least last time I checked!!!

I have gone both routes. They are about the same time wise one way or the other. But pulling a trailer the Vegas route is much easier. The only grade to really pull is up from Mesquite to St. George but its double lane interstate, no hair pin curves and what not. Its my choice when pulling equipment.

Congrats!!! What unit?

You can't go wrong with a good ol' Leupold.

Kind of highjacking this thread but some people have mentioned this anyway, Its still sad to me that most guys think of the record books as being this big competition. The record books are meant to be a history of the animals. What they were, what they are, and what they potentially can be. They are a Record Keeping tool ! Definition of RECORD..... Noun A thing constituting a piece of evidence about the past, esp. an account of an act or occurrence kept in writing or some other permanent...: Most guys take it to competition which is human nature, but come on guys, get over yourself. Look at the bigger picture. I for one will enter every thing I kill into the RECORD book, if it makes it, no matter if its #1000 or #1. Out of respect and shear love of the animal's I harvest I think its more of a way of honoring that particular animal than thumping my chest. I wish more guys would see it that way. Its really interesting to look in the RECORD books and see what animals were taken over the years. To see animals that have stood strong in higher ends if not the top for years and years, or the new ones that pushed the upper end during my time. THATS WHAT ITS ABOUT!!!