Tines

No way.

Like I posted in another thread, IMO, the best thing they could implement that's being proposed is reducing MD permits in Southern Arizona. 33 is a gold mine for the G&F. It will be harvested to the max until they're forced to stop or slow down. They rode the "33 MD train" into the ground until they've now been forced to "stop". Well, sort of, as it's already been mentioned that the tags were potentially just shuffled around. I guess I can't complain if a few MD are saved (which I do believe is VERY important). But now we're considering more whitetail hunters in there?? So let me get this straight, we have the following hunts in 33 where a Coues deer is hunted (this is all being PROPOSED, not set in stone): -August archery- OTC -October jr's (any antlered) hunt #1- 150 permits -October general rifle hunt- 700 permits -November general hunt #1- 700 permits -November mzldr (any antlered) hunt- 200 permits -November jr's (any antlered) hunt #2- 175 permits -Late November general rifle (10 DAYS!!)- 700 permits -December rifle- 50 permits So with this in mind, from Nov 9th-Dec 9th, a full month, Coues deer will be hunted in 33. I'm all for helping the MD population out but it seems we might be doing it at the expense of some of our healthy Coues deer herds.... As for having some trophy Southern Arizona rifle MD opportunity.... That would be AWESOME!!!! But they'd need to reduce some MORE of the general permits to accommodate that hunt given it's potential success rates. And based on their decision to reduce some permits already down here, I don't see that happening anytime soon. Right now our best bet is stick and string, folks...

I realize I might be in the minority here, but I hope we'll look at ALL of the hunts affected instead of just a few that might benefit us and maybe not the wildlife in the long run. I really like the idea of reducing the general mule deer permits here in southern Arizona. That's a plus in my book! I think it will have a positive impact on the herd. HOWEVER, even though they're talking about removing the 2nd Nov mule deer hunt (225 permits I believe), they're implementing a new "any antlered deer" mzldr tag to replace it (200 permits)! They're also proposing 10 more December wt tags to bring the total to 50 for that hunt in unit 33. Don't get me started on the units ability to sustain the hunters it currently has. Seems like smoke and mirrors sometimes. Then factor in what you guys like (10 day hunts, or in this case, 3 additional days tacked on to the end of the late Nov hunt), that's another variable when considering someone who's got the December tag. When there was only one November hunt, it was nice if you had a December tag that there was almost a month in-between them. Then after "more opportunity" only 7 days in-between hunts. Now potentially only 4 days in-between hunts????? When does it end? It might not be long until we follow suit of other states' hunts when they're literally back to back. THAT 10 day hunt might be nice, but in the end it might SUCK for others (especially the wildlife). Maybe my expectations are too high...

:blink: :blink: Us eastern rednecks never learned how to spell all that good. TJ TJ, I didn't mean that. I was suggesting how crazy it would be to have ANOTHER Josh!!

"wanting us to hunt and wanting us to be successful" is two completely different things. But based on everything mentioned, we all come to the same conclusion that success rates DO play a factor- both good AND bad for us. They've got a tough job, no doubt. They can't make everyone happy. But could things be tweaked for the better?? Sure they could.

Seriously, though.....WAY COOL!!

:blink: :blink:

There are some people who use their atvs to drive cross country all over the place looking for sheds. ....And those SHOULD be cited.

He explained above that the deer IS tied to the tree to prevent the lion from dragging it off, allowing some cool pics!

My predictions, the way they currently have the hunts and tag allocation for this hunt, it won't exist for 2013. It's WAY too many tags and bulls are gonna drop like flies. Their objective will be met this year and although it might still be offered in the years following, just drastically changed. IMO.

This time of year is crazy, I agree. Almost ridiculous that we get so worked up. But we do and hopefully it won't change for my kids. But two questions to propose: How does the G and F benefit from posting results BEFORE or DURING CC transactions? Seems counter-intuitive. And second, would there be any LESS applicants year after year if our CCs were hit a week or so before the draw and we knew the "results" prior to the official result? Just thinking out loud

Guess that's what I figured.

Maybe I don't quite understand, but how can they check for sufficient funds on a cc or debit card without charging them? That's probably what you mean?? Thanks

330"

More importantly.....Duke lost yesterday in the first round!

...embarrassing

Awesome picture! Andy's the only person I know who has more cameras out than he can remember. If he's sketchy about the location he likely could be telling the truth!

I think it varies, depending on character, but the calculations I came up with was about $4 an inch of antler. That might be high for some but that's the average of a couple I looked into. Congrats again on an absolute BEAST!!

Just when I thought California couldn't be any more irrational....

View the full article That was one of the coolest things I've seen in a LONG time!!!

Almost a year ago I helped a good buddy take a true trophy desert buck. It was a good time to say the least. Here we are, almost a year to the date and he helps me take mine. Awesome! Here are some more VERY interesting facts behind both of these hunts.... -My back was hurt last year and I almost didn't make it out to help him. -His back is hurt this year and he almost didn't make it out to help me. -Both bucks were by themselves, on the same ridgeline. -We started from the same hill this year. -We ended up with my buck dead less than 300 yds from where his buck died. -We both shot Rage broadheads. -Both hits were "marginal" but both bucks went an average of 150yds and died VERY FAST. -I shot my buck in a tiny saddle in some small hills. -When we first found Mark's buck last year, he was LITERALLY standing 10 yards from the saddle where I shot my buck this year. But Mark's buck moved another 75 yds to where Mark stuck him. So our bucks were both shot about 60-70 yards from eachother, almost a full year later... Sorry, but that's just CRAZY ODDS if you ask me! Okay, onto the bucks. Mark finally gave me the okay to post his buck as he thought it was a cool story combined with mine. His buck is one of the coolest and biggest desert bucks I've seen. His mass is unbelievable! When we first laid eyes on him that's what we first noticed. Nothing else mattered. Mark shot his buck at 55yds. The buck went about 100yds and laid down. He didn't last long... Congrats again on a true desert monarch. In several months I'll know how painful it was to wait a year to hunt :( . I found my buck about 600yds off before sun-up. He moved in closer to about 400yds. We lost the buck down low but I took off in the direction he was heading, hoping to cut him off. I got where I thought he might be and waited it out, just taking the chance he'd wander through within the small windows I had to shoot. Nothing. A few minutes later I moved up a small draw thinking he might have gotten ahead of me. As I slowly worked my way up the draw, there he was, 35yds away, staring at me. I had the sun and wind in my favor and arrow nocked as I somewhat anticipated this. His head was behind a cholla cactus although I knew he was watching me. I drew, stepped to the side, settled in and shot. He spun to the left but the arrow hit him mid body, angling back. I knew it wasn't the greatest hit but I hoped it was at least liver. We got on a high point to look for him and gave the buck 2hrs. After the wait, we headed down to the blood trail to see what we had. I got about 18-20" of penetration as I found the rest of my arrow broken off. Blood was good at first but then became sparse. That always SUCKS!! It finally picked up about 20yds later. It was an obvious death run as several cholla and prickly pear patches were being bowled over. He bled A LOT!!! We followed great blood for about 100 more yards and there he was. I was pretty ecstatic! Honestly, I don't like blood trails. Just when you think you'll find them around the next tree, sometimes you don't. It was refreshing to have one work in your favor. He was stiff, dead about 1 hr and maybe 58 minutes. :lol: Thanks for looking and best of luck to those still hunting! I guess the Coues deer will have a break from me this year. CRAP!!! Or should I say "CARP!!!"?

Chris, If I draw a bull tag, treestands are the least of my worries. No doubt that with certain "trophy tags" comes some pretty ridiculous actions in the field. You're in for a treat this year or next. But it doesn't change MY thoughts on whether or not I'd sit in someone else's stand because it "was there". It's not mine and it would never cross my mind. If you're asking me if I think a stand or blind claims a waterhole or trail, NO WAY! There are practical ways to look at this. Ways we all know, yet some choose to ignore.

Fact 1. I agree. It is all that needs to be stated (IMO) and don't understand why we need to go any further than that. Fact 2 is a given. Unfortunately, that is. Facts 3 and 4 are moot points. ESPECIALLY considering they're "not enforced", as you mentioned. If we really want to go down those slippery slopes I can guarantee that it won't help our general cause in the end. It's a technicality that doesn't seem to support anything but an ulterior motive and personal agenda. It's distracting. I'm not saying we can't speak our minds. I'm only saying we've got to be reasonable with our judgments and insinuations. Fact 5- I WILL draw a bull tag this year!

Well deserved. A few of us know how hard you've worked for a buck like that. HUGE congrats! Some big time karma right there....

I think honesty IS the issue. As the current system goes forward, you can basically do exactly what you mentioned and STILL carry around an archery tag. But since the simple definition of honesty is butchered so badly these days, there are and SHOULD be certain black and whites to curtail these things. When I mentioned "minor thought" going into this, I was implying that the G and F would give it more thought than "even if it's your fifth duplicate tag, you're eligable for a leftover!". Those at the game and Fish know of the loop-holes in the current system. Do they get 100% participation in the current mandatory archery harvest reporting? No they don't. But they factor that in and anyone who chooses NOT to report their harvest has one more thing to "worry" about other than their conscience. There are some BRILLIANT minds in the hunting community. It would do the dept some serious good to actually consider some of the basic ideas that are started around a campfire or in the cab of a pickup truck full of "rednecks".