.270

trying to box us into a corner. where do they get their numbers? how did they gather the data? don't anyone be fooled. as soon as they get ya to agree to this then they'll decide that whatever metal you're using is even more dangerous than lead. it has nothing to do with saving the birds. it has everything to do with prying us off the land. Lark.

what's the big deal? they had rifles. when we go after lions we take turns bein' bait and just use spears. there used to be a website of a guy shooting hippos at point blank range. probly still there. he was nuts. Lark.

ok, who got the dead cat? i wanted it too. did somebody get offended? i saw one guy that didn't like it had a dead cat on his avatar. oh well. if anyone else has a dead cat, let me know. Lark.

all i can add where to not go. don't take anything to that joker that mounted tam's lion. Lark.

wow, i have let myself go to heck. what are my bids on the thong? it's lined with hair on porkypine hide. Lark.

i know one thing, there ain't no way you could get mud poured or trees trimmed this week. Lark.

don't tease me. where is it? Lark.

that ain't a pre 64. the .225 is a semi rimmed case. not quite like a rimmed case like a .30/30 and not quite rimless like almost everything else. they shoot well and would be a great falling block cartridge or double rifle. the are comparable to a .22/.250 or a swift. be a nice gun to have and they aren't going to make them anymore, so it is rare. looks to be in good shape, but i don't need one. Lark.

it is now officially legal to be an illegal alien. and illegal aliens now have more rights than natural born citizens. why would anybody want to be a legal resident? if you are you have to be able to prove your residency. if you're here illegally, you don't. this is really a hard thing to comprehend. Lark.

paper today said obama is going to be on the commie show the view and can't make it to the boys scout jamboree. oh well, it's only the 100th anniversary of the BSA. ain't like it's a special deal or anything. what a commie. bet he'd go to the muslime terrorist boys jihad jamboree or a hitler youth reunion. oh well, a friend of mine's kid is there and his ol' man almost didn't send him because they said obama was gonna be there. Lark.

gut it, skin it, cut it up the best you can and pack it out. the goal is to get it cooled down. not neccessarily cold. cold is good, but from the scenario, ain't practical. get the body heat out of it. i've killed bucks in some pretty hot weather and never lost even a part of one. just take the best care you can until you can get it on ice. not in ice, on ice. don't let the meat get waterlogged. main thing is to be serious about taking care of it. you'll be ok. i think that most folks that say they don't like deer and elk because it's "gamey" are actually tryin' to eat something they let spoil. Lark.

i don't own one of the newest ones, but have several of the new havens. haven't had a bit of trouble with them. they are still a pretty well made rifle. anything made with the full length extractor seem to be well built rifles. the ones with the little clip extractor, i wouldn't own one. the new ones made in sc seem to be nice rifles, but they still have the same bolt as their immediate predecessor. i hoped they were going to go back to something like the original pre 64's. i have a .264 and .300 that i shoot a lot and both have been real good. shot the barrel outta the .300 and had to have it replaced, but that ain't the guns fault. Lark.

just one of the many reasons that i like model 70's. most safetys are a trigger safety. when it is on safe the firing pin is live and the safety only blocks the trigger. as long as everything is fine, they work ok. get a little dust in the trigger in the right place, and this can happen. i've seen this happen with quite a few remington 700's over years. saw one that would fire everytime you closed the bolt, because of a little dust in the trigger. a model 70 safety is on the bolt and blocks the firing pin. actually what it does is it cams the firing pin back when on safe. all the way back the firing pin is blocked and the bolt is locked. half way forward, firing pin is blocked but you can open the bolt. all the way forward and it's hot. i see a lot of guys talking up the savages, and they are ok, but there is a reason they cost a lot less than other rifles. a trigger safety is one of em. the 2 piece bolt they have has always scared me. seen a couple of them break the pin and the bolt head falls off. one thing a guy always needs to do is cycle his rifle with no ammo in it every once in awhile to make sure things are ok. and always keep that trigger clean. Lark.

lucky beans. sheesh whatta buncha maroons. glad i ain't superstitious, knock on wood. Lark.

hey, you're the one with the dad uncle granpa. i was just worryin' about you mere mortals bein' able to handle kick. my oldest son had a tikka in ,270 wsm. it barked him pretty hard. he put a simms on it and it seemed to smooth it our ok. actually, after you have a complete prosthetic shoulder installed, like i did, you notice recoil. my .300 has a brake and a simms and it is calmed way down. but when i need to do a lot of shooting, like in a sight in, i take my youngest boy with me to take the most part of the beatin'. after he gets it close, then i finish it off. now shut up and get to practicin' that banjo. you got a family reunion comin' up and you ain't got a chance at all o' gettin' a girlfriend there if you can't play oh susanna. Lark.

i'd get the winchester but if i wanted a .300 i'd go with the ol' win mag, instead of the short mag. tikka's are ok rifles, but the ones i've been around are really light and have a real feroscious kick. a simms will settle em down quite a bit, but they still hammer ya. i like the wincheter action a lot better than the rikka. h e l l, i like the winchester better than any of em. Lark.

#1 burger house. #2 taco bell. Lark.

as long as the action, especially the bolt, is reasonably right, you should be able to shoot anything you want in it. contrary to the old cartridge designations, the 94 was always made to shoot only smokeless powder. i use 125 grain hollowpoints in mine. i reload them but you can find factory loads. they are a lot flatter shooting than the 170's and 150's. you have a heck of an heirloom there. take care of it. Lark.

i guess i'm wierd because i would rather fight an enemy than kiss his butt. a lot of people use the outdoors. its a real long list. hunters, anglers, ranchers, farmers, hikers, bikers, trail riders, campers, bird watchers, off roaders, prospectors, etc, etc. and then there are many different divisions of each type on the list. but for the most part, they all get along fairly well. at the very least, they tolerate each other and in a lot of ways get along very well and support each other. most folks fall in to more than one category. and anti hunters hate em all. they might let hikers and bird watchers exist if they had to, but they would do away with every other person that likes to enjoy the outdoors, literally, if they could. they don't use science, they don't use reason, they only use hate. they hate anyone who doesn't have their view. i don't think it's a good thing to appease them in anyway. and it is really aggravating to hear the azgfd talk about increasing opportunity when they do things like take away 25% of a season to kiss up to somebody that would like to shoot us all behind the ear. and the question about shooting a young lion. if it's legal, it's fine with me. legal=ethical. i will support anyone using the outdoors legally. Lark.

somebody shot a rocky on the mountain. anybody see any shifty characters over the 4th? wonder if it was one of em that hangs out in the road by wildcat? Lark. http://www.wmicentral.com/site/news.cfm?ne...05964&rfi=6

mr johnathon, that isn't my opinion, that is what i was told on the phone and in writing, many times, by a game biologist that was doing a survey on lions on the strip. go back and look up the hunts. they had to completely do away with deer hunting on the strip for awhile. then when they started again there were only 30 permits for several years. for whatever reason, the lion population got to a critical stage and they literally ate their way outta house and home. the biologist tried to get the game and fish to allow non resident outfitters north of the grand canyon and to have a 2 lion limit to entice folks to hunt there. at the time non resident outfitters couldn't get a license in Az and with the location of the strip being a lot closer to residents of utah and nevada, he felt they should allow them. he also wanted a 2 lion limit to further entice folks to hunt there and so that they would be able to shoot more lions. the funny thing about the deal was that this biologist was more concerned about the welfare of the lions than he was the deer. he wanted a buncha lions shot, so the deer herd would come back, so the lions would have something to eat and hopefully things would stabilize. he hired a lion hunter to catch lions for him to study. he said that almost everyone they caught was in poor health and underweight. some were very ill and couldn't even climb a tree. from what he said it was a pretty sad deal. these guys were real concerned about it. this has been over 20 years ago and i can't remember for sure but i think that the azgfd finally did allow the nonresident outfitters and the 2 lion limit. but it was after the damage had been done. i don't just spout off crap. i might real opinionated but i ain't gonna lie about stuff. i contacted these guys because i'd heard about the excess lions and wanted to take a trip and do some hunting. the biologist also told me he was actively looking for another job because he was pretty tired of talking to deaf ears. don't know if he ever found one or not. i'm not about to print his name either. you ever hear of ted riggs? he knew a "little" about the strip. he had been raising heck about lions and coyotes on the strip for years before this. but i guess maybe ted didnn't know what he was talking about either. the strip lion problem is very well documented and anyone who knows the strip knows what it did to it. bad deal. i don't have a problem with lions. not one. they are incredibly adaptable and sneaky. you're not gonna kill em all unless you pave the state. i have a problem with the azgfd taking away opportunity from the guys that pay the bills in order to make nice with the enemy. and there was back room deals involved in this loss of opportunity. and what clb said is about as anti hunter as anything i've ever read here. completely irresponsible. hold on, the jags are next. Lark.

few men have spent more time in the saddle trailing hounds. don't keep hounds anymore, but did for decades. i've raised and trained hundreds of hounds. treed many lions. and bears and bobcats and coons. i've also called em in, jumped em and shot em and trapped em. i have lion rugs i don't have room for, rolled up under the bed. skulls all over the place. this ain't some novice amatuer talkin' here. this ain't some guy that doesn't know what he's talking about. i still get after em every chance i get with folks i know. clb didn't mean if you had a tag in your pocket you were after lions. he's saying he's against anyone killing a lion unless they're with a guide or have hounds. he's an anti-hunter. he doesn't feel joe hunter has as much right to lions as others. it's BS! if he ain't he needs to back up and change his story. there are a couple guys, same guys that are gonna ruin hunting in SE Az with this jaguar crap, that got with the game and fish and got this started. don't really care what the content of the "meetings" was. heck, that one game warden on this sight said, on this sight, that the reason they did it was because some houndmen didn't want to run their dogs when it was hot. he didn't say one word about social issues or pacitying the enemy. so what if they did it to offer some olive branch to the huggers? does that make it better? and mark my words, this jaguar deal is a runaway train and if it isn't stopped now, it will snowball and cause more damage than you can imagine. over an animal that doesn't live here. back to the subject. the game and fish caved and took away 25% of the lion season from 99% of the hunters, to pacify folks that can't be pacified, and some of the houndsmen, not all of em, were in on it. this is as anti hunter as you can get without joining the sierra club or peta. hunters and anglers, the vast majority of which are just joe hunter, pay for all wildlife conservation in Az. we pay for taking care of everything. anti hunters don't contribute anything. but they "ALWAYS" get preference over the guys paying the bills. EVERY TIME!!!! they never have to give up anything. just the guys paying the bills. back in the 80's the lion population on the strip got so high that they killed all the deer and the lions started starving. there wasn't even a deer season, not one dang tag, for quite awhile, because the deer population got so low. the strip. the holyland of mule deer, was wiped out and it will never recover. because the azgfd sat there and watched it happen and they didn't step in until the lions started starving. and that's a fact. they keep saying increased opportunity and they took 25% of the lion season away from 99% of the hunters for no good reason. think about that for a minute. what are ya gonna do when they do it to deer or elk or any other critter because they wanna make somebody that hates their guts not hate em so bad? what are ya gonna do? the nra take a lotta crap because they have a zero tolerande attitude toward any kind of firearm restrction. does joe public need assault rifles? high cap magazines? night vision? machine guns? do they? no, they don't need them. but they want them. and the nra doesn't budge when anyone tries to take that right away. they don't give out olive branches. they don't negotiate with the enemy. that's the way it should be and that's the way the azgfd should be when it comes to taking from the guys paying the bills and giving to guys that hate us. you can't negotiate with someone that hates ya. this is a sign of pure weakness and it is something we'll never get back. you can argue all you want, this is a bad deal for hunters. no biology involved, no conservation reason, no reason as far as the lions. it is just to pacify the rabid dog that is already biting you. lions are a special animal. most everyone that hunts has walked right by one and never knew it. they are a real efficient killer. i think they're really a cool animal. my hunting style is based on what i've learned from lions. i dang sure don't hate em and i think everyone oughta shoot at least one sometime. even if it's by accident. but i really disagree with taking away opportunities from the guys paying the bills. it's pure BS and we shouldn't tolerate it. Lark.

if it has, or has had a scope on it, it probably doesn't have the spatula safety. they're probably all under 10,000. i always thought it was a neat concept, because when you pull up the rifle you are automatically told it's on safety because you can't see the sights. i have several .270's in several different models. fine rifles. model 70's are wierd as far as their worth. you see very few for sale at the gunshows anymore. and when you do they're all over the place on the price. if it happened to be a super grade or something like that, they are really high. Lark.

i try real hard to not attack anyone on this site, but that has to be one of the stupidest comments i've ever seen here. so the only guys that can shoot lions are guys out there with dogs? is that what you're saying? i'll give ya a chance to recant that before ya get buried. if a guy with hounds has a deer tag and it's season, he's welcome to shoot one. just like a guy hunting pigs that has a lion tag. i know all about what happened. most of it didn't take place in the meetting, but behind closed doors. Az. has such a lion problem, and it is a problem, that they allow a lion a day in a lot of units, trying to get a bunch of em shot. and then they go and do this. the guys that are for this are for themselves. how many more lions will be shot in the months the season is closed? not very dang many. but it is pure bull for the azgfd to take 25% of the season away from 99% of the hunters in order to placate anti hunters and outfitters. again, that is a jackass comment. i guess you feel like you can't shoot a coyote unless you're coyote hunting. if you call in a fox when you're trying to call in a coyote do you let it run? or, if you see a lion, are you gonna not shoot it? again, stupid comment. everyone that hunts should be offended by your comment. Lark.

anybody that this didn't piss off is an anti hunter. several of the hound guys were all for it and were the ones that led the charge. a game warden on this sight, after i challenged him about it, said that the "lion hunters" didn't want to run their dogs when it was so they changed it. who cares? if they don't want to run their hounds when it's hot there ain't a law that says they have to. it's too hard to catch a lion when it's hot and dry anyway. but don't take 25% of the season away from the other 99% of the guys that would love to get a lion. so ya wait your whole life to see a lion and then when ya do, ya can't shoot it because some anti hunter might complain or because outfitter doesn't want you shooting lions he might be able to catch for a client later on. the lion hunters are the guys that buy tags, not just the couple dozen guys with hounds. it all boils down to the fact that the azgfd took 25% of the lion season away from 99% of the hunters. who kills the most lions in this state? i'll tell ya. guys hunting deer, elk, javelina, varmint hunters. guys out killing some time in the hills. guys looking for antlers. folks just getting out of town. the azgfd talks this big story about increased opportunity and then they go do something as stupid as this. all to pacify a couple guys with hounds and anti hunters. every time the azgfd makes a decision the only people it ever hurts is hunters and anglers. it never hurts the antis and huggers. it's always "bend over fellers, the huggers need a little pacifyin' and the only way we can do it is to screw you guys. but please keep buying tags and supporting the cause. even these @$$holes just cost us money, we gotta keep em happy." Lark.