HillBilly_Al

Hi F_H, Glad you replied... it all makes sense now that he was bedded down with his head back. Only one side of the jaw was shattered and half the tounge, So the angle of the shot must have passed out and just barely clipped him in the top middle of the back. That was the piece of skin and hair you found. I would say that unless you had a a calm spot in the wind that day, you can blame your trajectory on the wind that was blowing that day. It's often hard to tell what is happening 300 yds away in those hills and canyons. Don't get me wrong, he is a decent buck, a little bigger than a lot of the "basket racks" you see, but no where near the big one that got away. I'm happy and he sure tastes good, moreso than many of those corn fed Easters I am used to. Did you ever get a look at the big buck hanging around the area we were hunting? If not he may still be there - I hope. I also am glad you didn't get your hair raised at the 'kid' remark - anyone under 40 seems like a kid to me these days - guess that makes me an old geezer huh? Speaking of which... I wonder if the other 2 campers got anything the rest of the week. Take care and good luck - maybe we'll run into each other again. Al

Sounds like the day turned out good for both of you. It's always a thrill to look up and be surprised a deer you hadn't seen steps into view. Good Job Al

This is an accounting of my first hunting trip in Arizona, my first Coues and an unforgettable experience. Sorry it is a long post, but a lot happened in 4 days. First I would like to thank all of you for your help, Amanda for this website and everyones unshelfish sharing of information, especially Chef. Thanks, ya'll made my hunt successful. My tag was for Unit 35A outside of Ft. Huachuca. I did a lot of scouting of trails leading up to the hunt date in order to pick a place to camp and hunt. When the time came, I had planned to start in one area and every couple of days move to a new location if things didn't seem promising. As it turned out I spent my entire 4 days in one area. Thursday the 11th I packed my Jeep and went to my first spot on the west side of the Huachucas. There were a couple of friendly old timers also camping there and advised me of the high UDA traffic in the area. I took their advice and set up camp near them instead of at the end of the 4x4 road (nearer to the hunt area) like I had originally planned. (Jack&Terry... if you are on here say howdy). Up before dawn, my first day didn't produce any deer sighings but did alter my hunt outcome and provided an experience I will never forget. As you know, there are numerous UDA and drug smuggler trails in this area, the extent was not apparant to me until I got off the road and saw how the hills are litterly covered with well beaten trails and trash everywhere. About 11am that first day, I was taking one of these trails back to my Jeep when I discovered a body laying under a tree alongside the trail. At first I thought the person was asleep, but quickly noticed the purple and blue color of the legs and feet. I'll skip the other details. The persons belongings were scattered about on the trail as if someone had pilfered through her stuff. Although well armed, I was wary that there might be others around, and not knowing what the circumstances of her being there were, I didn't waste time getting out of the area. I took a GPS coorinate of the location and hurried back to my rig. Along the way I slipped on loose rocks and fell, smacking my vintage Husquvarna on rocks, putting a noticable ding in my stock and scratching the bluing on the barrel. The scope also took a hard knock. I then drove out to a point on 83 where I could use my cell to call the Sheriff and the BP. That night it was cold. It took several hours for the authorities to extract the body and I don't envy the job those officers had to do in order to bring her body out, in the dark, in very rough terrain. I don't think the Border Patrol Officers get enough credit for the fine job they do. The next day I parked my Jeep in the same area. I had not gone 200 yards when I looked up at the first hill, and there stood a true monster Whitetail broadside, just looking at me. Now I know you all are saying... yeah, sure, uh-huh... well I have a couple of Eastern 6 & 8 point racks on my wall that measure 19"-20" between beams, and this guy would be right at home up there with them. He was only 130 yards away and looked so big I first though he was a Muley. I carefully checked the color, markings, horns, size and tail (what I could see of it from the side) and yup this was a trophy buck with a classic broadside shot. I moved slowly and sat down on the ground with my left knee up taking a solid sitting position with the cross hairs just behind the shoulder. I remembered that I had sighted in for 2" high at 100 yd and slowed my breathing being concious not to jerk the trigger... The shot was crisp and the miss was clean!! I quickly followed up with a Hail Mary shot but he was gone in an instant. I spent an hour covering that hillside looking for blood or some sign I had hit him. I couldn't believe I had missed such an easy shot! Talk about being mad !! - this caused me to drive 50 miles to the nearest range to find out my scope had been knocked out 8" left at 100yds! I re-sighted in and stopped at home to pick up a second rifle... just in case! The next day I walked up on several does and they didn't seem to pay much attention to me. A group of three allowed me to get within 20 feet before lifting their tails and _walking_ into the trees. Another doe watched me walk the hillside toward her as she browsed until I was about 40 yards away. She looked at me then back at the bush she was nibbling at, grabbed a mouthfull of leaves and trotted into the wash. How dare I interrupt her breakfast! I saw her come up out of the trees about 200 yds away, taking her time. Later that morning, the wind was whipping at just under a gale. The grass was bent almost flat and taking any cross canyon shot would have been useless. I did spot a Whitetail bedded under a tree on the leeward side of the ajacent hill, but couldn't tell if it was a doe or a spike. I assumed a doe and kept moving around the hill I was on. All of a sudden, 30 feet in front of me, in a group of trees a buck jumps and runs. I got a fleeting glimpse of his massive horns and their spread. That is the big boy I saw yesterday! In an instant I can se at least 4 tines on the right side - then he is gone - into a heavily treed draw. I wait to see if he comes out the other side or up the opposite slope - nothing happens - he is gone. The rest of the day produces nothing, but about an hour before dark about 3 hills over, I hear a shot and then a couple minutes later, two more shots... I fear my monster buck has fallen to another hunter. I make it back to camp, by 7pm the other hunter still hasn't come out and I am now sure he is gutting and dragging out my big buck! Monday is my 4th day hunting the same area. I have decided that this will be the last day here if nothing develops. One other hunter took a forked horn the first day and that guy in the red Jimmy must have gotten 'ol granddaddy. I took a new trail back behind the hills I had been hunting. I pushed further up the mountain and deeper into the hills searching for the big score. I saw 2 Illegals come over the next hill. They didn't see me at first. I kept walking along the topo at about the 5800'line. Eventually they spotted me and scurried up a steep hill and over the crest out of sight. At one point I could see my Jeep parked in the distance... and next to it was that red Jimmy... I knew he had missed! I glassed the surrounding hills and finally spotted him sitting on one. The rest of the day was tiring, walking a lot of rocky slopes, gusting winds, rain and sleet and no deer anywhere. I went back to camp about 1pm exhausted and wondering if I would go out for the evening hunt. After a little while, the red Jimmy came driving out and I stop the hunter to jaw awhile. Mainly I am interested in finding out how big a buck he shot at the day before and if he hit it... heh heh. After a little conversation it comes out that he shot at an average 3x3 and thinks he grazed it because he found a chunk of hair and skin. He couldn't find a blood trail and never did find it. Woopie !!!! MY monster was still out there and undiscovered!!!! This fact bred new life into my tired feet - for about 3 minutes! I then decided that for the afternoon I would go sit by the nearby wash that had a little water in it - actually the only water anything nearby had in it. I parked my butt under a tree and started eating a summer sausage and crackers until I was full. I decided to close my eyes and enjoy the warm sunny late afternoon. WAIT... I told myself - your not out here on a picnic wake up!!! As I opened my eyes I saw this little buck walk into the clearing 65 yards away! He wasn't the monster I had been persuing the last 3 days, but he was a legal deer! I was watching him and trying to decide if I should take him or keep looking for Mr. Big when I noticed his strange behavior. He was putting his face down into the water and moving his head side to side slowly. I looked through my binoculars and saw that this was the deer the young fella had described shooting at the day before. The one thing left out of the story, that he wasn't aware of, was that he had hit him in the lower jaw and tongue. This poor buck was trying to drink with his jaw hanging down and tongue half severed and hanging by a thread of skin. I immediatly knew what I had to do, this animal couldn't leave the area to die suffering under some bush. I squeezed the trigger and he never knew what hit him as the 110 grain .270 exploded his heart. It was the kids buck all right, as there was a bullet grazed across the top of his back where a chunk of skin and hair were missing. Another inch lower and he would have severed the spine and gotten this buck. This was one hunt I will never forget, nor that monster White tail that is still out there... HillBilly Al

Hi Chef and all, Sorry to take so long to get back - I am in Korea at the moment and will be back in 2 weeks. I hope. Labor Day weekend I packed up the Millercanyon trail and camped at the Crest trail. Yowzer what a climb! 4 miles and 3000' with 50LBs is no way to spend a weekend ifyour 55 like me (and out of shape to boot). The canyons were beautiful but nary a sign of deer of any kind. I was glassing the hillsides at dusk and dawn along with looking for tracks and scat. Nada. I did walk past an 18" rock rattler before my partner saw it - guess my hearing has gone south too as Ididn't hear the rattle and it was buzzing all the time according to my companion. AL

all right!!! two in one fell swoop - a tree hugger AND a lawyer!!

dead on the side of the road. On my way to work I wascoming around the Rt 92 Big Bend and up by Turkey Track Road there was a deer laying on the shoulder. I stopped to take a look. He was a 3x3 in velvet and all 4 legs were broken low. There was a spot on his rump that looked like where he was hit but more disturbing was the 2" round ragged exit wound in his front shoulder. He couldn't have been there more than a few hours. Not knowing what the salvage laws are here in Az I left to go to work wishing I had brought my camera. As I was leaving I saw a pickup pull over where I just left. Figure he was as curious as I was. I called AZFG to see what the rules are on salvage and was surprised to hear the only if you hit the deer can you claim it. If the driver who hit it doesn't want it or leaves the scene ther is no ability for a 3rd party to claim the meat - it just rots on the side of the road. Back in Ohio anyone could claim road kill. yeah I know this aint Ohio (thank God). They didn't say hitting it had to be the cause of death so I think I'll keep a baseball bat in the car for such occasions. On my way home I noticed the carcass was still there so I stopped again. Someone had turned it over and in doing so broken one of the tines. This time I could see the entry hole just behind the shoulder in the rib cage lung area. What a waste.

Lots of interesting comments pro and con. Back east it is mandatory but out here I can see where it might not be as necessary. I can see an alternative to be wearing a orange flagmans vest when your moving through areas with lots of hunters and when packing out but take it off when still hunting or one a stand. They are light and don't take much room in a daypack. The flagging tape has good uses too. al

Actually if you can get them to wait until sunup, you might be able to get them to form a drive.

Today I went up Brushy Canyon to the end. There were very few tracks but a few Mule deer. It had rained recently so most tracks were washed out. Most streams had running water. The road was pretty rough and had a few muddy silt holes so some sort of 4x4 and mud lug tires are highly recommended. This is really dense growth with a lot of steep slopes. Some signs of IA's but not as much as other areas. I saw about a dozen Mulies on a hillside across from me and they disappeared really fast when they made me. Nothing yet on the grey ghost. One local thinks the increased IA traffic is pushing them into other areas.

Got my tag today. I'm glad for the internet option, as I forgot & waited till the last day when a friend reminded me so after work so I went online and applied when the nearest PO is 15mi away and was closed.

I use mine all the time as it helps me verify (or not) my own estimate. I also use a ballistics table I print for the particular load I use so I can better estimate any holdover. Reading the wind is a whole nuther story. There is series of good bookletts on reading wind trigger control, sight picture and reading mirage patterns by M/Sgt James Owens (USMC ret.). These are geared for the competition shooter but what better training?

Went out this morning to look up Sunnyside Canyon. Turned in 2 IA's to BP. Saw only 2 sets of deer tracks and I think they are mules. Saw 4 Californications on a trail who were appalled I was looking for bambi. Turned around at a Ranch No-tresspassing sign even though the FS road seemed to go through. Closed a marked gate someone left open. Saw some mulies on Lone Mountain, but didn't see my quarry. There were a lot of streams with water in them and the road berm was still moist so if there were tracks they would have shown up. I did get a very interesting look from a BP agent that came along as I was glassing a hillside from a main road. He stopped and as I turned around to say HI he noticed the S&W 44 Spl on my right hip, I noticed his eyes getting excited for a moment and he almost said something but didn't, and ended up going with the howdy I offered. good cop - have a donut. As I was almost out of fuel (shoulda filled up before starting) I had to run for civilization before I could explore the "other" roads not on my map. Oh well...Next week has another end. PS- I don't consider myself in the class of the "great white hunter" so.... I'm open to the idea that if any of you local guys that are looking for a hunt partner or didn't draw a tag but want to get out in the fresh air, want to meet up and combine forces to set up a Coues camp in Nov... PM me. Al

I think in order to hunt on the Fort you have to be 1)military or 2) civilian government or 3) govt contractor. There are additional rules but I am not up on all of them yet so be sure to call as indicated.

Thanks for the tips, I have already covered most of those ideas but will retrace my steps and see what I missed. Tell me about IA's? To date I know of about 87 they have gotten in my back yard (literaly) this year. I sleep with a 44spl at my side (again literaly-not on the bed table!) yea, the well travelled trails do cause concern which is why I am thinking of busting brush to find that out of the way corner. I will tour the lower western side of this unit this weekend and then start climbing up to the wilderness area and the boundry of the Fort (hopefully those hunters will push the deer over the ridge - local rumor says there are supposed be a lot of deer on the Fort property). I am kind of reluctant to regsiter ol Betsy to be shared amonst any agency they see fit, so I will stay on this side of the mountain ,thank you very much. Do most people pitch tents or just get up early? Is orange the fasion of choice like back east or can I wear my bullwinkle hat? heh heh just joking. al PS I got a set of Nikon 10x which are pretty clear but at the phoenix show this weekend I picked up a pair of Minolta 8-20x50 zoom. They are not bad at all up to about 18x or so but at 20x they aren't sharp and clear. In addition to the forest map and topo maps I use a magellan gps that I can put markers etc and then upload to my computerized topo maps. darn I may have to get a laptop and home in on ear tags if thei gets any more hi-tech. Next thing you know we will have scopes with range finders-gps-bullet drop compensators-and real time trophy indicators all built in. Does anyone know what size cartrige belt accomodates AA batteries? I'm gonna need more of them than ammo.

Howdy All, I just found this forum and it looks like a good-un. I moved to Sierra Vista from Ohio late last year and drew a white tail tag for 35A this November. From my # it looks like there are goning to be quite a few others in the woods. Today I started scouting areas by driving 4WD trails, checking streams and troughs and glassing hillsides. Saw a lot of cows but no deer. Saw very few tracks but they might have been mulies. No scat. I plan on being out there at least one day each weekend until the season starts, so if you see a silver Jeep, stop and jaw awhile. I hope to find a place to set up a camp for a week. Although I just started looking, I'm not sure I am looking in the right areas. Today I have been south of the montazuma pass road and east of Parker Lake, in the rolling grasslands and wooded draws. Should I be looking higher up toward the steeper slopes of the mountain ridges? I am also trying to make up my mind on which gun to use. I have 243, 270, 308, & 300 WM. At first I was leaning toward the 243 since the deer are so small but now I am having a Jack O'Conner moment. This is a whole new ballgame from what I am used to so I appreciate any help you pros can offer (yes... I read the post by Rembrant). Al