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Kent... If I thought Ryan's guidelines would be the focus of the meeting, I'd show up in support of ADA, with a coffee can for 10.00 donations and my 10 spot the first in the bottom... if it's a damage control exercise and no direction, nope. John... You should really attempt to come to the ADA board meeting. Your conspiracy theories and statements are not even close to being on target. If you wish to do a service to those on this site, come to the meeting and lets have a civil discussion face to face. Regards BPJ... Kent... If Amanda or the other ADA leaders want this for the meeting, If there is still a question that SFW needs to be gone and me spending the next weeks amassing the evidence in a structural timeline for your members, then I'll do it. My presentation will take the entire meeting, I won't put the effort in if I'm cutoff after a couple minutes. If the meeting is about moving past sfw and getting back on track on some important issues... I will come with my coffee can and you can lecture me in private, I will listen, shake your hand and not even comment. Chef... I think it would be a good thing to have Kent and John meet and talk for a while before the ADA meeting. Kent... I don't have a problem meeting with John and listening. But if this is a public trial of sfw and I'm then expected to address the members, that will take a much different effort on my part to prepare, than just going and making a public showing with my 10.00 solicitation can that I support ADA'a new direction. What is the purpose of this meeting now? John and I debating or moving past sfw? honest question. I will continue to pound the sfw issue until it is not relevant and then switch gears to the next step without further thought of sfw. I'd like to address the commission on the Utah tag sell issue and see where they stand on bringing it back. Can't if we are still unsure where the orgs stand on supporting sfw and they looking over the commissions back with the review board. So it's relevant for me to know how the meeting stands before I walk in and what role I'll be playing. Kent... If this meeting is a 2072 review for the members before the board meets in the future to decide on support of azsfw, most of us are way past this. I don't think there is anything fresh to say about 2072 that hasn't been detailed here. For some reason I figured the board would listen and then make a decision before the meeting broke. I have no interest in going to a meeting not ending with a conclusion. John... I think it would be best if you and I had some time to discuss issues prior to the meeting. Amanda has my contact info. I would be willing to talk or meet earlier that day. BPJ Kent... John, if I go to the meeting I will contact you prior and we will make an arrangement... Kent... Ryan, it would probably make sense to have a couple of the board members and a couple of us anti sfw premeet before. If Amanda or Chef set it up I'm in, whether I stay for the meeting or not.

And yet, when I answered with different scenarios that I'd be willing to accommodate, even participate in support... nothing. John isn't my audience I'm reaching out to, I already know his agenda. Finally a couple of other ADA members came out, that was my agenda. And my question is still not answered... lol Kent

There's been plenty of questions asked and ignored by ADA, pretty much all of them. Something I've asked a few times is when was the dues paid to azsfw last as it is crucial in the timeline of Super PAC requalification, HB2072's swift push through at the very beginning of the legislative session in Jan, a huge election year both Nationally and locally and whether they may have the resources to continue cut off from the orgs. I've brought up a multitude of issues with no response except from the few of us passionate about the answers or John calling me a conspiracy theorist and actually misrepresenting my words as his evidence. ADA has even publicly ignored their own members that finally pushed for answers or clarification themselves. I have presented different platforms where I would be interested in attending after being challenged by John and then Chef to meet prior. Not one peep... not even an 'explicative' off. Considering lack of response on these politically charged threads by ADA and waiting 1 1/2 months to even consider a response publicly, I have no confidence that a resolution can be found in 60 mins. After all the effort/research I put into all my posts, I have to respectfully disagree that having a 2 min statement in a 60 min meeting on whether ADA should continue to support azsfw is worth my time or find solutions to the real problems. I do want to thank you Amanda and CWT for having given me a platform to speak. Good luck. Kent

We've already been blown off... Kent

Don't have a lot of time right now, but could be a reaction that the Arizona Senate Judiciary Committee passed Senate Bill 1474 by a 5 to 3 vote this last week. http://www.nraila.org/legislation/state-legislation/2012/02/arizona-senate-judiciary-committee-passes-campus-personal-protection-bill!.aspx SB 1474 would prohibit a public university, college, or community college from adopting or enforcing any policy prohibiting the lawful carry of a concealed weapon by a valid concealed permit holder, or regulating the lawful transportation or storage of a firearm on the grounds of the institution. This self-defense reform would simply enable those legally allowed by state and federal law to carry for self-defense to do so on a college or university campus. The NRA fully supports this bill as introduced, and commends the effort by the Arizona legislature to curtail an invisible and arbitrary boundary relating to where a person can lawfully carry a firearm for self-defense. Kent

This bear didn't like the camera setup and just had to adjust my camera to get his better side...

Ha! went to San Carlos on tuesday and friday... caught enough for a fry tonight with friends if we add pork sandwiches... but slow yet. Kent

Thanks Gino, figured I needed to contribute something hunting related after all the political issues I fired up... lol. This bear sequence just tickled me, animals do the strangest things. Kent

I'm not a fan of fear mongering and it's as old as religion, statistically it gets results from those that are not able to use rational thought on an issue... more of a donation producer than a vote producer, which is fine I suppose. Redman is right in that the President can't abolish the 2nd amendment. We need to win the Senate this election cycle. Our biggest danger we face with another Obama administration is the Supreme court appointees, a liberal court can do extensive damage to our 2A rights and some of our Conservative judges are hanging on as it is hoping for a GOP presidency so they can retire... it's 5 to 4 now, we'll lose the supreme court if Obama is reelected. Kent

Anyone know what time azsfw will have their statement out? This will help moving forward in the coming weeks, meetings and banquets. It's good that they are going to break their silence and have been working diligently for 10 days on their statement... Hope the HB2639 amendment issue didn't cause a delay in their 10 day time limit. Kent

The history of SFW and special tags in various states is directly related to our issue of 2072 and should be studied to understand 'ALL' the implications. The MDF/SFW partnership and the Utah Expo has also been portrayed as a justifying model of 2072 and the money it would bring to the state in attendance. Looking into that history and realizing that WHCE is benefiting from one or more of our tags, means it should be brought up as an issue. MDF's own words, aug 4 2010 in their application to the DWR for tags... The Mule Deer Foundation in conjunction with our partners SFW have raised over $15 million dollars for wildlife since 2007 when the WHCE held it's first convention in Salt Lake City. The WHCE attracts outfitters/guides, exhibitors, attendees and corporate sponsors from several countries. The economic impact to the State of Utah is tremendous. I'll repeat that... The economic impact to the State of Utah is tremendous. Besides the Utah tags, at least one of our tags contribute to their economic impact. I want that Az tag impact removed from the state of Utah and put right here in Arizona. It may upset some of the big spenders for the short term and bring less money, but it will bring more prestige/economic impact to a venue and rise back up, creating value in the tag and the economy. Kent

Hope you had a good one amigo, see ya in Quemado. Kent

I don't want ADA to fail, I want them to rise up to their potential. This azsfw issue has caught us all by surprise and we are working through it. Most of what John and I are debating relates to his affiliation with azsfwc/azsfw/sfw/super PAC/Weiers/commission review board. Because John is the ADA president that puts it in limbo... I'm just trying to push it back on the right side so we all can move forward, sometimes the truth must be spoken forcefully and harshly even to friends. Kent

Allen, it's eerie how you brought up the exact content of HB2072 5 years ago and that you asked the questions that are so relevant today. I just stumbled on the thread through googleing something different, not searching this site... when the tag fee issue came up it was relevant and bell went off so I found it again. You've got a good foresight that is needed, I'd support your candidacy... I know of you from a mutual friend, Vince... he always say's we should meet and maybe we will someday, look forward to it. Kent

Cool! I still shudder thinking of your husband sleeping wrapped up in plastic like a fish in the deli shelf.... lol Good for you guys... Kent

Your PAC money influence at work... G&F commission takes a vote and makes an official statement on HB2072 in a meeting... in less than a month there is an attempt to silence them politically. Tag Grab II... coming soon to a legislature near you... Kent

Their application for 2011 was for 200 tags. Kent

I have MDF's numbers from 2010 on Utah tags... quick count of tags was 115... their listed numbers are... 948,400.00 raised... 94,840.00 10% admin fee... 569,040.00 60% projects... 284,520.00 30% DWR Kent

No one's breaking down my door on my suggestion... I can read tealeaves... and tuesdays are one of the days I can often get away fishing, went to San Carlos today and the weather was beautiful, the fishing slow, though we did boat 9 crappie. If it's a good looking day on the 21st and the choice is fishing or some private orgs meeting... I'm going fishing. Anyway, for a suggestion. In a political sense, the orgs are in a tight spot, they either continue with SFW because of the Super PAC and legislative power it influences in this election year... or go grass roots, LARGE internet voice directly to the legislature on every important issue same as what happened with 2072. At least for this election/legislative cycle... it'll take a year or two to reorganize and build a lobby. Kent

Well, the facts are, questions were asked by concerned sportsmen over the SFW gameplan being implemented here, including tags and money being payed to the orgs from the sale... they were assured no such thing would ever happen. Quote... 2006... I know what you are saying regarding the special tags. Just look at Utah, it is ridiculous. I would fight against any system that approaches that one. Chris 2012... I encourage you to read the bill for yourself. I am confident that once you have done that, you will join me in support of this bill. -- Chris Denham Personal trust credits are hard to build and easy to lose... I know. The irony of Chris's statements 5 years apart with the steps taken by AZSFW between those times should polarize 99% of folks, org or independent... that there is no doubt in whether azsfw will not continue to represent sportsmen groups. No question first, move forward second. Kent

You sell your soul to the PAC money devil and you will be burned eventually... and you funded it. Kent

Conspiracy theorists love this stuff...

The issue of a fee paid from the sale like the Utah tags is important because. In HB2072, this was to be legislated in, overriding previous statute. H. The qualified organization shall first apply the proceeds from the resale by auction and raffle of the rights to tags to cover all costs associated with the annual sportsmen exposition in this state and any county chapter banquets at which rights to tags are auctioned or raffled. The qualified organization shall apply the remaining proceeds from the resale by auction and raffle of the rights to tags in this state for programs to achieve any of the following purposes, including the qualified organization's costs of administration: just a thought... Kent

Ryan, it would probably make sense to have a couple of the board members and a couple of us anti sfw premeet before. If Amanda or Chef set it up I'm in, whether I stay for the meeting or not. I will still continue to look at different angles of this sfw story. Stay tuned. Kent

bwakeling, appreciate the clearing up of the fee or no fee... hopefully in the future we can bring the tags back benefiting/promoting Az venues... it's a bitter taste that the MDF/SFW expo gets the benefit. John, if I go to the meeting I will contact you prior and we will make an arrangement... Probably do a pay per view and fund a jr hunt camp... Lark and Smack can be the opening bout. lol Kent