az4life

awesome character on that buck. Good choice to not let him get away for another time. Congratulations

Jet, Tam Good arguments and points made. Not surprisingly, I agree with a lot of what you both wrote. One problem that we all see is, the feds are not doing something that should be done. Protecting our borders. If the government won't take on the problem, I believe it is every citizen's responsibility to protect the borders in any way they legally can. As I am not a business owner, the impact from this new law on me is negligible. I won't hire illegals for day labor either so I am doing my part. An honorable business owner has the moral responsibility to not hire illegals, yet some do. It may not be right to penalize all business owners for an honest mistake but those that blatantly ignore the law should be severely penalized. How do we determine which is which though? That said, I realize I am advocating additional laws to force businesses to do what the government won't. That is against my belief as well. I have a deep problem with government regulation and interferrence in private sector. Every time a new mandate is created it infringes on the American Freedoms. Hundreds of arguments and opinions on this topic. As Americans, we might be forgetting that we all have a responsibility for our own welfare and to protect our country. I do not (and I am sure you do not) wait for government to put food on my table so why should I wait for them to do the right thing about illegals. IMO The slippery slope is on the government regulation not about the the clear and present danger, Illegal Immigration. We have collectively ignored the problem along with the government so now we need to come up with a solution that will not suit everyone. The Greater Good, should figure heavily in any eventual "answer". You guys and your words have given me some cause to think, and empathize with honest business owners. I still believe, No jobs, no reason to come here illegally!

Great buck and memories, no matter what the score. !

Congratulations on the 3fer.

Good way to get your first Coues! Congrats...

Great research. I agree that numbers can be filtered or slanted about any way the "seller" wants them to be. As we all know the Media does. Millions and Millions and Millions (think about that) of illegals being here don't make it right and we need to put a stop to the invasion. The best way is often a matter of opinion, but I look at what a lot of others have figured out. With No Job - They have No reason to be here. The line needs to be drawn and we have to start moving the needle in the other direction. The problem is not small, it's gotten Huge, Like a Heard of elephants. And like the man asked, How do you eat an elephant? One Bite At A Time. I'll Welcome Legal Immigrants as long as I draw breath in the USA. It's the illegals that chap my hide.

As requested, here is some info from a previous post . I'll Amend my statement to 10% figure instead of 11% even though the current estimates show an increase of 1 million per year. Whats another million or so when we are talking this many! I appreciate that you challenged me to produce my sources. Don't take the media's word for it, or mine for that matter. ------------------------------- Post from 4/11/2006 I do not have a problem with LEGAL immigrants, nor are you likely to find many US citizens who do. The fact is there are way to many illegals in the US and they are the cause of the problems. Everyone has heard the government estimate of 12 million illegal aliens here right now. Many people believe that number is actually as high as 20 million, but lets stay with the 12 million estimate and do some quick math.... These Government statistics are from 7-2006. Yes it said 7-2006. CIA - World Population 298,000,000 US population 107,000,000 Mexico population 12,000,000 is the estimated number of illegal aliens are currently in the US The estimate of OTM (Other Than Mexican) illegals in the US is less than 1 million. 11,000,000 Mexican national citizens are illegally in the US. Based on the above government statistics; An estimated 4% of the people in the United States are here illegally. In simple terms, Nearly 1 in 20 people are illegally in the US. 10.2% of the Mexican population is living Illegally in the US right now. 1 of every 10 people born in Mexico is Living Illegally in the US. Quite shocking isn't it! This is more evidence that LEGAL immigration is not the problem. I could support a guest worker program, or an increase in the legal visas granted to those wishing to come to the US, But only if we enforce our current laws. Our country was built on the rule of law. Allowing illegal immigrants to mandate new laws just because there are millions of them is just wrong, on so many levels. If we cannot enforce current laws, why would anyone think we can enforce new ones. Do not take my word for it. Google it and find your own proof. Mine was from several US Gov't websites including the CIA world info site shown above.

Like these guys said! Up to individual and as long as it's legal it is probably ethical to someone. Our "do what you wanna do" beliefs over the past few decades has created a situation where morals are in the eye of the beholder! Virtually no common ground that everyone likes.

Thanks for making my point. 49 percent of those that hire the day laborers were private citizens. These laborers make up the smallest percentage of the illegal population in the US. And yeah, they interview 2660 laborers so what would you do if you were asked who you were working for? Would you cut off your own gravy train? Then it is all in how the question was phrased and interpreted. Did you know that over 11% of everyone born in Mexico is living illegally in the US right now! Mexico is the problem They need to fix their own mess instead of encouraging everyone to jump the border. I've seen a lot of survey questions that leave anyone wondering how to answer. All these points and I could toss in a few more, but I'll leave it for now. Illegal immigration has been ignored too darn long and needs to be fixed, Muey Pronto! Legal Immigration could be looked at for improvements but not until the other problem is taken care of. People quote the $7.00 big macs as the reason to look the other way, but that's horse-spit. The market will not bear that price or Mcd's would be charging it now. I've seen big macs for 5 bucks at an airport and sports venue. Is that cause there were no illegals working there? Just another example of Free economy, supply and demand charging what the market will bear. I am sure will get by fine. Probably be better off with all the time we save not having to press 1 for english and 2 for spanish.

Hey AG, Glad to hear you did not hit the eggnog too heavy to keep priorities straight. BBgun is a good idea too. (I'd leave your new glass at home on that one though!.) Merry Christmas

You all missed it! Actually Coueswhitetail.com IS the # 1 Coues Deer website on the World Wide Web Thanks Amanda

That sucks! Whatever sub culture they belong to, their main class is Thieves! Terrible thing to have to read about stuff like this on Christmas! I have yelled at people before to scare them off from my camps when they get nosey and actually thought about lobbing a round across their bow, but it is tough to tell what is going on that far off. I guess a warning shot to let them know you are close enough to see them might be in order for white toyota pickups.

Buck fever gets all of us some time or another. Since you got the buck, you're gonnal pull though! Decent little buck with some character and Nice extra trash on that right side.

TAM You've got some good points there, (besides the ones you're holding in the picture). You guys are a lot closer to the AZ frontier on illegal immigration than I am but it's all over the country. Frankly I was floored when I saw this bill several months ago and that Mr Napoloreno had supported of it. Again, if the laws we had were enforced, on employment and immigration, we would not need another law, but sometimes the libs need ot be hit in the face with a 2x4 to see the will of the people. If there is any truth to the Rueters story, it seems some illegals are getting a message that things are about to start changing. Any way you look at it, That Cannot be a bad thing for AZ. We'll all have to wait and see!

Both articles you point out are referencing "Day Laborers" which only make up a small percentage of the total illegal population. I ahve not found anything to support those numbers for Illegal workers as a whole group. It would be interesting though to see a report that showed what % of illegals work as day laborers. This is just another prime example of the media using 1 term " day laborer" and someone equating it completely with "Illegal Immigrant" group which is not the case. Sheeple see something like this and get all fired up and go off on the wrong mission based on distorted or half truths. The media is not impartial and they try to evoke reactions (ratings) with every story they do. Slant it for the most reaction and report it with a twist, whatever they need to do to get the ratings. We all have to read what is written as fact in the media and then challenge the info. Otherwise we are all just Sheeple. Merry Christmas to all

The move may not be ideal and yes, it should be up to everyone to not hire illegals but if there must be a line drawn and this one obviously is having an effect. I don't believe posts that say "a recent study says" unless the source is quoted. Do your homework, don't just spout the party line like lemmings! Again, I will say there are a lot of bogus stories on the net, so it is up to each of us to verify sources before quoting them.

Living in AZ for most of my life dust storms come and go but a pure "White out" is not something I ever had to deal with, and sort of dismissed them as greatly exaggerated when some folks would talk about the difficult conditions. After this past week, All I can say is I believe! I believe! I was driving home from work Friday which is a normal 80-90 minute drive, but this time in the end it was over 3 hours, and I did not even expect to make it several times. When I started out it was windy but no snow, then black ice formed, combined with blowing snow and then new snowfall began. For the last 50 miles it was touch and go with the fresh and horizontal blowing snow and drifting quickly formed There were at least 20 cars off the road along the way and I did run off once myself but was able to back out and get moving again. I was not able to see the end of the hood a lot of times and kept rolling down the window to look to the side for the road edge was something I care not to do again. It's not a coues hunt or any other type of hunting trip but take this as just a word to anyone else that may have a thought about going out in white out conditions. DON"T Merry Christmas!

AG I think if you tell him you'll loan him your new optics, if he hunts by hmself, you have solved the problem Seriously, I think most of us that hunt with another person, find some level of hunting habits in them that we do not agree with. The one line that needs to be drawn, is where safety for yourself or others crosses the comfort level. If you have some level of concern for safety with him, you need to discuss it with him or find a way to not hunt with him at all. The thing is, if something happened in the future, where he actually hurt or killed someone, how would you feel? Glad it was not you that was hurt or guilty that you did not warn him about it. Just my .02

AG I guess that means you must've been a good boy this year! It sure beats a lump of coal..

That buck has a lot of character and it would have been interesting to see him in his prime! Too bad you couldn't tag that cat along with your buck. Congrats and merry Christmas

LMAO.... Good stuff Merry Christmas!

I agree about doing it yourself. I self guide, self find, self hunt, self shoot and self pack, so making the extra move to self butcher, just seems what is right. Besides, If I know I am doing the butchering myself, I'm going to take as good of care as possible of the meat before butchering. Since I had bad experiences from other butchers many years ago, I found what I do with the meat makes it taste better in most cases. Live an learn.. For the amount of meat on a coues deer, it does not make sense to pay someone 70-100 bucks to do it for you.

Ohhhh the possibilities for a caption.... This is about as clean as they get though wwweeeeeeeeee!

AAAAAAMEN

People that are raised in an urban enviroment are more likely to be acceptable of socialistic gov't programs, where as rural people are more self sufficient. It's not always the case, example - farm subsidies. dang Straight on that! I was an AZ Phx Area lifelong resident and saw that socialist slide all my life, but now that I moved to middle America the whole way of thinking is about taking care of your own needs, and then helping those who cannot do it on their own. People do not expect a government entitlement if they need something they handle it themselves. At least a LOT more than in AZ. As for deviants,, I have to say I used to work in an office where those folks were always switching partners ad trying to hook up with someone new. Seemed to grow bored easily or just enjoy the variety? They flaunt it and expect you to approve of it. Say or do anything negative and you were the villain. IMHO they know how to play victims really well! Anyway the office where I am now, I cannot say there is even 1 person out of more than 1000 that are known to be gay. I really like the change!