lancetkenyon

I can't believe you are getting rid of First Lite in my favorite camo pattern for AZ. Wish I had the funds.

And you all complain that USFW/AZGFD aren't doing anything right....sheesh! Job well done USFW!

Nice rifle, good deal. If elk results were out, this would already be gone! Bump for the OP.

18B is a big unit. I can narrow it down by saying it was near the prickly pears....

Joe "Stockdoc" Ducos can hook you up with a custom, inletted adjustable cheek piece. PM him here: http://www.scout.com/military/snipers-hide/forums/userprofile/jducos

Digital caliper or dial? Did you re-zero the caliper up against the comparator, and not fully closed? I know my Hornady comparator with bushing is 1.004" long, making that much of a difference if I don't re-zero it. Because you are not measuring the full COAL to the tip, only to where the ogive stops at the bearing surface of the bullet from the case head. So it can't be longer than COAL (Combined OverAll Length). To fit your mag length of 3.40", you have to be forgetting to re-zero your caliper when you install the comparator and bushing. Should be around 2.647"+/-. I am at 2.734" to ogive, with a COAL of 3.472". And a max mag length of 3.685". The bullet length is only .004" between the 180 Hybrid and VLD, but the bearing surface to ogive placement is probably a bit further back on he Hybrid. That is good velocity from a 25" barrel. The Retumbo is supposed to give better velocity than H1000, but a lot of people say H1000 is a bit more accurate. Your load is a good example of why you take book loads with a grain of salt. Berger book lists Retumbo with a max charge weight of 69.2 @ 2881fps from a 26" barrel. You are at a grain less charge weight, with 1" shorter barrel, and getting 40fps faster velocity. Berger COAL is 3.290" and you are at 3.385" COAL, meaning even though you are seated deeper than I am running, you are still longer than the Berger spec., meaning more case capacity available. The Hodgdon book states Retumbo starting load for the 180 VLD @ 64.4 @ 2638, and max load @ 70.8 @ 2914 in a 24" barrel. So you see an even bigger difference. 1" of barrel length should be around 30fps for the 7RM.

Must have meant 2.685" to ogive. I do the same thing all the time. I write it down, and then go back for reference and think, "No way. Must mean 2.xxx", not 3.xxx?" Thanks for the info. Glad I have a longer magazine box to start with. Here is the real question...how does it shoot? Most important factor. Accuracy over speed. But getting both is a plus.

1-4 Mule deer. 5 Coues 6 Mule deer 7-12 Coues Some darn nice bucks too. Too bad you did not see them yesterday....

If I draw an early rifle Unit 10 tag this year, I will be trying for one of the limited entry permits. Just saying. I have not hunted elk since 1999, and I want every opportunity I might have if I draw it. But, I will not be putting in for unit 10 again if I don't draw it this year.

Some BLM, some STL, some Private Property, some Town of Peoria, some Town of Morristown, some other municipal jurisdictions like Maricopa County and Yavapai County. All of these jurisdictions frown upon theft of property.

Sounds like you will fit right in here, as long as you don't mind watching a soap opera or three. Shooting, hunting and kids? You have my attention. Welcome. Just wait until your kid gets into shooting and hunting. Then the good times really begin.

Azbow, What is your blind magazine length, for reference? It would be good info to have. And your COAL, length to ogive, chamber length to lands, etc.?

^ And the complainant had no legal right to be messing with your decoys, and get the crap scared out of them in the first place.

The cartridges fit in the magazine easily. Magazine length in the Rem 700 LA is 3.685". My COAL is 3.472" with a .0200" jump. Which is weird, because a Ruger M77 LA magazine is only 3.370". So a lot of the other loads I have worked up have been around 3.355" max COAL to fit in those rifles. And with a chamber length of about 3.435" to the lands in the Ruger M77, there is a big jump to lands of .090" or so without even adjusting seating depth for the sweet spot. So the bullets are seated really deep if you want to be able to load them for mag length.

I would think a combination of a few variables. Probably a fast barrel with a tight chamber and long throat for the 168-180 VLDs. Tighter chambers allow less case expansion upon firing. Hand lapped barrels (like Bartlein, Rock Creek, Brux, etc.) have less initial resistance since they are smoothed out a bit too. My other Bartlein actually sped up after 100 rounds too. It is about 70fps faster than my initial load development when it was new. 5R rifling is SUPPPOSED to not cause as much bullet constriction/distortion since the lands and grooves are opposite from each other, not lands that are across from each other, meaning a little less resistance. Not sure on that one though, just what I have read from barrel makers that use 5R. The bullet seated long allowing more usable case capacity, meaning higher charge weights, meaning more velocity at lower pressures. Cases with less brass content meaning more case capacity. See above. The Berger Hybrids have a longer boat tail, and ogive to tip, meaning a shorter bearing surface than the VLDs or most other bullets of similar weights, meaning less friction and resistance travelling down the barrel. Longer barrel than most stock rifles. The factory barrel was 24" before, and I know all the Ruger M77 7RM barrels I have worked up loads for were 24" too. Magnum primers. Good burn ratio to barrel length? Maybe I got lucky. I was realistically expecting 2900fps, was HOPING for 2950fps, which I thought should be attainable. I just got lucky with the best node being a hot one, up in the 3000-3050fps range across 4 charge weights that are at least 1.0 to 1.5 grains lower than my rifle's max load. Should give some flexibility in conditions and pressure changes. I could go down to the 2900fps node and extend barrel life a bit, but this is a hunting rifle, not a target rifle that will see hundreds or thousands of rounds per year on it. This should last a lifetime now.

Manfrotto carbon fiber here too. With a 2 way pan head. I have a ball grip too, but the pan head is so much easier for grid covering a hillside or 5. I actually carry my tripod with legs extended quite a bit for quick set up when hiking. It is plenty tall to stand behind. But when going point A to B, I can still easily carry it on the pack to free up my hands. It can be used sitting on the ground, sitting on a stump or stool, or standing upright very easily.

The SWFA goes back on my .25-06 Ackley once I get a dedicated scope. It goes back and forth between my AR when I want to shoot long range (800-1000) steel and my Ackley when it is deer (or if I ever could draw an antelope tag) season. The Ackley gets loaned out to my older daughter when she draws a deer tag too. As for velocities and charge weight vs. the 7LRM. The 7LRM, while a different configuration, should be about the same case capacity more or less. Slightly fatter case by .015-.010", straighter walls, but .090" shorter overall body length, and .150" shorter to top of neck, but again, with no belt. It does have some better features with the 30° shoulder and .380" neck length though vs. .280" for the 7RM. Gunwerks' claim of 3100fps should definitely be possible with the 180, as long as your rifle is throated deep and you seat them out long. What is your COAL (or to ogive length)? I am at 3.4725" COAL (SAAMI calls for 3.2902" COAL), and 2.7340" (SAAMI calls for 2.5665") to ogive with the Hornady .284" bushing. Granted, SAAMI does not spec out what bullet they use for their measurements, and the 180 Hybrid is 1.529" long, a lot longer than most 140-168 bullets around 1.2-1.35" long. My 180s are seated with the base of the bullet about .030-.040" below body to shoulder junction.

What a beautiful day to go shooting. I started out at Ben Avery from 7:00-12:00. Got the new 7RM sighted in for a 200 yard zero. Also did some load development for the .300RUM, and shot a bunch with the 6.5 SLR. Then packed it up and went to my desert shooting spot for a ladder test. Since my shooting partner was working today, I didn't do my normal 600 yard ladder test. I did a 300 yard test since I had to do my own walking and target marking. Took a while to shoot two ladder tests... I have always used RL22 when working up loads for other people's 7RMs. But I have always loaded up 140-168 grain bullets. It has always given good accuracy with good velocity. But I wanted to try some H1000 for my loads, since I will be shooting the 180 Hybrids/HVLDs. So I started my loads after reviewing the Berger and Hodgdon books. I always tell people only YOUR gun can tell you what it's max load is, not a book, friend, or website. It could be below book max, or above published max. And knowing what to look and feel for signs of over pressure is vital to safely doing load development. So I started out mid way up from the Berger listed minimum, and just over minimum according to the Hodgdon book for the H1000. And started up mid-charge weight for the RL22. I am sure that my max loads are not safe in every gun out there, so use caution when doing your own load work. Start low and work up safely. My chamber is cut for the 168-180 VLDs, so longer throated than most factory rifles. Allowing me to seat the bullets out longer, gives me more case capacity for powder, meaning less pressure than SAAMI specs. I seat my bullets at .400" longer than book max COAL, leaving a lot of case space. On to some data. Conditions were 65-72° F, DA of 27.45", 1° uphill to target, 2-5mph fluctuating winds from 2-5 o'clock. Winchester once fired brass, weight sorted to within 3 grains, sized to SAAMI minimum specs (I will reset my dies to bump the shoulder .002" in this chamber now), trimmed, chamfered, primer pockets uniformed, flash holes de-burred, and annealed. Berger 180 Hybrids seated with .0200" jump to lands. CCI 250 Mag primers. RL22 or H1000. RL22 charge weights with corresponding velocities from my 25.75" 1 in 8.5" twist barrel. Charge weight/velocity 58.5 @ 2781 59.0 @ 2813 59.5 @ 2917 60.0 @ 2843 60.5 @ 2878 (Berger book max is 60.3 @ 2771 from a 26" barrel) 61.0 @ 2909 61.5 @ 2916 62.0 @ 2949 62.5 @ 2955 63.0 @ 2977 I had stopped loading at 63.0 grains, thinking I was 2.5 grains over Berger book max, and only finding a few other loads of 63.0 grains in various places. I had no signs of pressure with this load in my rifle. But I will not continue further testing at higher charge weights at this time. H1000 results 64.0 @ 2790 64.5 @ 6831 65.0 @ 2850 65.5 @ 2878 66.0 @ 2897 (Berger book max @ 66.0 @ 2830fps from a 26" barrel) 66.5 @ 2911 67.0 @ 2935 67.5 @ 2960 68.0 @ 2997 68.5 @ 3018 69.0 @ 3029 69.5 @ 3058 (Hodgdon book max 69.5C @ 2884fps from a 24" bbl, note book states compressed charge, I still had case space up to 71.0) 70.0 @ 3079 70.5 @ 3115 71.0 @ 3169 (sign of pressure, slightly sticky bolt lift, no primer flattening/cratering/extruding, no case head swipes or ejector marks) I stopped here. Here was my 3 shot sight in rounds at 300 yards. Right at .9". Not bad, .3MOA. Dots are .25" (holes are .284" obviously). These were shot with 64.0grains of H1000 @ 2793/2795/2820 fps. My H1000 ladder test target. I had a couple very distinct nodes with very little vertical dispersion. Shots 4/5/6 (2878/2897/2911fps) had almost no vertical dispersion, and shots 9/10/11/12 (2997/3018/3029/3058fps) had just over 1/4" vertical dispersion (even less if you drop shot 9). SO I will be playing with these two nodes to continue my load development. The high node would be my preference if I can get it shooting like I want, because a 180 Hybrid @ 3000+fps would be a hammer on game. That is nearly .300WM energy, with a better BC bullet. I started out .2MIL left. After shots 1&2, I adjusted .5mil right. Shot #3, then adjusted .3mil left again to shoot the rest. Disregard the holes in the bottom right corner. That is 20 shots of the 6.5 SLR pushing 140 Hybrids @ 2950fps at 300 yards to warm up. My RL22 ladder test target. No really great nodes that I saw. But when I overlay it with the H1000, the velocities at 2900-2950 (shots 7/8/9) overlapped pretty well. I will probably not pursue the RL22 loads if I can get the H1000 to shoot well. The RL22 is much less temp stable too.

.257 115 Berger do NOT need a 1 in 8" twist. Recommended twist rate is 1 in 9" according to the website, but 1 in 10" according to the book, and running it through their twist rate calculator, 1 in 9.75" is acceptable. My barrel is 1 in 10" and is crazy accurate. Also, QL Is a program that approximates max loads at SAAMI pressures and COAL. Only your gun can tell you what max pressure is. Could be lower that QL or book max, could be well above. Depends on a lot of factors that a program or book cannot take into account. That is why you need to start low and work up yourself, with knowledge of what to look for to indicate over pressure signs.

Any signs of pressure at 72 grains? Barrel length seems like 24"? How was accuracy? Seems like the .257 Weatherby should be pushing the 115 VLD faster than 3054fps. Try RL22 also. My .25-06 Ackley pushes the 115 HVLD at 3400 from a 28" barrel using 58 grains of RL22. And RL22 always gives me good velocities in 7RMs pushing 140 To 168 VLDs too. Even worked very well in my .300RUM w. 175-215 bullets. My .300RUM had a velocity spread from 2956 to 3100 pushing 210 VLDs with charge weights from 85.5 to 91.5 grains of H1000. So about 150 fps over 6 grains of charge weight difference. Right in line with your 100+fps gain over 4 grains of charge weight difference.

My scope base came today, so I got it mounted on the rifle. Seekins Precision 20MOA Picatinny rail @ 2oz.. I mounted up and bore sighted my test scope that has been passed around more than a low self-esteem cheerleader with daddy issues. SWFA 5-20x50 SS HD MIL FFP These weigh right at 30.4oz. They are built like a tank, and are rated to handle the .50BMG. If you have never seen or looked through one, they are fantastic glass for the price. Rifle now weighs 9 pounds 6 ounces with the scope/base/rings/accessories. I am heading to the range Saturday to do some shooting. I will see how 15 or 16X does at 200, as I am leaning towards the Vortex PST 4-16x50 at 22.4 oz. (dropping the rifle to 8 lbs. 10 oz.), or the Burris XTR II 4-20x50 @ 30.9 oz. (keeping it right at 9 lbs. 6 oz.). The Burris has a lot of really nice features that I prefer over the Vortex, but at an additional 8 oz.. An additional 4X of magnification, additional elevation adjustment (which I will probably never need), 10mil turrets vs. 5mil for the PST, and reticle design (Burris SCR vs. Vortex EBR-1) is a big plus too. Pros and cons, decisions, decisions.

An extra 4" of barrel length will net you 100-150fps. Meaning more energy on target. Never a bad thing. I would go with a 22" barrel minimum myself, with the preference of 24-26".

One of each. In all seriousness.... 4-16x50 Vortex Viper HS Good from 30 yards to 1000 yards 3-9x40 Vortex Diamondback. Good from 20 yards to 600+ 3-12x42 Nikon M-223. Good from 18 yards to 850+ I currently have a 5-20x50 SWFA SS HD on their now. Works from 30 yards to 1000K+. Good for putting rounds close together at 800+ too. A little too much low end magnification, but it works fine for coyotes and bunnies. I think the perfect AR scope would be a 3-15, 3-18, or even 3.5-21. Great low end for fast movers and/or close shots, but plenty of magnification for reaching out to 800-1K+. My next scope for my AR will be in this range. Then the 5-20x50 SWFA will go back on my .25-06 Ackley.

I was home sick from school, watching it on live TV. I called my Mom and Dad at work when it happened.